AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Black Powder Shooting => Topic started by: 2lookindown on May 06, 2013, 08:15:33 PM
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This is a 25 yard 5 shot group ... The rifle is "32 Cal" 1:66 " twist 34 " barrel... 34 Grains of GOEX FFFG .015 pillow ticking.... AND "JEFF TANNER ROUND BALL" molded in .319 full round ball with the spure worked down to round... I guess that aint good enough.... This is the rifle made from "APPLE" I call it "Apple Jack"
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It looks good to me! The squirrels an rabbits better look out when ya hit the woods with it. ;D
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Nice! I'm currently trying to figure out how to build a .32 cal underhammer pistol before I do me an underhammer rifle also in .32.
Hope I can get that kind of accuracy out of mine!
Thanks for sharing!
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That's a really neat rifle; and accurate, too.
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2Look,
That's a good looking group, it ought to make you competitive. My problem isn't getting a group like that, it's repeating it.
Mark
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Dutch Schulz would be proud of you. Send him a copy of that one.
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I'm no pro with the muzzle loader but that is a pretty nice group... I have not gone out past 25 yards yet but I will when I get consistent with it at 25.... I think it will kill a squirrel... ;D ;D
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knifemaker3, Dixie has a nice little paper back booklet on "The Underhammer Rifle" by Jeff Baron. Lots of designs in there. I've used it to make up 6 or so Uh guns, mostly the Hilliard type. good luck they're fun to make & fun to shoot---give that cap a nice squeeze so she won't fall off......Tom
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So how large is that group?
Or what is the diameter of the inside ring that is intact. The line just to the outside of the number 10?
John
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John, It looks like it is less than a dime...
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WOW! That's good shootin'!
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I don't get out to shoot with a muzzleloading group - they shoot on Sundays and I have more important things to do that day. But why are 25yds targets shown on here? To me that is bow and arrow range. I attended a shoot with a local club when I first started muzzle loading. They were shooting gimick targets and the longest shot that day was about 20 yds which didn't much interest me so I never went back with that group. Is 25yds the typical range at which muzzle loading target shoots are arranged? For my flintlock I am much more interested in what is happening at 75 and 100 yds as that is useful for elk and deer hunting. Am I missing something here?
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some very fine shooting
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So 5 shots more or less inside a Quarter. That's pretty darn tootin good shooting even at 25 yards!
That apple stick might surprise a few guys if the accuracy holds up further out!
John
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Jerry, I'm just gettin started with this gun I learned that if it won't shoot where you want it then it aint no good... even if it is 25 yards... Shoot me 5 shot from 25 and lets see em...
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So 5 shots more or less inside a Quarter. That's pretty darn tootin good shooting even at 25 yards!
That apple stick might surprise a few guys if the accuracy holds up further out!
John
John, Look a little closer... The dime is covering up those 5 shots not the quarter... The quarter is just showing the next ring out... The dime is on the original target and over the group....
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I'm sorry, but the da#n dime thing thing is just plain showboat! LOL Tack driver for sure.
Paul
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Guys, So I guess a 1:66" twist rate aint too bad for a small cal. rifle.... I just hope my next build shoots as good I have a .29 Cal barrel just like it that is done . I just need to get over to Howards and pick it up...
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I would like for somone to explain why, if a gun will shoot dime size groups at 25 yards, why will the group open up to more
than twice the size of the 25 yard group if shot at 50 yards? I know it will probably shoot higher or lower, but, why would it
wander to the right or left at a greater distance? I don't think the ball will curve right or left, I can understand why a "bullet"might do this, but a round ball?????.........Don
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HI Don,
You make a good argument. My gut says the barrel should shoot as you suggest. For me the answer would be that at 25 yds, I can see the x ring. At 50 yds, I can't. I'd guess that the sights and the shooters eye are why the group spreads farther than the group suggests.
Regards,
Pletch
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Try putting a target at 50 yds right behind and in line with the 25 yd. Shoot at the 25 yd target. You
Will be surprised at your group on the 50 yd one.
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I remember settin up a machine rest the first time & figured I could shoot 25 or 30 yds & it would tell me what I needed to know. And you are right one hole at that distance might translate to much over twice that at twice the yardage. Dr. Manns expermentation sort of explains it as the spiral a bullet produces enlarges the further from the muzzle it is.
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I think the extra spread has to do with atmospheric conditions and projectile time of flight.
Since the projectile is slowing down as it travels down range, it takes longer to travel the second 25 yards than it does the first, so the ball has more time to wander off the intended course and consequently misses by more than double the error of the 25 yard target.
Throw in that if you're shooting outdoors, there's always something going on with atmospheric conditions. Maybe a puff of wind, a change of direction or a change in pressure. Add that bit of unknown condition to the extra projectile travel time, and viola, you just missed the target!
John
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I had a .223 scoped target rifle that could group like that at 100 yards off bags, that's by far the best I have ever seen from a BP iron sights rifle.
I almost feel bad for the squirrels........... ;D
Nice shooting !
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I would like for somone to explain why, if a gun will shoot dime size groups at 25 yards, why will the group open up to more
than twice the size of the 25 yard group if shot at 50 yards? I know it will probably shoot higher or lower, but, why would it
wander to the right or left at a greater distance? I don't think the ball will curve right or left, I can understand why a "bullet"might do this, but a round ball?????.........Don
Don,
Its math, MOA (Minute of Angle) mixed with a little wind, take a look here for a better explanation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VA2PZBD5Tjg
Dennis
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I would like for somone to explain why, if a gun will shoot dime size groups at 25 yards, why will the group open up to more
than twice the size of the 25 yard group if shot at 50 yards? I know it will probably shoot higher or lower, but, why would it
wander to the right or left at a greater distance? I don't think the ball will curve right or left, I can understand why a "bullet"might do this, but a round ball?????.........Don
Don, Are you talking about a "round ball" or one of those flat nosed 7/8ths round balls... I think the shooter has more to do with the group than the gun... If it will group a 25 it will group at 50...
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2Look,
Unless I overlooked it I am presuming you used a bench but what kind of sights, powder charge, patch etc and was the rifle locked in, sand bags? I've got a few 5 shot groups at 50 yards that aren't much bigger off a shooting table. Can't post but if you want to I will send them to you.
Mark
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mark, I shot that group off of a rag pile on a picnic table... I posted the rest of the recipe back at the front somewhere.....OPPS...The sights are fully adjustable wide blade sights....
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2Look,
How about some pics of this tack driver?
Mark
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Mark, Apple Jack is one page 1 just below the target...
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2Look,
Sorry about that, I did see that before, must be my "sometimers" kicking in. Looks like are joining those of us whose barrels are getting to short for the rear sight location.
Mark
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It's out there a ways... ;D ;D I wonder how it would shoot with Swiss powder ?? I may try some and find out if it will get any better...
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That's a fair sized chunk of steel holding up that apple wood and designed for the target work it's do'n. Ain't no lightweight, for sure.
Nice groups... :) :)
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Guys, Thanks for all the help along the way... I thought she would shoot pretty swell.... I just hope I can hold up long enough to do some good a some of the shoots and meet some new friends.... I hope I didn't step on anybody's toes too hard... You guys will like me once you get to know me... I'm just different in a good way...Again Thanks for the help "GOOD & BAD" ;D ;D
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2Look,
We hope you are around long enough to do some good at some shoots and we're glad you got to know some of us.
Mark
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Guy's, I just lost my dad at 1:15 am... It has been a horrible year for us ... I lost 2 uncles a 1st cousin and my dad in a month... I was hoping it stopped with the #3 but it didn't.... He loved to shoot trap & kill groundhogs with his longrifles... I will sure miss him....
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We lost my father-in-law less than a week ago. Hang in there...
Kevin
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2Look,
Sorry to hear about your Dad. I'm certain that your good memories of him will be a comfort.
Mark
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Sorry for you loss. Our family seems to experience rough patches too. Two years ago we lost our dad and then two months later my brother in law, followed by dad's last brother a couple of months after that. This past year lost an uncle on my mom's side (mom passed away back in 2003) in November close to Thanksgiving. Then we lost a cousin on Christmas eve and another uncle on my mom's side the day after Christmas. I am so sick of funerals. Not much you can do about them though as we get older so does our family and friends.
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Guys, Thanks for the kind words...
Don,It sounds like we're related... If I drank it would be time... But I guess I'll just look up and wonder why ??
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2lookindown, nice group, can I ask where you were aiming to center those shots in the x and 10 ring? My groups tend to get alot bigger when my old eyes try to find the center of the black with so much black around it. If I hold on a 6-oclock position, my 40 chunker will shoot 5 shots into .6 inches at 50 yards, outside spread. That was about 5 years ago, cant do it now though.
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Grouch,I hold at 6 o'clock to get that group. I guess my eye is still good enough to see the target at 25 but at 100 it looks like a fly speck... :D :D