AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Black Powder Shooting => Topic started by: Maven on August 10, 2018, 01:06:17 AM
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Let's do a Postal Match this month with smoothbores instead of rifles!!
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com
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I agree, Taylor. However, September would be better for me.
Paul W. Brasky
I'm up for a smoothbore postal match in September!
Fowler 610
Quote from: Fowler610 on Today at 08:58:54 AM
I'm up for a smoothbore postal match in September!
I'm in as well. Already used mine for the first shoot.
PK
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Use the same target as the rifle postal match? It's easy to see and aim at even for SB's with no rear sight. (And, I've already printed a few. :) )
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Here's a link to the target, courtesy of long cruise & Dennis G.: http://americanlongrifles.org/PDF/ALR_25_yd_postal.pdf 5 shots, as per usual.
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Target looks good to me. Thanks for the link, Maven.
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Here's PK's SB target: http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=49705.msg500179#msg500179 Nice shooting, PK!
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I'm in.sounds like fun
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Had a chance to shoot the September SB target today (in between the rain drops). Using 75gr. Wano FFFg, a home cast "pure" Pb Lyman .600" (.603" - .604" in fact) + milk carton OP wad + .018" pillow ticking patch, I was all over the practice target. I then dropped the powder charge to 65gr. and things improved greatly. Here's the record target, with a big whoopsie on the last shot ??? (Those help keep you humble!) Btw, the gun is a Green River Forge 20ga. NW trade gun (flintlock).
(https://preview.ibb.co/jaaLkp/IMG_6310.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dJErrU)
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Had a chance to shoot the September SB target today (in between the rain drops). Using 75gr. Wano FFFg, a home cast "pure" Pb Lyman .600" (.603" - .604" in fact) + milk carton OP wad + .018" pillow ticking patch, I was all over the practice target. I then dropped the powder charge to 65gr. and things improved greatly. Here's the record target, with a big whoopsie on the last shot ??? (Those help keep you humble!) Btw, the gun is a Green River Forge 20ga. NW trade gun (flintlock).
(https://preview.ibb.co/jaaLkp/IMG_6310.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dJErrU)
Bogey at 7 o. clock!!!! :o
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Don't I know it, SC!
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I will never have a target worth turning in however why not shoot for 3 months before switching to something else?I do enjoy seeing your targets and the discussion that goes with them.
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Hope to sight in a pistol today. I will embarrass myself with the smoothbore if I have time.
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Like looking at the targets. I'll be home for the October shoot likely.
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Was able to go shooting yesterday . fooled around with pistol for a few shots. Then Mr. Smoothie came out.
Since Maven started by posting a practice target first I did the same. I had been given a pound of Dupont fg.
I decided to shoot a few shots with it. They all managed to shoot low and out of the target. Went back to Goex 2f
Shot one out to right of target. I changed my left hand hold and shot five more. They settled in nice. I posted a clean target and shot five more. Over all I was pleased since I haven't shot the smoothie in three months.
(https://preview.ibb.co/j0q4AK/0904180928.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bQaFHz)
Score target on right. Load 70 grains of Goex 2f, 1/4 cushion wad, bare ball and A card.
Conditions overcast variable wind 6 to 9 mph.
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I was sneaking up on it...then not.
Kevin
(https://image.ibb.co/kHgWFU/Target.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ihNGh9)
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Well done guys.
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Thank you, Daryl!
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I went out to the range yesterday to shoot my September smoothy target. But someone has moved the 25 m target frame back to 37 yards. It is made out of grader blades and so I was unable to move it back up to 25. I tried to shoot it anyway, but my target was frustratingly non-competitive. I'll go out again next week, and take my own target stand this time.
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Taylor,
Did you shoot this match at 25 yards or 50? Just wunderin'....
Where can I read up on the rules in case I get a chance sometime? It's supposed to be harvest time, and we are white over and freezing!
Thanks in advance,
Richard.
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Richard, the rules are simple: 5 shots offhand @ 25 yd. or the metric equivalent. Here's a link to the target, courtesy of long cruise & Dennis G.: http://americanlongrifles.org/PDF/ALR_25_yd_postal.pdf Post a photo of your results in this thread and remember, it's just for fun. bragging rights, etc.
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Thanks for the reply Paul.
Bragging won't be happening, but fun Might! Would like to have ago with the old EIC musket....and maybe shorty the snapping tinderlock. :-)
Thanks for the link!
R.
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For a while I thought that interest in the postal shoot had petered out. Happy to see that it is still alive.
I don't really see this as a competition, but as an opportunity to go out and shoot with a purpose.
I like to see what loads others are using. This is also a good time to try something you haven't tried before and see if it pans out.
Like every shoot I ever go to, my pea brain is the competitor that I hope to beat.
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Quite right Alacran.
Gives us a good excuse to get out and try something different. :-)
Too wet and snowy for harvest at present, but no ink in copier! Will just shoot at a regular target I have. If it's totally bad, I might just hide it! LOL.
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It's cold here too Richard. The day I went to the range to shoot, was brilliant sunshine and 2 C. The fingers get cold so easily now. We've had snow but it didn't stick.
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Finally got my September smoothy target shot the other day. I took my target board to our black powder camping field, and set it up, then measured back 25 meters, and put an empty water bottle down to mark the spot, right beside a fresh moose track. Auspicious beginning. It's been about two years since I shot the old girl: Chambers' Pennsylvania fowler, and my warm up target showed it. But I persisted, and shot a target I was happy with, and present it here. My friend Don and I set up a trail cam on our trail walk in an spot where a bull had tor up the ground into a pisshole, and rubbed a sapling down to the wood. Hopefully we'll get some good pics of him in the coming days. The rut is just about to commence.
(https://preview.ibb.co/eJU1z9/100_8279.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dmtTe9)
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That looks a fair dinkum target, Taylor!
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Looks like one of my rifle targets shot from the bench. :)
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Great target Taylor! Maybe I should avoid shooting my smoothie for a few years too? ;D
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Very nice target Taylor!
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Thanks guys! This fowler has been really good to me in smoothbore round ball events over the years. From time to time, there are targets on some of the smoothbore trails I've shot that were well out past 100 meters. On these I load about 140 grains of powder, my tight patch/ball and allow as much barrel between the wedding band and the base of the front sight as the height of the front sight, up to about half of the barrel. As long as I hold and follow through, I usually hit these distant gongs. I engraved a deep longitudinal cut in the breech and tang down the centre of the barrel about two inches long. This I fill with soap stone welder's markers pencil so that I have a reference to keep my windage in line with the target. No rear sight above the plane of the barrel is the rule for trade gun matches. Inaccuracy with a smoothbore comes from small charges that don't develop enough velocity to keep the ball from veering off left or right, up or down, like a beach ball or a volley ball which when it slows down, takes an unintentional direction. If any of that makes sense.
Of note, the architecture of the Chambers' Pennsylvania fowler allows one to aim right along the top of the barrel without fear of being cracked in the face. I'd love to see their English fowler like the one Bob in the Woods shoots!!
Who's up for a pistol postal match for October? Same target. Same range. Offhand, of course.
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Good shooting Taylor. So I understand...are you able to get your cheekbone down on Jim's Pennsylvania fowler, as most do when rifle shooting, pain-free?
I ask because I've considered one of these fowlers for years, but haven't found an opportunity to shoot one. My Tulle is a brute to shoot as I'm accustomed to (cheek into the comb and head crept forward).
Thanks for sharing your experience and best regards, Skychief.
PS, I've drooled over this gun on display at Friendship. Have any pictures of yours to share?
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The French guns are engineered for maximum recoil. I dropped the nose on mine about 1/2 inch. It makes it better but it will never be as pleasant to shoot as an English pattern fowler. C'est La Vie
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Taylor i'm in with the Pistola.
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I'm in as well and will start a new thread with a link to the target for the October SB Postal Match forthwith.
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The French guns are engineered for maximum recoil. I dropped the nose on mine about 1/2 inch. It makes it better but it will never be as pleasant to shoot as an English pattern fowler. C'est La Vie
Describes my French smoothy to a T.
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All of the Tulle trade guns I have seen are cheek busters. I think it is a combination of the high comb and the angle of the pitch of the butt. With it's huge pitch it wants to ride up your shoulder when you touch it off, and that pushes the comb into your face - hard!
The Pennsyvania fowling gun from Chambers has a butt stock that is most pleasant to shoot. the eye is level with the plane of the barrel, the butt plate adequately wide to suck up recoil, and the comb straight enough to be a joy with heavy shot or ball loads. I'll see if I can round up some images.
(https://preview.ibb.co/mCtSGp/DSCN1677.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ecedNU)
(https://preview.ibb.co/geLk2U/DSCN1678.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hCvJNU)
(https://preview.ibb.co/iFCb99/DSCN1695.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cx6Q2U)
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Thank you Taylor for your response. That's the type fowling piece I am searching for. I've becomes a smoothbore junky despite my Frenchy's poor disposition. I will have an English styled gun soon. Thanks again. And I appreciated your photos.
Best regards, Skychief
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That is a very nice looking gun taylor.
(https://preview.ibb.co/mRW4Wp/IMG_0523.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hg1Sj9)
I built this for a friend . I was pleasantly surprised about how pleasant to shoot it is. It is very easy to acquire your target.
I've been shooting my Tulle for close to 20 years. It is a love hate relationship. Love the way it looks. Hate the way it kicks. I find though that a lot has to do in how you shoulder it. If you place the heel of the butt higher up on the shoulder. It does mitigate some of the recoil. That being said I will be building myself a new smoothie with the above pattern.The Madame will be relegated to the few reenactments that I do. Or maybe sell it to an unsuspecting Frenchman.
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I don't know guys but I think Tulles are getting a bad rap here. I have 2 French Fusils and a New England fowler with a French influenced stock design that are a joy to shoot. If I use my cheek position as the "rear" sight and focus on the front sight and barrel for my sight picture I never get any cheek slap or beat up shoulder. The problem comes in if you try to scrunch your cheek into the stock and use the tang bolt or breech area for a rear sight. I learned that the hard way when I got my first smoothie.
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I do not use the tang screw as a rear sight. I shoot my smoo thbore as a shotgun. Front sight and target. Maybe your physique is suited for the Frenchies. Granted I've only shot 2 Tulle's mine and a friends. Always looked like I got the worst of a sparring match.
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Alacran: I like the butt design of that piece better than my PA fowler! However, that gun is a little deep through the lock section and on into the forestock. But it looks like a pleasant shooting gun.
About shouldering a smoothie, or a rifle for that matter. I'vbe seen so many shooters who shoulder muzzleloaders like a modern scoped rifle...they crawl the stock!!! That requires that they have a length of pull that is longer than they need. And it usually results in the thumb cracking the nose, or at least, the comb smacking your face.
For what it is worth, I will describe my shooting stance. It is simple. I stand perfectly erect (a nice situation for any man!), and bring the gun to the eye. This eliminates the head down and forward posture, and aligns the sights quickly and consistently. It also places the cheek further toward the buttplate along the comb. Try it.
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I am in full agreement with Taylor on hold. The gun should come up to the face.
The HARD cheek WELD guys speak of comes from shooting modern military rifles and perhaps this is requisite for them for good shooting. It is not the way to hold a muzzleloading gun.
Leave the 21st century gun holds to those guns that need it.
None of them shoot as well offhand as our ML's do.
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Daryl says,"Leave the 21st century gun holds to those guns that need it. "
Indeed!!
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Alacran: I like the butt design of that piece better than my PA fowler! However, that gun is a little deep through the lock section and on into the forestock. But it looks like a pleasant shooting gun.
About shouldering a smoothie, or a rifle for that matter. I'vbe seen so many shooters who shoulder muzzleloaders like a modern scoped rifle...they crawl the stock!!! That requires that they have a length of pull that is longer than they need. And it usually results in the thumb cracking the nose, or at least, the comb smacking your face.
For what it is worth, I will describe my shooting stance. It is simple. I stand perfectly erect (a nice situation for any man!), and bring the gun to the eye. This eliminates the head down and forward posture, and aligns the sights quickly and consistently. It also places the cheek further toward the buttplate along the comb. Try it.
Taylor I agree the lock section and the forestock are little deep. I built this for a friend that had bought a parts kit for an "American Fowler" at the Western Nationals back in the mid 90s. Unfortunately the lock mortice was already cut. It was about 3/64th" too high. There was little room for adjustment. Worse yet the web was a 1/4"plus. The but had enough wood that I could slim it down, but the basic shape was there. Basically making chicken salad out of chicken @#$%/!!.
As far as shooting stance, I have been shooting in the style you describe for over fifty years. You are right it is a most natural and comfortable way to shoot offhand. All my muzzleloaders have a trigger pull of 13 1/2 inches give or take a 16th". When shooting a shotgun(smoothbore) the same stance is used when shooting at clays.