Author Topic: frontier deerskin coat with fringe  (Read 52547 times)

ajrd

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frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« on: July 10, 2011, 05:03:17 PM »
I want to have a deep frontiersman impression for campaigner reanectment, and I need some help (again).
hve you got some pictures (reproduction )or patterns of frontier deerskin coat w fringe , circa 1830-1860?
i want to make one ,soon and there are too few sources available about it!
thanks friends
ajrd

Offline Cory Joe Stewart

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2011, 05:46:32 PM »
YOu may want to check out the Book of Bucksinning II, published by Muzzleloader magazine ISBN# 0-9605666-2-7.  It has a chapter on mountainman clothing and sewing for that era.  But I checked and it does not have a coat.  YOu can also get cloth patterns from companies like JAS Townsend, and use them for the leather you have. Dixie Gun works used to also be a great source for patterns. 

Coryjoe

Offline Tim Crosby

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2011, 11:50:10 PM »
« Last Edit: July 11, 2011, 04:09:31 AM by Dr. Tim-Boone »

Offline Clark Badgett

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2011, 07:07:33 AM »
Arnaud, clothing styles changed very drastically between 1830-1860. Mens coats alone went from tailed and more form fitting with tight sleeves to less form fitting with fuller sleeves during this timeframe. Frocks started making a come back during this timeframe as well, but long fringed buckskin seems to have become more popular during the later western period. And as always there always seems to be the occational exception.
« Last Edit: August 06, 2011, 07:53:29 AM by Clark B »
Psalms 144

Offline Chuck Burrows

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2011, 12:51:41 PM »
For leather coats dating from the late 1830's check out the works of Alfred J Miller who painted the mountain men of that period. These were either patterned on the frock coats of that period or were a simple coat made of a series of rectangles similar to the way hunting shirts were made. Most coats of this era were fringed at the shoulder and sometimes along the sleeves.  Other records from the period note that fringe was a major part of the frontiersman’s clothing from the 1830’s onward.
Several of Miller's works are seen here and can be zoomed in on
http://art.thewalters.org/viewartist.aspx?id=4486#results

Caped hunting coats based on similar patterns were also popular and the style was worn well into the 1860's, especially amongst the displaced eastern Indians such as the Delaware/Shawnee and Cherokee. Here's a link to a heavily decorated Delaware coat from the 1835-1860 period. This style in leather goes back to the late 1700’s as well , the LaMayeur coat is from that period and is essentially the same as these later ones/
http://www.dia.org/object-info/39cbc78c-f52a-48ef-be2a-63ae95917f26.aspx?position=2

a plainer version was also worn -
Here by Black Beaver a Delaware scout circa 1846


the type was also worn by whites - this is Colonel Dodge in 1834 by G Catlin -


As noted above, style did change over time though and by the 1850’s one starts to see hide jackets similar to this one worn by Texas Ranger John RIP Ford


My recommendation – narrow your time period down to 5 years or so when documenting such items. One can use an earlier pattern for the later periods, but not vice versa. 1830-1850 period frock coat patterns are available and the later plain jacket can be based off a basic jacket pattern with the addition of patch pockets and fringe.

 I have several more images of 1830-1860 era coats, including the so-called 1850-70’s scout coat, some SW styles, and fancy Metis styles. I will post them later if so desired.

Two roads diverged in a wood, and I,
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2011, 09:46:17 AM »
thanks friends,

mr burrows , your advices are true , numerous coats will cover a large era of time better that only one, so I will make different patterns from 1830 to 1860 . with help of  miller pictures ... and early photograph

I ve got one question : in france we' ve got good deerskin sutlery ... is better to use deerskin or just soft cow leather for coat circa 30-1860?
what is the kind of skin the more used at this time for great plains coat?

arnaud

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2011, 11:09:08 PM »
Once you've worn a garment made from brain tanned deer or elk, it's hard to go back to commercial tanned leather.
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2011, 12:19:01 PM »
sure it's certainly true , but i want to know the different kind of skin used , no informations of about it
ajrd

Offline Chuck Burrows

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2011, 08:52:17 PM »
Arnaud - there is a gentleman in Germany who still produces the type of oil tan hides that were widely used in the past for making such clothes - - This is the type of hide I would recommend unless yu can find some one in Europe to supply brain tan or of course you could order brantan from some one in the USA but the cost will be exorbitant when the VAT and customs charges are included. I will find his information if you like - it's the same type of hide as sold here by Crazy Crow as German Tan often called imitation brain tan. It is virtually identical to brain tan and can even be smoked to make it more so.
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I,
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2011, 11:34:36 PM »
 chuck,germany is not so far from france so, you can give the adress of the gentleman to  me . email or other ;
  mister miller drawing are really great 'ressource' to have an idea of clothes used at this era . thanks .
I am living near Paris , and there is a dealer who sell deerskin (cerf ) . this hides are yellow and seems good . I have already used this kind of  hide  to realize  a hunting bag with snake small shield , like your bags  at wild rose. I think with some burnishing or smoking this hide could be used for large clothing work.

arnaud (up with american longriflers!)
 

Rowland

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2011, 04:26:17 AM »
Here is a link to an article in Muzzle Blasts on the work of Shawn Webster.  The article features a beautiful frock coat that Webster made for artist David Wright:  http://www.blackpowder411.com/fine-artist/shawn-webster-artist-and-author/

And here is a link to an article reviewing a commercial pattern used to create a "Milleresque" frock coat:  http://www.rockymountainoutfit.com/reviews/patterns/tg-1830-frock/

I also suggest you google the terms "metis coat", "metis frock", "braintan frock", "braintan coat", "buckskin coat 1830" and similar terms.  There are quite a few interesting articles and images available online.
 
Good luck to you and look forward to hearing more from you as your project develops.  I would love to make up a fine braintan frock coat of my own one day.

John McClellan

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2011, 02:52:22 AM »
If you want a coat made or hides get intouch with Oliver McCloskey he builds gear to USE. He has a early coat on the Cotemporary long rifle sight right now that you could check out and I know he is finishing up a eastern coat soon. He is real reasonable on braintan hides too. Its best to call him or find him on face book he doesnt e-mail his number is 435-592-4152 you can email me as well and I can send you some pics of my coat and other gear he has made.
johnmcclellan1977@gmail.com
Good luck!
John McClellan

Rowland

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2011, 03:24:00 AM »
That coat on the CLA website is incredible.  What a fine piece of work.

John McClellan

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2011, 04:59:02 AM »
Feel free to post any of the pics I sent ya half cocked I don't know how to do it on here.
John

Rowland

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2011, 04:27:40 AM »
Will do.  These are great looking coats.














ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2011, 06:45:18 PM »
waouuu, that looks great! a very good work.
thanks half cocked ..... I 'll inspired by these coats  for realize my own coat.
one question. have you got one  pattern to send me by email..?
ajrd

ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2011, 07:06:09 PM »
well;  patterns of this kinds of coat are very difficult to have,especially in france, so I search the main mesurment, and all you can send me for free, to the name of friendship.(if you can , of course)
thanks friends
arnaud (a screamer too)

Offline Ky-Flinter

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2011, 08:06:33 PM »
Arnaud,

Here's some pictures of me wearing a buckskin jacket I made. I used the Caped Woodsman's Frock pattern by Eagle's View with some modifications.  These patterns are sold by many suppliers, you might try Track of the Wolf www.trackofthewolf.com, Smoke and Fire www.smoke-fire.com, or others.

Pictures were taken on July 4 this year, before and after a 10K footrace.  I fire my rifle to start the race.







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Life is too short to hunt with an ugly gun. -Nate McKenzie

Offline alyce-james

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2011, 04:44:03 PM »
Half cocked; The last picture on page one of your post reminds me of home in Montana, Billings. The mans clothing in the picture appears to have been involved in many outdoor events. All these pictures should be of help to our French friend. Thanks for posting. Turkeyfooter.
"Candy is Dandy but Liquor is Quicker". by Poet Ogden Nash 1931.

ajrd

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Re: frontier deerskin coat with fringe
« Reply #19 on: August 05, 2011, 07:26:19 PM »
yep I know track of wolf , a very good mountain man sutlery and I will order some pattern one day or another.
ky flinter , you've got very nice jacket and sure you have made lot of smoke and noise for your fouth of july ( us we ve got the fourteen july and fire with 1777 charleville musket !)
sure all you picture are a lot of " inspiration" for me

ajrd, friend of all american longriflers like were count de grasse and rochambeau