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| |-+  Contemporary Longrifle Collecting
| | |-+  Hawken Rifle by T. K. Dawson
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Author Topic: Hawken Rifle by T. K. Dawson  (Read 6889 times)
Don Stith
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« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2013, 12:33:50 PM »

Bob can confirm if my observation is true. I believe if the original he worked from had a crack or repair, then Dawson's copy would at least have the appearance of the same flaw or repair. I have been fortunate to own some of them including a nice Kentucky rifle. For sure the ones I have had included those kind of details.
 The only exception I know of is on his copy of the Peterson rifle. If you look at the picture in Baird there is one stud missing from the upper side of the capbox. For some reason Dawson put both of them in his copy
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Mike Brooks
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« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2013, 07:10:05 PM »

I have seen some really great  Dawson guns over the years, he was a really great earlyish revival builder.
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IKE
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« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2013, 09:03:39 AM »

I hunted on his farm back in the 1970s. I got to see a lot of his work and he helped me get a start building guns.
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Eitnier Rifles
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JTR
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« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2013, 03:18:26 PM »

I'm curious. It's a modern gun and looks like it's been banged around a bit, so why not shoot it?
John
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John Robbins
hawknknife
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« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2013, 12:46:35 PM »

The only reason I have not shot the rifle is that I feel it is pretty valuable and the lock is a handmade one and if by some chance something were to break, I could have trouble repairing it....
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D. Taylor Sapergia
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« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2013, 07:41:54 PM »

Shooting that rifle won't hurt it one bit.  But not cleaning it properly will.  I've never been able to understand collecting contemporary guns without firing them.  That's what they'[re for...not investment to make money.  But to each his own...
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D. Taylor Sapergia
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Ray Nelson
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« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2013, 08:44:50 PM »

Taylor,

I agree whole heartedly!

Ray
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JDK
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« Reply #22 on: January 09, 2013, 08:56:55 PM »

Hawknknife,

If you want to shoot it shoot it without fear!  If .... and it's a big "IF".... something were to go wrong with the lock there are many competent 'smiths who can repair it.  They repair original hand made work all of the time.

Enjoy it!  J.D.
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J.D. Kerstetter
hornturner
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« Reply #23 on: January 18, 2013, 09:55:12 AM »

Tom Dawson was a friend of my father's.  One time when I was probably in my teens he visited our home and had his copies of a Hawken rifle and the Edward Marshall or "Indian Walk" rifle with him.  I was really impressed with the fact that the Marshall rifle had every nick, dent and even cracks in the wood that the original had.  It was that visit that created the spark that got me interested in building rifles. When I did get started doing that about 12 or 14 years later, Tom was very gracious in allowing my father to bring me out to his farm near Marshfield, IN.  I got to see his shop, he was very patient and helpful in his critique of my work which all served to make me want to do the next one even better.  A few years later, I visited him again with the same results.  Got to see a couple of original Kentuckys and some exquisite English quality work he was doing on flintlock double rifles.  He truly mentored me and was a great influence.

I well remember that day in March of 1989 when his wife called to tell my dad that Tom had passed away.  I happened to be visiting my parents at that time was very saddened to lose the person I considered to be my first mentor.

Art DeCamp
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SleepyHillBarrels
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« Reply #24 on: June 30, 2013, 04:26:36 AM »

Bob
Is this the same rifle we saw at friendship with Bill that had the repair on the stock from
the get go. seems like there was a man that said it was a original Hawken at the time.
But he was being led on by Bill and his wit .I have Toms letter to Bill with the drawings for
the hook breach that he ordered with a barrel and it looks like the one on this rifle. Did bill
make some changes on his breach plugs for Tom or did tom get bill to make the first ones
to start with. The letter was dated Aug 17 1959. Tom copied it from one of the many
Hawken's he studied he asked bill if he could keep it true to the drawing.

     Jim
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Bob Roller
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« Reply #25 on: June 30, 2013, 10:06:35 AM »

Jim,
That rifle was Tom Dawson's precise copy of the long barreled Hoffman&Campbell.
This was from 1968.I made the lock and triggers and still have Tom's drawings for the
triggers.They were poorly done but Tom insisted that I copy them even down to the finishing
nail the front trigger pivoted on.The lock was an Ashmore of indifferent quality with only one
position,full cocked or down on the cap.
This rifle along with others were displayed at Tom and Helen's camp on a rack Tom had made.
An "expert"on Hawken rifles took it off the rack and started to tell "all"about it and that it was a fine
example of an original,pre-1849 Hawken. Tom then went into their camper trailer and brought out the original
rifle and we thought the "expert"was going to expire right there. The Dawson camp was a favorite place of mine and
Helen would tell me there would be at least one extra steak that night for dinner and insisted that I eat which I
always did. That camp was only a few yards to the right of the main gate and two parking places were reserved
there as well,one for Bill Large and one for me.
Getting back to the H&C rifle,Tom copied it down to the accidents,dings and mistakes but he also stated that the
original would out perform the new made one with identical loads.The original had a funneled muzzle,deliberately done
for easy loading.Tom's test was done by shooting into an old abandoned school house on his property.He said the H&C
could shoot thru 4 walls of the building and the replica could only make it thru  three and both were identical loads with
round balls cast from the same mould blocks.
Tom did make several rifles with the brass "repair"strips in the grip to represent a broken stock and on his copy of the
Modena rifle,the patch box screws weren't seated properly and the rear sight had a slight down hill angle and he said
the original was like that.He even copied the mineral streak in the fore end on that one.
I have had recent contact with one of the Dawson daughters,Diana Brier and she says her son is following in Tom's
foot prints and makes hand made long rifles and forges his own barrels.I'd say that is genetic and I hope it can
continue.

Bob Roller
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Topknot
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« Reply #26 on: June 30, 2013, 02:28:28 PM »

Man oh man, tThat is one great hawken. With all this talk about the early resurgent day of muzzle loaders, I truly wish I had been there amongst all of you! The Hawken rifle was my favorite rifle for many years as I was growing up. I read every book I could get my hands on about the MOUNTAIN MEN. I would sit in class and daydream about being with jim bridger and his bunch in them thar shining mountains. These days I am interested in all of the rifles of of the past, especially the beloved pennsylvania rifles and the southern longrifle , but my heart has a special place for the hawken rifle.

                                     topknot
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TIM COMPTON, SR.

    layover to catch meddlers!
mountainman70
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« Reply #27 on: June 30, 2013, 11:15:47 PM »

I'm with you,topknot.The Hawken legend is what got me interested,and even tho I am no where near as good a builder as some of these bros on here,I have enjoyed my efforts at building,shooting,and even collecting a few of the early built Hawkens,and studying their construction,and the parts used in them.Couple to that the great opportunity to meet and enjoy Bill Large,Bob Roller,Gene Hyre,and many others in our local club-Mountaineer Flintlock Rifles ,since 1976.
I have a few Hawkens,and am currently building long,slim mountain rifles.It is a hobby I love very much.Best part is the fellowship of all on here,and in our club,and the m/l life in general.
Mr Dawsons work is great.I am sorely tempted to buy this rifle.Best regards,Dave F
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anj4de
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« Reply #28 on: October 18, 2013, 02:47:32 PM »

Shooting that rifle won't hurt it one bit.  But not cleaning it properly will.  I've never been able to understand collecting contemporary guns without firing them.  That's what they'[re for...not investment to make money.  But to each his own...

I would even go so far to say an original gun that is in good shape can and should be used once in a while. I have an original 1861 Springfield that I still use once in a while, it handles a lot nicer then the Italian 1855 that I use for re-enactments. Also my 1854 Lorenz gets used still...after all they were made to be used.

thanks
Uwe
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