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Author Topic: "no name" brown bess ... ?  (Read 13631 times)

rfd

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"no name" brown bess ... ?
« on: January 21, 2016, 12:35:31 AM »
anyone have a clue as to who or what built this musket? 

might be an india musket, like middlesex traders imports?

thanx in advance!

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jzyi55bei98fp8l/AAChhHypENf2qlG0Khs6rzj4a?dl=0
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The Rambling Historian

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #1 on: January 21, 2016, 01:48:06 AM »
It is a Pedersoli made gun. The "BLACK POWDER ONLY" marking was the first clue, and then the fact that the lock has "GRICE/1762" as do Pedersoli 2nd Model Brown Bess muskets.
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rfd

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2016, 01:55:16 AM »
interesting that there are no pedersoli markings on it all, not even under the barrel.  and the wood appears to be maple and not walnut. 
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Offline bones92

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2016, 11:51:39 AM »
I'd love to find one of these.   Never have fired a musket,  and all the reading on the American Revolution has whet my appetite for one.
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rfd

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2016, 01:57:00 PM »
Quote from: bones92 on January 21, 2016, 11:51:39 AM
I'd love to find one of these.   Never have fired a musket,  and all the reading on the American Revolution has whet my appetite for one.

the owner of this one (not me) is selling it - pm me for his email if yer interested.
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The Rambling Historian

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2016, 05:15:40 PM »
The lack of markings is odd. Maybe a kit gun?

Here are some images of one of these guns that I found for sale on GunsAmerica:


https://www.gunsamerica.com/985624867/Pedersoli-2nd-Model-1762-Brown-Bess-Single-Shot-Flintlock-Musket-75-Caliber.htm

Dixie has them for less than this listing fyi.
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Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2016, 06:57:17 PM »
 The stock looks like English walnut to me. It might be an early one made before Pedersoli, and or Navy Arm, started marking the barrels. It looks to well done to be from India, or even Spain. It also doesn't have the squashed triggerguard that the Japanese copied off a combat veteran Bess.

   Hungry Horse
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Offline Dale Campbell

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2016, 07:36:55 PM »
Actually, it was a reenactment combat vet Navy Arms repro. Val Forgett, who started Navy Arms was a friend of a friend. The Japanese just copied what was sent them. That's why the parts don't fit each other either, due to the casting losses right from the Navy Arms piece.
« Last Edit: January 21, 2016, 07:38:01 PM by Dale Campbell »
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Best regards,
Dale

Offline SR James

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2016, 06:47:16 PM »
Could it have been defarbed?  I bought my Pedersoli Bess from a re-enactor who had it defarbed.  The only factory stamping was the serial number.
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rfd

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2016, 09:43:51 PM »
i heard back from pedersoli and they said it could very well have been a musket they made for navy arms, which got defarbed before selling.
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hammer

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2016, 10:49:02 PM »
Does it have British proof marks?   My recollection is that  Coach and Harness produced the 'Grice' Brown Bess using the Pedersoli lock.   Very high quality.  Some were produced with silver furniture as presentation/collectors pieces  Later Pedersoli took over the design and manufacture and continue to make the self same musket to this day.
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rfd

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2016, 10:54:57 PM »
no proof marks on the barrel at all (view the images presented as a dropbox link in the first post).
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Offline bones92

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2016, 10:43:06 PM »
I was able to acquire the musket through coordination by "rfd".  Many thanks to him for the help.  It is in great shape.  I am curious to see if there are any marks on the barrel under the woodline (not sure if the seller disassembled it or not).

Either way, it's my first musket, and I can't wait to try it out.
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The Rambling Historian

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2016, 10:56:23 PM »
Quote from: rfd on January 22, 2016, 09:43:51 PM
i heard back from pedersoli and they said it could very well have been a musket they made for navy arms, which got defarbed before selling.

It seems odd that someone going through the effort to defarb all the other barrel markings would leave "BLACK POWDER ONLY" visible.
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Offline bones92

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2016, 11:10:41 PM »
When they saw the photos, the Pedersoli customer service rep replied with this:

Looking for the serial number into the old books, we have a matching number with unfinished muskets produced and shipped to Navy Arms on 1975.
There is no mention of the models on the serial number books.
Being unfished, it is possible there was not the need of the Proof House tests.
We cannot say more...


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Offline bones92

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2016, 11:08:31 PM »

Just thought I'd share the fruits of this effort.  Again, thanks to RFD for helping me acquire this.

The flash...


The fire...


The dénouement...
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rfd

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #16 on: April 27, 2016, 12:11:53 AM »
"thar she blows!" - very cool!  8)
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Offline bones92

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #17 on: April 27, 2016, 03:16:13 AM »
Not only that, but a couple other guys fired it, and it was a hit all around.  I need to find a correct sling for it.
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Offline davec2

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2016, 04:46:05 AM »
Correct slings here.....along with a lot of other good stuff:

http://www.najecki.com/repro/reproindex.html

http://www.najecki.com/repro/Musket.html#Msling
« Last Edit: April 27, 2016, 04:46:41 AM by davec2 »
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Offline conquerordie

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Re: "no name" brown bess ... ?
« Reply #19 on: April 27, 2016, 01:47:48 PM »
Now that you got her shooting, pick one of the 4 or 5 drill manuals being used at the time of the revolution and learn to shoot it in that framework. Makes us understand the arms and how they were used. Besides being fun as can be!
Greg
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