Where to rest

[Mike Brooks]

Where to rest the stock for shooting off the bench. I have never had results I was satisfied with off the bench with ML's. Modern stuff with free floated barrels, no problemo, ML's I can shoot better off hand than off a rest.

[conquerordie]

I always rest it in the location my other hand would fall when shooting offhand. I figure doing that applies the same pressure on the same location on the stock and barrel on either shooting position.
Greg

[smylee grouch]

If I were to be sighting in a rifle for offhand type shooting I would hold it under that area of the stock that I hold when offhand shooting with the back of the handrested on the bags or bench but if I were to be working up loads or shooting in a bench or cross stik match I would have the barrel rested out toward the muzzle end on the bags or in the V of the cross stix. most competitors will use the most forward ram rod thimble as the resting point on those shots., right to the rear of the thimble.

[Mike Brooks]

Well, this will be interesting. I hold just ahead of the lock,,,,,

[smokinbuck]

I shoot mostly table and a little chunk., also play a little with light bench/cross stick. For these matches I use a pre determined spot approximately 6"-8" from the muzzle, being carefull to be consistant. If I was sighting in an offhand rifle I would rest at the same point my hand would be. IMHO this creates uniform barrel harmonics for whichever discipline is being shot.
Mark

[chubby]

When bench shooting I rest the gun on the bag at middle ramrod pipe each time left hand on the trigger and right hand flat on the bench same each time! less chance of pulling or twisting with the right. just my 2 cents worth!  Chubby

[bob in the woods]

I rest my target rifle about 6 inches back of the muzzle. It's a half stock under hammer, with no pipes. [ strictly target ].  Interesting to note that I have a different sight setting for rest matches . For  my regular flintlock .54 long rifle, I rest it on the forward pipe.

[Daryl]

I hold all my rifles at or near the entry-pipe when shooting standing/offhand.  When testing loads, I usually hold the rifle the same way, resting the back of my left hand on the bags, bags adjusted for proper elevation of the rifle and sights.

If strictly bench-testing loads and not caring where the group lands, I will rest the entry-pipe on the bags and use my left hand to hold the underside of the buttstock, at & against my shoulder, or for squeezing the rear bag if I use one.

When chunk shooting, I found my .40 was most accurate when I rested the lower entry-pipe on the bag that was on the 'chunk'. Resting it further out, at the top rod ferrel, my groups opened up. One must find the most accurate location for his/her own rifle with THEM shooting. It is possible a different shooter will group differently (location and size) with the same gun, same load. It is all about how each person shoots, holds, their eyes as well in how they see the sights.  I shoot 2" low with Taylor's rifles when they are sighted for him.

[Mike Brooks]

Well, I'll figure something out. I'm mainly concerned with working up an accurate load for now. My first 5 shots out of the gun (off hand) @ 25 yards was just under 2 inches for group and 8" low, and I was fairly wobbly and getting used to the weight/balance of the gun. I'll probably get the sights set off hand or setting......seems that's the way I used to do it. Of course I wasn't near as wobbly back then.

Lock time was a bit slow. I think next time out I'll put the flint in bevel up, seems to throw the spark more directly into  the pan. That ought to help close my group up a bit.

[BartSr]

I shoot mostly table and a little chunk., also play a little with light bench/cross stick. For these matches I use a pre determined spot approximately 6"-8" from the muzzle, being carefull to be consistant. If I was sighting in an offhand rifle I would rest at the same point my hand would be. IMHO this creates uniform barrel harmonics for whichever discipline is being shot.
Mark

Thats where I shoot my .54 underhammer from, about 6-8 inches from the muzzle, on a custom stand.  I cannot shoot this rifle offhand, it weighs too much.

BartSr

[L. Akers]

Mike, Resting the fore end on the bench at the same location as the forward hand when shooting offhand may or may not work.  I think you'd be lucky if it did.  Offhand provides a "soft" rest while the bench is a "hard" rest.  The gun will  react differently --barrel harmonics and all that rot. As when working up a load you read what the rifle is telling you it wants to be fed, the gun will tell you where it wants to be supported.  A very small difference in support location can make the difference between a shotgun-like grouping and all X's.

[smylee grouch]

Another consideration would be how much drop is in the stock. With more drop and holding the gun too far back on the bench you change the pivot point more to the rear and might increase the amount of muzzle flip during recoil.

[Mike Brooks]

Another consideration would be how much drop is in the stock. With more drop and holding the gun too far back on the bench you change the pivot point more to the rear and might increase the amount of muzzle flip during recoil.

It has a bunch of drop. It's a .36 and 7 3/4lbs so muzzle hop shouldn't be much of a factor. (I hope)

[bgf]

It's always different for each rifle, for me, but I'm always able to find a point of equivalent POI.  Start at muzzle or close and work back ~6" at a time or so until a shot lands at same place as offhand.  It's a big help when sighting in and getting a good load.

[Daryl]

When shooting plank, bench or off a chunk rest, I rest the stock at the spot that gives the best accuracy, after all, if not holding the stock as if offhand shooting for adjusting the sights, I am shooting for group or score and that means the best accuracy THAT rifle will give me. 

THAT spot is definite and usually different for each rifle used.  This is due to different harmonics, gun to gun. The harmonics are different, due to calibre, load and gun design & even hold- which is related to gun design.

[Joe S.]

Mike,no disrespect but after a lifetime of building and shooting these things I would have figured you would have figured it out.Granted everybody does what works for them and to get a different perspective but........it ain't rocket science

[Mike Brooks]

Mike,no disrespect but after a lifetime of building and shooting these things I would have figured you would have figured it out.Granted everybody does what works for them and to get a different perspective but........it ain't rocket science

In my youth my hold was so rock steady I never needed to rest on anything anything to work up a load or sight it in. I was capable of doing it all off hand.... those days are now over. Getting old sucks, can't even hold my gun up anymore.

[bgf]

When shooting plank, bench or off a chunk rest, I rest the stock at the spot that gives the best accuracy, after all, if not holding the stock as if offhand shooting for adjusting the sights, I am shooting for group or score and that means the best accuracy THAT rifle will give me. 

THAT spot is definite and usually different for each rifle used.  This is due to different harmonics, gun to gun. The harmonics are different, due to calibre, load and gun design & even hold- which is related to gun design.

Good point.  Same POI as offhand does not necessarily equal best rested position for accuracy.  It is handy for adjusting sights initially for a rifle that will be shot offhand, and for sneaking up on a good load.  IF the equivalent rest position is suboptimal accuracy wise, the best position can be found for rested accuracy and PoI ignored for final refinement of group size.  I think it is important mostly to recognize the differences, which once known can be worked with...

[Joe S.]

Mike,no disrespect but after a lifetime of building and shooting these things I would have figured you would have figured it out.Granted everybody does what works for them and to get a different perspective but........it ain't rocket science

In my youth my hold was so rock steady I never needed to rest on anything anything to work up a load or sight it in. I was capable of doing it all off hand.... those days are now over. Getting old sucks, can't even hold my gun up anymore.

Maybe one of those rests they sell like the lead sled or alike.Pretty much all you do is pull the trigger.This should allow you to sight you rifles in as well as work up loads without the strain of holding it steady.After your satisfied with that part then you can shoot for fun.

[Mike Brooks]

What started all of this is I have never shot ML guns well off a rest EVER. Modern guns, no problemo. So, I figure I must have been missing out on the secret formula or something. In the end it seems everybody does this a bit different, I'll take all of your advice and put it in a bag and shake it up and see what comes out. Just need something to work up a load is all, and from my first session with this gun it seems that won't be too difficult....I hope.

[bob in the woods]

This may sound weird, but I have found that some rifles perform better off a rest if you remove the ramrod when shooting.

[Joe S.]

as well as unsteady seems we also get a little cranky with age.Get you a sevice monkey and teach him to shoot,dogs have a devil of a time holding guns

[smylee grouch]

I think your right about the ramrod Bob. It can cause you to cant and on recoil can roll one way or another also causing cant.

[Daryl]

What started all of this is I have never shot ML guns well off a rest EVER. Modern guns, no problemo. So, I figure I must have been missing out on the secret formula or something. In the end it seems everybody does this a bit different, I'll take all of your advice and put it in a bag and shake it up and see what comes out. Just need something to work up a load is all, and from my first session with this gun it seems that won't be too difficult....I hope.

Mike, both feet flat on the ground or floor. Slightly angled to the bench. Both elbows on the table. Watch your breathing. I like to put a heavy wool blanket on the benches we have - most of which have concrete tops. Easier on the elbows that move or rock when the gun goes off.

Lead Sleds are VERY hard on the stock with a gun that has recoil.  The stock, being held rigidly, cannot move to absorb shock and thus can break on you, especially with guns with a lot of drop at the heel in comparison to modern straight stocks meant for scopes. I would not use one of those contraptions.  If the gun kicks too much, get a sissy pad or PAST shoulder pad (same thing). That is what I used when my shoulder cartilage was badly torn from recoil - don't know how THAT happened.

[Mike Brooks]

as well as unsteady seems we also get a little cranky with age.Get you a sevice monkey and teach him to shoot,dogs have a devil of a time holding guns

Oh, I'm not upset at all, I was just hoping for a little magic to make my life easier. As I said, I can shoot my modern guns off a bench with a bipod or bag and shoot .620 groups all day @ 100 yards. I have never accomplished anything remotely similar with a ML.
 I have had fellers at F-ship suggest taking all the pins out except the one behind the muzzle.

So, I have several choices of good front and rear bags in my range bag from modern shooting. I'll keep in mind the advice you fine fellows have freely given and flop the bags and gun out on the bench and let fly. I'll let you know what happens.  BTW, I hope to shoot enough off hand this summer to make those wobbles go away again, very annoying thing to have to deal with....

Lead sleds....no intention of ever using one of those, not going to ever own a gun with that kind of recoil again...