Author Topic: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:  (Read 3772 times)

Offline cable

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https://www.proxibid.com/aspr/Fine-original-flintlock-Treaty-Rifle-by-Tryon-of/32019852/LotDetail.asp?lid=32019852

described as "  Fine original flintlock “Treaty Rifle” by Tryon of Philadelphia showing “P” proof on the barrel indicating purchase by U.S. government for trade to Indians as part of treaties and presentations to important chiefs and leader of tribes. This rifle is of an extra ordinary high quality with beautifully engraved patch box showing pineapple and fancy pierce work secured 9 screws. The underside of the fore end is sheeted in brass and mounts show piercing and engraving. Silver escutcheons around the barrel keys and silver plaque in the cheek piece and a plate at the wrist. The rifle measures 61 ˝” overall with a 45” slightly heavy octagon barrel of .36 caliber rifled. In very good plus to near fine original condition with just minor imperfections and normal aging. All original flintlock parts and unaltered. Provenance: Chris Anderson of Ft. Carson antiques who hung it over the fireplace in old Governor’s mansion where he resided until his collection was purchased by Little Johns in 1990s. Mr. Anderson felt it was the best chiefs grade Kentucky he had "

several pictures included. [ I have no connection to this ]


Offline JCKelly

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2016, 02:45:30 AM »
With a little imagination those marks on top flat of barrel could be fletching on arrows
arrow designs used on Indian rifles
Wonder how many times $5K it will go for?

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2016, 03:16:13 AM »
 I'll be curious to see what some of the more experienced collectors can contribute regarding the P standing for Indian treaty purchase.   It looks very similar to a rifle described by Robert Sadler as a militia rifle.  The P could actually stand for PanaBecker
« Last Edit: September 17, 2016, 03:23:32 AM by Shreckmeister »
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Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2016, 06:24:05 AM »
I would be more inclined to believe the "P" is more likely to be an indication that the barrel had been proofed. I think it unlikely that a treaty rifle of that time period would be .36 cal. Just for starters. The gun is of very high quality, and not at all garish in its decorations, which again leads me to believe it wasn't made for a Native American. JMO, everybody's got one.

  Hungry Horse

Offline Buck

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2016, 01:34:48 PM »
This is the 2nd one that I've seen, the explanation I received is that the "P" is a proof mark and that it was made for the Indians. It's a nice rifle, this and the one that I had the opportunity to examine. Not a "Golden Age" gun but a good conditioned piece with some "Historical Value."

Buck

 

Offline Mike Brooks

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2016, 07:11:50 PM »
Nothing to do with "Chiefs" or any other grades of Indians. It's a very nice Philadelphia made KY rifle. I have seen "P" stampings on all sorts of American made muzzleloaders, military, civilian, nothing to do with the indian trade otherwise you'd see that stamp on all the smooth bored trade guns built by American makers for the indian trade.
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Offline Buck

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2016, 11:56:18 PM »
Tyron (according to some info I googled) supplied 1000 rifles to the government for trade with the Indians 1832 - 1833 from "Firearms of the Fur Trade". They were supplied to the Choctaw, Seneca and Shawnee Indians. As far as being "Chiefs" guns, nothing is mentioned.

Another article written on the history of the Tryon rifle states that the "P" is a proof mark for the barrel maker, the bottom flat of the barrel reads "Panabacker" another spelling of the famous Pannabecker barrel making family. This would make sense with the manufacture dates of the 1830's. This is not the only "Proof Mark" that can be found on the Tryon Brand. It's interesting to note that Leman worked for them from 1832 -1834 before starting his own company.


Buck
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 12:22:23 AM by Buck »

Offline Hurricane ( of Virginia)

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Re: auction item that looks very interesting...tho i am not knowledgeable:
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2016, 09:04:11 PM »
Sold for $8,500.
Hurricane