Annealing sheet brass

[BJH]

I am working on beating up a sheet brass but piece for my grandsons rifle it is a early English styled gun. Using .070 sheet brass I'm trying to do a better than trade gun quality but piece. I have the finial filed up and now ready to anneal the sheet for forming and bending. Due to the size of the sheet and the thickness I needed to use two propane torches to achieve the dull glow color change. I turned off the lights in the shop while doing the torch work to see the color change better. Now comes the first stage of the cupping and bending......BJH

[Bill Raby]

   Don't bother with two torches. Non-ferrous metals are very easy to anneal. When it glows, it is annealed. Not important to keep it evenly heated. Only matters if it thin sheet that is hardened unevenly. Then it can warp. But you can always just bend it back if that happens. Look for a dull orange glow. But leave the lights on unless they are very bright. Normal room lighting is perfect. If the lights are out you will see the glow at a cooler temperature.

[jerrywh]

 Don't quench it when it's red hot. 

[rich pierce]

For cupping you can use a lead block as the form and a wooden punch that has been shaped. Pound and form the scoop in the lead first

[BJH]

The butt piece is finished and fitted to the gun. It was a bit of a challenge but it still only took a few hours to make and fit. I have pictures taken of my process and intend to post them as soon as I figure out how to get them from this I pad. BJH

[Daryl]

Don't quench it when it's red hot.

Why no quench, Jerry?

[BJH]

First I filed out the finial on the butt piece bank..




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Pencil Layout


Rough Mortis



Underlug soldered on



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Inletting Underlug





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Layout for drilling the underlug


Drilling and pinning the underlug



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After lot's of beating and bending plus another round of annealing, final installation!

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[BJH]

I had to e mail my pics to my sons IBM, then we posted them. Heck first pics in a thousand posts! After I started bending I found that I needed to re anneal the but piece. Then I bent it close enough to drill and countersink for the top screw. I installed the screw and continued bending till I was ready to drill and install the bottom screw. The butt stock was crowned so some more beating was applied. I took off the butt piece and did some more judicious bending and tweeking and reinstalled it. Lots of tapping and bending, but now I'm satisfied. I steamed the finial inlets with the butt plate installed and did away with my couple of gaps. Then filed and sanded every thing up. This process was a variation of the process I used for installing my type G trade gun butt pieces. The comb finial has more dome and the butt has more crown on this rifle butt. BJH

[rich pierce]

Good work!

[Bill Raby]

Don't quench it when it's red hot.

Why no quench, Jerry?

   Brass should be quenched for annealing. But not while it is still glowing. That makes it brittle. Let cool until the glow goes away, then quench. A thin sheet of brass will anneal in a few seconds. If it is thicker it can take a minute or two. Just hold it at a dull orange glow. No need to heat the whole piece at once. For the brass butt plate shown in the pictures, about 10 to 15 seconds should be good enough. Just work the heat from one end to the other.

[BartSr]

Don't quench it when it's red hot.

Why no quench, Jerry?

I do quench when it's hot, Can't wait for the darn thing to cool down.

Paul

[n stephenson]

BJH , Nice Job!!!

[Ky-Flinter]

BJH,
Nice work on the BP and thanks for posting pictures of the process.

-Ron

[Daryl]

Don't quench it when it's red hot.

Why no quench, Jerry?

I do quench when it's hot, Can't wait for the darn thing to cool down.

Paul

I also quench my brass when red hot - never had one go brittle, but if you get it too much past red heat in a darkened room - is  becomes over-soft and is garbage.

When using a good heat source, there can a fine line between perfect & too much.  Some guys only anneal until they see a colour change, & anneal before reloading. Not talking about sheet brass.

[John Archer]

I never quench when annealing brass...no need to. Just lay the hot piece on the anvil to cool. Also...no need to heat the brass red hot...just heat it until the flame from your torch turns to a yellow/orange color as it reflects from the brass.

John.

[BJH]

This time I had trouble getting the brass hot enough. When I did my first bends it was defiantly springy. I could not see the brass glowing in my normal shop lighting. I need to get a more powerful torch. Last time I used thinner brass and could see it glow in normal shop light, and it definitely was much softer. I also quenched it in water while glowing last time. I definitely have a bit to learn. BJH

[Hungry Horse]

I'm one of the quenchers. I never had much luck getting brass good and soft without it. Oh, by the way, a cheap, usually free, source for a depression to form brass, or steel in is the bottom of old oxygen cylinders. They come in several sizes, with different degrees of dish. I even have one made from the bottom of a medical oxygen cylinder that is quite small. Wear ear protection when using these because they ring like a bell.

  Hungry Horse

[jerrywh]

 I didn't say not to quench it. I said don't quench it when it's red hot.  It is best to let it cool down just below a red heat before quenching it. Sometimes it will crack if quenched at a high red heat. The same goes for sterling silver.
  There is a way to harden brass to some extent without working it.  If brass is heated to about 500° F and held at that temperature for a number of hours it will harden some.  I have tried this out and I did not see any significant difference but the metallurgists say it is so.  It is thought that quenching prevents this from happening to any degree. Personally I have been making my own patch boxes and side plates for 60 years and I have yet to tell the difference if there is any. I just quench to save the time of waiting for it to cool.
   Many of us know that brass will age harden. Over time the grains in Brass will grow. When this happens it becomes brittle.  I don't think age hardened brass can be annealed but that property is unrelated to the case at hand. I just thought I would mention it.  I suspect the extended heating process does the same thing as age hardening. I never had the time to subject a piece to 500°F for more than 5 hours.