Lyman GPR 54 cal

[Flint62Smoothie]

One also has to realize that the fabric should be washed to remove the sizing from it. This can alter the final measurement. I find that hoop mics w/ the ratchet closure gives the most repeatable & reliable measurements.

[jambuster]

Does anybody know the bore diameter on a Lyman 54. The patches I have are  .015".

[Daryl]

Easy to slug it and find out for sure. Drive a .58 ball into it, run a screw into the ball and pull it out, then you can measure the bore and groove diameters.
Normal groove depths will usually be .012" on larger bores.
Normal bore of a .54, is .540".
.540 + .012" + .012" = .564, groove to groove.
.530" ball + .015" + .015" = .560", thus having a minimum of .002" gap between the bottom of the patch and the bottom of each and every groove.

[Daryl]

To find out if your patch goes to the bottom of the grooves, use a strip of the patch material.
Put a drop of lube about 5 inches from the end of the cloth. Push the ball into the bore over the
lubed part, then gather up the ends of the cloth and pull the ball out.  It should be marked heavily
from the lands and in between that, the cloth weave should be lightly marked by the bottoms of every
groove.

If the ball is not marked all the way around, it will not seal the powder gasses behind it and will likely
burn your patch, perhaps to the point of ignition. This can be a severe fire starter in dry conditions.
Thus, some people who insist on using thin patch combinations add a barrier between the powder and the
ball, such as a wad of cloth, or material like shotgun wads, cards of pressed paper. Some even use wasp nest.

[OldMtnMan]

I don't think a .530 ball and a .015-.018 patch is a light patch, but a normal load. I've used it for decades, won many BP shoots, shot lots of game and haven't started any fires.

It doesn't load easy or hard. Just kind of normal. I could push it in with a short starter, but I choose to give it a smack. I've got big paws and smacking a wooden ball is not a problem. I don't use the little nub on the short starter. I use the long end and drive it all the way in with what I call a light smack. Then push it down easily in one motion with the wooden ramrod.

Simple, easy, and if it wasn't for these threads I wouldn't even think about it. Just load it up and shoot.

[VJM]

I don't think a .530 ball and a .015-.018 patch is a light patch, but a normal load. I've used it for decades, won many BP shoots, shot lots of game and haven't started any fires.

It doesn't load easy or hard. Just kind of normal. I could push it in with a short starter, but I choose to give it a smack. I've got big paws and smacking a wooden ball is not a problem. I don't use the little nub on the short starter. I use the long end and drive it all the way in with what I call a light smack. Then push it down easily in one motion with the wooden ramrod.

Simple, easy, and if it wasn't for these threads I wouldn't even think about it. Just load it up and shoot.

I run the same combo in my GPR's....works well.

[Pukka Bundook]

Me too when I had one.

Daryl, the wasp nest isn't there to form a gasket, it's there to prevent powder getting contaminated if left loaded for some time. (from tallow)

[Daryl]

Me too when I had one.

Daryl, the wasp nest isn't there to form a gasket, it's there to prevent powder getting contaminated if left loaded for some time. (from tallow)

According to Sam Fadala, who seems to be the first(I'd ever heard of) to use Wasp Nest between his patched ball and the powder, it is to prevent the powder gases from blowing past the ball and

 patch my .58, with both just a patched ball and again with a barrier wad between the patched ball and powder, I noted 0 difference in speed. He noticed a large difference, showing his ball and

patch combination sucked - or blew.  He thought this proved a ball and patch could not seal- had he used a real patch, he'd have seen the error of his ways - back in 1978, instead of writing that

 drivel about anti-gasgets and wasp nest to prevent blowby for all these years.

As for your use, Richard, this makes total sense.  When hunting back in the 1980's, I too thought I needed a barrier between the oiled patch and powder, so used to use a slice of 14bore fiber

wad.

When I tried using a wad of anything beneath the ball in my .45 rifle, I lost accuracy. I then experimented with using no barrier wad between the lubed patch and powder and could so no

deleterious effect on accuracy or velocity, in either my .69 nor .45.  I will note, my .69 (14 bore) was not particular about wads or no wads, oil or water based, accuracy & point of impact being

unchanged. The smaller bore usually change poi with a change in lube.

[OldMtnMan]

I think a wad might prevent blowing a thin patch like .010.

[Daryl]

I think a wad might prevent blowing a thin patch like .010.

That's why Sam used a wad.

[smokinbuck]

With all due respect, Sam used, and said, a lot of things and much of it made no sense!
Mark

[rich pierce]

It’s interesting that when muzzleloading started taking off on the 1970s a new crop of writers with no black powder experience “discovered” it and wrote about it. Meanwhile real seasoned shooters all across the country just kept doing what they’d been doing and nobody asked them for the most part. But the mainstream writers did popularize our sport. I was reading they stuff like it was Gospel.

[Daryl]

It was about 1978 or 79, I wrote to the late John Bairde, editor-in-chief of the Buckskin Report, about Sam's stupidity concerning wasp nest and anti-gasgets, etc. I had submitted a scathing article for print in the bi-monthly magazine.  John wrote me back, merely saying, 'Yes, it's BS, but perhaps we should leave him alone.  'Ol Sam means well & he's writing to feed his family.  He's on a really long learning streak!".