Lancaster 1790s?

[JAPA1]

Attached are some photos of what I describe in some detail under a post on my J. Lord rifle. Any guesses on its origins are appreciated. My guess is 1790-1800 Lancaster Pa.

[rich pierce]

The guard looks more Berks to me.  Overall I’m thinking Berks County, 1800 forward,

[JAPA1]

Thank you. It came to me through the Neff family. I think Johanes Neff was a gun Smith in that area. The reason I thought pre-1800 was the patch box being solid (no wood showing on either side of the door) and the stock and butt plate.   I should add I know nothing except what little I can glean from this forum. I have ordered several books that may help.  Thanks!

[Hungry Horse]

I’m inclined to believe it’s a restock using the furniture, and original barrel. I believe the lock is from a newer gun, and the single lock bolt would be out of character for an eighteenth century gun. The total lack of carving, and what appears to be brass pins attaching the barrel, and ramrod pipes, all point to a restock.

  Hungry Horse

[n stephenson]

I’m inclined to believe it’s a restock using the furniture, and original barrel. I believe the lock is from a newer gun, and the single lock bolt would be out of character for an eighteenth century gun. The total lack of carving, and what appears to be brass pins attaching the barrel, and ramrod pipes, all point to a restock.

  Hungry Horse

I am inclined to believe that this is a pretty good account of this piece`s past. The newer stock , and the brass pins were the first things that caught my attention as well. Whoever restocked it , didn't do a shabby job of it !  It is still a nice wall hanger and, conversation piece.     Thanks for posting it. Nate

[JAPA1]

Thanks no doubt the lock is newer. Says “J. Baker” and does not fit the mortising.  See the pictures.  That’s sorts of makes me wonder if the stock is newer why go to the trouble of all that mortise work and digging out the patch box just to slap on the percussion lock on in such a sloppy way? Could it have been restocked in the 1820-30 period for flint and then had a percussion lock added later? It was a part of a group of about 10 rifles and shotguns from 1800 (this one), 1840-55 (a J. Lord Percussion long rifle with signature that looks all original), a smooth bore percussion noted in an earlier post for comment, then 1915-1970 Remington’s about every 10-15 years. The family are preRevolution Pa Germans that hunted every generation and not just for sport. Not the sort to spend money on wall hangers. It’s been in the family aledgedly since new but can only be vouch for since late 19th century.

[JAPA1]

Once I get comfortable it’s a wall hanger (no value or his tic significance), I plan to return it to flint and clean the brass.

[n stephenson]

Sir, I only refered to it as a wallhanger  because , I probably would not recommend shooting it . Nate

[JAPA1]

I plan on hanging it but will not clean it if there is any chance it is original.  I figure leave potentially collectible guns as is.  The patch box had some sort of animal dropping on it that left bright spots when brushed off.

[JAPA1]

Gentlemen,
Thank you for the education. If as I expect it has little value beyond a decoration, I  want to convert it  to flint. Do you know anyone who does good work in the Philadelphia/ Reading/ Lancaster region?

When did round brass pins come into use? I see lots of picture with round pins.  I assume from your comment they are normally iron.  I see guns with the same lack of carving (just a cheek pad) as this one so I am not sure if that is conclusive, but that the stock is obviously built for a single bolt lock seems to confirm your view beyond any doubt.

What I can not understand is if it was restocked in the modern era (20th century) why do a very good job with the stock to then slap on a lock that fits so poorly? If it was mid 19th century then maybe this is lock number two installed for function not appearance. I find the scallop cut in the stock just ahead of the lock strange. It’s as if the builder expected to mount a very different lock.

Thanks again.

[galudwig]

Gentlemen,
Thank you for the education. If as I expect it has little value beyond a decoration, I  want to convert it  to flint. Do you know anyone who does good work in the Philadelphia/ Reading/ Lancaster region?

Brad Emig of Cabin Creek Muzzleloading; Hallam, PA (about 4 miles east of York)
http://cabincreek.net/