Author Topic: Frizzen to Pan fit problem  (Read 762 times)

Offline Timothy88

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Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« on: January 12, 2019, 02:25:05 AM »
I messed up the first pan on this Chambers Large Siler flint lock by filing off too much metal. When I put on a new pan I realized that there was a gap of up to .024 inch between the frizzen and pan. As you can see from the picture below the back left of the frizzen is contacting the pan and there is a gap everywhere else. If I were to just file down the pan until the frizzen fit properly, the frizzen would be tilted too far back.



What would be the best way to fix this problem?

The two possible solutions that I have come up with would be to lower the frizzen pivot or add more metal to the bottom of the frizzen, but I wanted to see if any of you had better ideas before trying anything.

Also, If any other photo angles would be beneficial please let me know.



Below are more photos:






















Offline Dennis Glazener

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2019, 02:30:50 AM »
I would order a new Frizzen from Jim.
Dennis
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Online rich pierce

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2019, 02:58:46 AM »
Agree. Unless you get someone to weld up the frizzen pivot bolt hole, re-fit it and drill it but that could get ugly and itís harder than fitting a new frizzen. 
St. Louis, Missouri

Offline Eric Krewson

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2019, 03:08:25 AM »
This how I do it;


Offline tiswell

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2019, 04:12:08 AM »
Full disclosure, I am a rookie. Having said that I ran into this with the last lock I worked on. I would first flatten the pan face with a file and create a flat plane. Then I would go after the frizzen with a file. It will be pretty hard metal near the frizzen face. I resisted the temptation to get near the belt sander. Harbor Freight sells a diamond file set that will cut it. It took me several evenings to get the fit where I was happy with it. A test with a flint showed a shower of sparks. The couple degrees that it moved the frizzen face didn't seem to matter. You kind of have to out guess where on the bottom of the frizzen you remove material from or you keep chasing it. I used Eric Krewson's method of prussian blue to zero in on a great fit. Also, check it with the frizzen spring as it imparts a slight change in geometry due to the clearance between the frizzen pivot screw hole and the screw. If you have the time, give it a try.

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Offline Dave B

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2019, 08:58:49 AM »
If a person were to take a needle file and take out only the side of the hole that needs to be opened to use a slightly larger shanked screw you could drop that  gap a tad. You could turn a screw that had the same size threaded end just a larger shank pulling down the frizzen on to the pan. Just a thought.
Dave Blaisdell

Offline M. E. Pering

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2019, 09:32:19 AM »
Dave B has a good idea there... That is definitely a possible fix for the existing frizzen.  The primary problem would be getting the drill aligned and started in the right position, but then again, with the frizzen clamped to the lock plate, it might not be that big an issue.  Just be very careful to make sure the over-sized shank is drilled lined up perfectly with the threads of the pan bridle, and not to drill through the bridle either.  Great idea, Dave B.  :)

Matt

Offline flehto

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2019, 03:48:35 PM »
W/ any of Chambers'  flintlocks I've never had to file a flat fit between the pan and frizzen....just  some smoothing w/ 220 grit paper.

I'd send it back to Chambers for possibly  a new frizzen { if it's screwed up}  and a new pan/bolster.  I've replaced the frizzen on one LR by clamping  the frizzen on  the pan and then drilling the pivot hole....then hardening and tempering the frizzen. Not a difficult task if you know what is req'd......Fred

Offline Strong Bear

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2019, 05:38:59 PM »
In my opinion Jim and Barbie Chambers are the best and great to deal with.  I would send it to them and explain you messed it up and ask them to fix it and of course you may have to pay for the repair but it will be done right and you don't have to worry about any further problems you can cause by trying to fix it.  Just an experienced opinion. :)

Dave
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Offline fahnenschmied

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2019, 05:45:44 PM »
A few strokes with a file at the back of the pan to lower that, or a kiss on a sanding belt or grinder on the underside of the frizzen near the face of it would do.  It will not much affect the angle of the closed frizzen.

Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2019, 06:41:23 PM »
2FFG isn't going to fall through the gap....

It's not a seal of any kind, it's not waterproof.

To me, if you're going to fix it, I'd go with a new frizzen that's not drilled at the pivot. You may have to anneal it to work it properly. While soft, it's easy to file all the cosmetic surfaces.

Get frizzen red hot, and bury it in a can of wood ashes or dry sawdust. Let stay there until cool.

Tom
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Offline SingleMalt

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2019, 07:19:33 PM »
Alternate file strokes on the pan surface and pan will help close the gap.  The trick is to go very slow and check often.  I prefer a bright light as opposed to transfer color.
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Offline Turtle

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2019, 07:42:25 PM »
Aren't frizzens too hard to file?

Offline Eric Krewson

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2019, 08:08:42 PM »
My locks are all Chambers and I can file the frizzen pan cover with needle files.

Offline Timothy88

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Re: Frizzen to Pan fit problem
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2019, 07:27:45 PM »
Thank you everyone for the suggestions.

I should probably have stated more clearly that this is not how the lock was when I received it. I filed the first pan improperly and had to replace it.

Also, this is not a lock directly from Jim and Barbie Chambers, and I got a really good deal on it so I feel like trying to fix it myself.

For the size gap that I have at the front of the pan, I think that the lock would at-best look strange if I filed the pan and frizzen so that they fit tightly. The gap of .024 inch between the frizzen and pan is at the spot indicated in the photo below.



I think I will try to fill the pivot hole on the frizzen with a welder, anneal the frizzen, and re-drill the pivot since I have welded before. If that doesn't work, I will send it to Jim and Barbie Chambers to have a new frizzen fitted.