Author Topic: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May  (Read 2130 times)

Offline pjmcdonald

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3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« on: April 19, 2019, 05:22:32 AM »
Iíve posted pictures of my old family rifle before. Finally decided to build sort of an homage to that gun. Iím doing several things differently to suit my own tastes: simple trigger, flintlock, longer pull, and cast off. Trying to keep the rest in the same style.

I started this project at Jimís class in March. Since then Iíve made a little progress. Forged buttplate, fabricated trigger guard, slimmed up and started shaping. I must have had 1/8Ē or more too much wood on the lower forestock. Iíve inlet the trigger plate and guard twice.

Yes, the butt is two pieces scabbed together. The walnut my uncle sawed 15 or 20 years ago for my cousin. He didnít know how much drop to leave in the blank. My cousin was killed in a automobile accident a few years ago so his dad gave me the wood. My cousin and I were close. I couldnít throw it away or use it for anything else, so I decided to make it work. I think somehow a bit of his spirit lives on in that wood - hard headed and a wicked sense of humor!

Specs: tapered 36Ē barrel in .45 from Rice, L&R lock I picked up from Jack Garner, one of Jackís triggers. The rest by me.

Anyway, here are photos of the progress to date. Original can be seen in several photos for comparison. Comments and critiques welcome.

























« Last Edit: May 05, 2019, 07:41:39 AM by pjmcdonald »

Online rich pierce

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2019, 05:51:06 AM »
Coming along nicely!
St. Louis, Missouri

Offline flinchrocket

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2019, 11:39:14 PM »
Paul your hardware looks pretty good. Is the original from the north western part of NC?

Offline mountainman70

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2019, 11:53:06 PM »
Lookin good to me,too. I have had a liken to those 3/4 stocked rifles since I saw  Alvin York shootin one. Especially the lightning strike.
Any idea as to why the old timers made em that way?
Keep at it, I like the mounts,too. Best regards, Dave F 8) 8)

Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2019, 04:59:19 AM »
I like your hand made furniture a lot. I think the gun having a rather fancy single trigger is untypical for the region. Iíve seen some pretty primitive hog rifles with nice set triggers. The 3/4 stock is rather appealing to me as well. Very nice work.

  Hungry Horse

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2019, 06:31:05 AM »
Flinchrocket, the original is from the far western tip of NC, around Murphy. May have been made around Asheville, as some of the family migrated down from there abouts. No signature or mark anywhere I can find.

Hungry Horse, I plan to simplify the single trigger. I thought about double set but I really like shooting a single.

No idea why they made 3/4 stock but I really like it. Copying the pewter nose cap will be an interesting challenge. The zig-zag is tight.




Thanks,
Paul

Online Dennis Glazener

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2019, 03:25:01 PM »
Lookin good to me,too. I have had a liken to those 3/4 stocked rifles since I saw  Alvin York shootin one. Especially the lightning strike.
Any idea as to why the old timers made em that way?
Keep at it, I like the mounts,too. Best regards, Dave F 8) 8)

I have seen several 3/4 and half stocks from western NC an I think they were all full stocks when originally built. Have no idea about this one without seeing it in hand.

I had a barrel with a rib and lollipop tang that I used on a rifle I built. When I pulled the rib off, what I thought were revets were screws that screwed into dovetail lugs.never noticed the dovetails until I pulled the under rib loose.
Dennis
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Offline Bob Roller

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2019, 03:40:20 PM »
Back in 1958 I built a 58 caliber half stock rifle and the rib overlapped the bottom flat
and I made sliding nuts that caught the screws which were a non standard extra fine
thread.It had a 1and 1/8" Bill Large barrel about 33" long and a drum and nipple instead
of a bolster breech.I went to a gun show in Dodge City Kansas in 1960 and bought a
Malcolm telescopic sight with mounts for $25 and mounted it on this barrel.It was a
full length scope and I got some really good 100 and 200 yard groups by using it.

Bob Roller 

Offline mountainman70

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2019, 04:50:31 PM »
Hey PJ, how long is the original barrel? This is giving me some notions. Thanks, Dave F 8) 8)

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2019, 06:28:03 AM »
Dave F,

Original barrel is just a hair under 33Ē. LOP is 12-7/8Ē.

Iím 6í5Ē. So building to fit me, I managed to get 13-3/4Ē LOP out of the wood I had. Went with a longer barrel, 36Ē. So Iím adjusting to keep proportional.

Dennis,

Iíve had this one apart several times. No evidence it was shortened from a full stock. Jim Parker was kind enough to look it over too. Still, it might have been.

The original was .32 or .36 cal. I had Bob Hoyt give it the once over and bore to .45. Barrel is in good shape. Havenít fired the old girl yet. Weak mainspring wonít pop a cap. I donít know if I should try to replace or re-temper. I havenít learned how to fix mainsprings yet.

Paul

Offline Bob Roller

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #10 on: April 21, 2019, 02:53:07 PM »
Retempering an old mainspring is what Bill Large used to call "High Powered Guess Work".
I have tried it with a 100% failure rate.No problems with KNOWN steel or at least none
reported.You have an interesting project going on and we all want to see the final result.
Is that really a 3/4 stock rifle or was it a very long barreled half stock when it was new? ;D

Bob Roller

Offline Hungry Horse

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2019, 04:37:29 PM »
PJ;

  I only mentioned the single trigger because I seem to shoot better with a primitive single trigger than I do with any kind of set trigger. So, when I built my SMR, I forged my own trigger, and have been very happy with it. My gun looks very much like a North Carolina built gun, but I always get a hard time from the all knowing experts over my primitive trigger. So be forewarned.

  Hungry Horse

Offline Daryl

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2019, 06:15:52 AM »
Single triggers tend to make you hold through the shot, instead of knowing instantly when it's going off, which perhaps, promotes flinching.
I was that was for a time- shooting better with single triggers. Now, it doesn't matter so much.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Online rich pierce

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2019, 03:16:38 PM »
If the mainspring has plenty of mass it is worth re-working by opening it up 1/8-1/4Ē it not only needs to pop the cap, but keep the hammer down after firing.

If it is puny (narrow and thin) then it will probably fail if you open it up to try to strengthen it.

There are dozens of threads on spring making and tempering here.
St. Louis, Missouri

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2019, 11:01:31 PM »
All, thanks for the replies.

Bob & Rich, thanks for advice on mainspring. I will dig back through the form posts and research before I tackle that job. Meanwhile, Iíll keep plugging away on this one.

HH, I expected criticism of single trigger. Itís a mental thing - I just like them. As Daryl mentioned, I tend to hold through better with a simple trigger.

Thanks,

Paul

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2019, 05:23:40 AM »
Well, managed to screw up TG inlet. Somehow I bent the guard so when I re-inlet, it was crooked. I had recut inlet after taking down a bunch of extra wood in forstock.



Figured I had 3 options:
Live with it.
Make a new, wider front extension on TG to cover.
Patch the wood and inlet, yet again.

I went with option 3.








Finally starting to really take shape.

Paul


Offline bama

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2019, 03:42:01 PM »
Paul youíre learning one of the most important things about being a good gunsmith, how to fix your mistakes. 😁 you are doing a great job on your family rifle build and it is really starting to shape up. Please keep us posted.
Jim Parker

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Offline Nordnecker

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2019, 02:06:39 PM »
Sometimes you gotta roll with the punches. Been there, done that. The lugs are sometimes off-center. You inlet the lug on the centerline and it makes the part shift. You don't realize it until too late.

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle
« Reply #18 on: May 05, 2019, 07:40:10 AM »
After some significant weight loss, hereís where Iím at.  Dampened with water to raise the grain and get an idea of color. I think Iím pretty close to shape but if anyone sees where I might improve or clean up, please advise. I know there is still a good deal of finish sanding and scraping.

Thanks,
Paul












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Offline flinchrocket

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #19 on: May 06, 2019, 02:06:43 AM »
Looking good! That piece of wood is perfect for your rifle.

Offline bama

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2019, 05:03:43 PM »
Hi Paul, the stock looks great from what I can see. If you havenít started putting the finish on yet, make sure to take a good look at the lock panels. Going back over your pictures in this thread, it appears that the side plate panel is larger and longer than the lock panel. You may not have been through shaping that panel when you took these photos. Again, you are doing a great job. Bring it to the October class and letís do some shooting. 😁
Jim Parker

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Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2019, 06:54:28 PM »
Jim,

Thanks, I have not started the finish yet. I will go back over the side plate panel again. You are right, it is a bit larger and longer than lock plate side. I've been very slowly working it down. Trying not to get carried away with rasps, sticking to scrapers and fine files!

Right now I'm preparing to cast the pewter nose cap. A little more carving to do then find some pewter. After the nose cap, last major tasks before finishing are attach under-rib, fabricate and attach ramrod pipe, draw file barrel, and install sights. Then lots of polish work to do on lock before bluing metal parts.

I've read through just about everything I can find on attaching an under-rib and am still undecided as to method: solder, screws, or rivets. Most likely I'll use rivets but I'm nervous about drilling into the barrel.

I'm playing with the idea of side plate escutcheons or some sort of decorative side plate.

I think this is going to be a very light, quick handling little rifle. Ideal for plinking or deer hunting. I look forward to bringing it in October!

Paul

Offline bama

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #22 on: May 11, 2019, 04:08:36 PM »
Paul I prefer to solder my ribs on. I have tried the rivets but did not like the results. I have also screwed them down, to me this is better than the rivets. The biggest thing with soldering is learning to control your temperature and having clean mating surfaces. If you over heat the solder will not stick and if youíre surfaces are not clean the solder will not stick. You also need a good flux. If you decide to solder let me know and I can give you more details.
Jim Parker

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Offline mountainman70

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #23 on: June 20, 2019, 03:46:35 AM »
Hey PJ, makin any more progress on this  build? Dave 8) 8)

Offline pjmcdonald

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Re: 3/4 stock NC mountain rifle - progress as of 4 May
« Reply #24 on: June 20, 2019, 04:31:10 AM »
Dave,

Got the nose cap poured. And melted off again and prepared to pour again. 😤 Also have under rib and ramrod pipe done. Unfortunately, the Army got in the way. Iím up at Carlisle Barracks, PA, for a couple weeks. Should be close to finishing all but metal polishing when I get back. Iíll post photos then.

Thanks for asking,

Paul