AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: pathfinder on November 11, 2012, 05:38:38 PM
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I think life has slowed down on throwing me som curves,so now I can concentrate on re-building my shop. I build M/L guns and all the stuff that it entails,leather horn,ect. Thats going to be all that's going to be done in there.
I have a 10X24 pad on my property that I could build a stand off shop,or,...
Build a pole barn with a room for my shop,or....
Clear a spot in the wood's for any size shop.
It's mostly for enjoyment. I'll sell stuff too,not on a large scale business,but mostly a place to work out my re-tirement.
Any suggestion's as to size? What size is your's?
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When I built my shop I thoght it was going to be plenty big at 36 x 24. But it filled up quickly. My problem is I like collecting stuff. If I had built one twice its size I would still have a problem. The reality is a bunch of our members here make due with a basement room, small out building or garage. For me it was what was the biggest I could build affordably at the time. John Biven's didn't have a huge shop and only a small number of power tools. He didnt have a lathe in 97 I had four. so if you can I would build a pole building encompasing the slab in one corner. Enclose that area as your gun building/ project area and have the rest as potential expansion and the need arises.
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I work out of a paper bag, in a puddle.
My shop is narrow, about 8' wide x 20' long. Most of that length is used up by doorways and entries. So I use a 8' section in the middle. Benches on front and back. Works OK for one person, two people, it's a traffic jam.
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I think mine is about 10 X 20. It works fine, but it can feel tight at times. I have some other stuff in there too (freezer, all my shooting and hunting stuff, etc).
I don't have a bandsaw, but I work from pre-carves for the most part, so I can get by without one. If I had a bandsaw, with enough room around it to really use it, I think mine would be getting really tight.
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Build the pole barn. It will be full in less than 5 years. Tools are like those litte sponge animals that you put in water and they expand to 20 times their original size.
I know one guy that bought two of the large overseas shipping containers, put them side by side and cut a door between them. He sprayed the inside with that mulched paper insulation with fire retardant in it and built a roof over them. Made a nice, secure shop relatively inexpensively.
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My shop is 36x20, but a lot of that is used for storage , a bath room, and some big power tools. If I was just doing gun and accouterment work, then I could get by with less. I think 20x20 with 10x10 under a shed roof for the forge would work. I could probably get away with a little less. In the 20x20 I would have two 6-8' benches, a drawing table, tool chests, parts/supplies storage on shelves, a 14" bandsaw, 15" drill press, 7x12 metal lathe, 16x24 wood lathe, belt sander and slow speed grinder. I would suggest you identify everything you will need and lay it out all to scale on a plan. I made little scale model cutourts of all my stuff and moved it around on a plan to get the design of my shop.
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You know, the storage container idea is not bad. You can get used shipping containers at a port for a couple hundred dollars each and get them moved to your site for less than a hundred, assuming you live near a port. I actually worked out of a rented 20' container for the better part of a year while my shop was being built. Mine was built for storage and had a translucent fiberglass roof. You put it on some blocks, build some steps or a ramp up the door, run a heavy duty extension cord, and you are in business. They come 20' and 40' and are about 8' wide. I also know someone who bought two, put them a container widths part and put a roof over them to store his cars and boats.
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I see you are 58, (same as me) just planning or getting an early retirement? chuck
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I'm mediclly re-tired after a semi ran me over. healed up as good as I'll be,so,it's for fun. Alway's worked with my hand's. Antique restoration,clockmaking,ect...
I like the idea of long and narrow with LOT'S of window's. Very secluded where I'm at,and Bouvier's will be my security!
And Joe,I'm moving in with you!
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What equipment do you plan on having and how much lumber storage, etc., I would think these would play a big role in space needed. I would go as big as possible but thats just me. Mine is roughly 16'x25' I think and thats ok for now but would love bigger, with an shed roof or forge room off one side. I would think that if your current space piles up with stuff double what you think you want???
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My shop is narrow, about 8' wide x 20' long. Most of that length is used up by doorways and entries. So I use a 8' section in the middle. Benches on front and back. Works OK for one person, two people, it's a traffic jam.
Nearly identical in size to my rod shop but so far just one doorway. I find if I make myself keep the area picked up it is enough for one dedicated use. I have one long purpose built bench and some large old sets of drawers on one side, one antique "gentleman's woodworking bench and room for a good sized lathe on the other .
The gun bench is still in the garage until one of the other side of the big shed/small barn gets the new roof next year then a new floor and another shop is set up for gunsmthing and misc woodworking.
but i found this to be a help when deciding what would fit in a given space.
http://www.grizzly.com/workshopplanner.aspx
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My shop is about 18x20 and if I add one more tool,I will have leave the building
to change my mind. I am going to do a bit or re-arrangeing,maybe tomorrow and
add a bit of storage space.
Bob Roller
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I have a 20' x 24' shop & I'm extremely picky about what goes in it! Gun stuff & motorcycles (& a ride on mower in winter), that's all! ;)
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My home shop is 20'x24' I think, with a 16'x20' storage building out back. If I can get one built-in bench ripped out this winter, I can move my wood lathe, and table saw, and band say, and my cabinet bench, and my stocking bench, and then maybe I can actually use any 3 of the above in the same day!
I've also got the use of a 30'x60' shop at a friend's place; I do a lot of lumber prep work there for furniture and cabs (my jointer and planer are over there). It is nice to have the space when working on larger projects, even if I haven't done any that require it for a couple years.
Then there are the drying sheds for lumber . . . .
But there is never enough space. TOF has the right idea--build the pole barn. If you're one of those guys who plans things, plan not for what you have today, but for what you hope to have someday and the work you might do in the future. Otherwise you might find yourself in my shoes--trying to figure how and where I can "shoehorn" in a 12"x72" Southbend lathe, so I can have it up and running before its hundredth birthday.
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Mine is one section of a 3 car garage. I made a 4 foot wide door so I can move machinery in and out. I put my boring bench and rifling machine on furniture dollies so I can roll them out on the driveway so I can use them. Thats the problem with a narrow shop, no room to work!!
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Great replies guy's! Due to the accident,my forge day's are over,even though I cant seem to part with it. So it's just a band saw,drill press and thickness planner for powertool's. So I'm guessing the 10X24 Salt Boxstyle is what I'll do. My contracter say's the wife's 2 car garage and my shop should be done in less than 30 day's.
What better Christmas gift than to be able to start building in my new shop! Pic's to follow when done.
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We tend to accumulate lots of "stuff" in our shops and like them big. The known colonial and federal era shops of individual gunsmiths were quite small, maybe a room or two in a, by today's standards, small house or a small outbuilding. 10 x 24 would have been a largish shop with a smith and at least one apprentice working it it. I'm working in 600 sq. ft. with a loft of 450 sq. feet for storage plus a chicken coop that is also storage.....
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It's just too easy for too much "stuff" to accumulate if allowed to. Yes I allow it too. 14x28 stick-built portable storage barn is what i use. I wired and insulated it (partially). Have two skylights, but must cover them in Summer. Heated with wood, cooled with window unit.
Plenty big if i didn't let all subjects of shopwork collide in there.
I once had a much larger shop...absolutely awful for hoarders-took forever to move all the $#@* out and had to trash much of it.
If you focus on keeping Storage and Workspace separated, then you'll enjoy a small workspace much more. It helps to be "anal" about keeping it orderly...I am not, but i do enjoy those fleeting moments of apparent organization after I do a flurry of cleaning up.
Small is cheaper, requires organization. Large allows sloppiness and is harder to heat/cool.
The double container setup sounds good-depending on how the floor is treated WRT insulation/condensation etc. I'd use one side for storage and grinding-type operations, the other side for main working space and work hard to keep the storage/nasty work side from spilling into the main side.
but we's all different.
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My shop is 12x12 and too small. It's not so bad until I get to trying to saw out stock blanks (or handle other long materials), then there's just not enough room and too much stuff in the way.
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Mine is 8x12 and cramped. I bump into myself when I turn around. I'm working on my fifth longrifle in it. I had hoped to start on a new shop by now. I want to build 12 x 16 and hopefully have enough room to get my forge inside. I may have to trade a rifle for some lumber.
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Mine is a basement garage space. Gun work is constantly competing with everything else that needs fixing--a lawnmower is sitting upside down in the middle of the floor right now. Dedicated space is my dream.
A couple of guys here have mentioned having more than one bench. Having two benches has really helped me deal with tendonitis, bad eyesight, and back pain.
I have one low bench that is very heavy, but movable. It has splayed legs, so that it won't tip. The top is a 2' x 3 1/2' rectangle. I have one heavy machinist vise mounted on one corner. On the other end I have a movable block (with a slab of thick leather glued to its top) that I clamp down with screw clamps. I can move it to accomodate what I'm working on. This gives me a good height for heavy work, like inletting a barrel. The height of this table is determined by the height of the vise, and I set it at 38 inches to the top of vise jaws. (This is a good height for me. I'm 6 ft.)
I have another bench, a long one, bolted to the wall and set under a window for light. I have small vises bolted to each corner, and set so that the height to the top of the jaws is 47 inches. This works well for me to do light, detail work, without having to bend over to see it. Having a vise on either end allows me to clamp the forestock or buttstock as necessary in either the right or left end vise as needed, put the work area under the window. But note that this tall bench would not work at all for heavy work, as it absolutaly kills my elbows to do any heavy work at that height. And I could never do the detail work at the low bench, without killing my back.
I'm describing all this here on a string about shop size for the simple reason that if my shop, small as it is, wasn't big enough to accomodate both benches, I would proably not be able to work on guns. Having both of these allows me to avoid over-stressing my elbow and back.
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If I remember my Shumway correctly, George Shroyers shop was 12x12?
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“Small rooms or dwellings discipline the mind, large ones weaken it.” Leonardo Da Vinci
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The "2" bench shop is a MUST! I've pretty much settled on a 10X24. One long wall will be window's and full length bench. It'll be a Muzzleloading ONLY shop. My 2 Farmall's,Xena,'49 Cub,and Lucrecia,'43 "H" will have their own shed's,their spoiled!
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Shops, like lathes are never big enough. Think about what you want to do, the tools you'll need to do it and the space that will require. Build shop accordingly. I have 4 properties with buildings, all full of stuff I don't need and can't find most of the time. My Gun Shop is L shaped 12 feet wide 24 feet on the long side 18 feet on the short side. Not big enough but comfortable to work in and well lighted.
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Having more than one bench is like having a ping pong or pool table. They rapidly get repurposed and disappear under a pile of clutter stacked on top of them.
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Path finder I'd strongly suggest a 12x24, it will cost you virtually nothing extra and you'll enjoy that extra 2 feet.
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Having more than one bench is like having a ping pong or pool table. They rapidly get repurposed and disappear under a pile of clutter stacked on top of them.
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oh, so that's where the desk and surface plate went.
daVinci eh? hoo gnu?
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Finally got enough decent weather so that the Amish are showing up this weekend to build my 12X24 work shop! I cant frikken wait!
I liked all the reply's and advice! It's a constant fight with my "cluter devil's" as I empty out the storage shed,gathering together my stuff. It's SO nice seeing my "old friend's" again! Tool's and thing's I've had and used for the last 50 years.
I'll be putting in window's as the need arises. Have to wire and bench build first.
There will be a 4'X6' free standing bench in the center toward's 1 end. Bench and shelves along 1 wall,which are 8'high.
It's sided in rough sawn pine with a metal roof. Pic's when done.
Thank's for all the advise fella's!
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Heating a small shop is easier than a large shop or cooling it if you need to. Even with a wood stove. Mine is a 16' X 20' log cabin my son and I built. The work bench area is 10' X 16' and the rest is storage for lumber, stock blanks and our trekking gear. I have a bandsaw, a thickness planer, drill press with enough room to work on one gun or one furniture project at a time. The forge is under an attached shed roof outside the cabin. Nothing is heated or cooled, no room for a stove and too cheap for a AC window unit. Might do more work if I had some climate control but usually once I get going I don't notice....much. Still if you got to heat or cool it - take size into consideration. Also lighting. Plan out the lighting and the position of your wall outlets for power.
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May not be an issue to most folks; but seems as if you have your shop in the basement or attached to your home you will get more work done. Handy, already heated and maybe cooled. You will more likely get off the kitchen chair and move your ol bod to the shop (maybe in your slippers and casual clothes to do all those little things that need attention to your projects. Takes less 'push' to get you started at the bench than getting dressed in heavy mackinaw etc and wander down the yard etc and you will get more done. Just a thought.;. ::)
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Stand alone shops work best for me. I've had the others,too easy to get interupted,and some of the stuff used really can smell up the house!
Small propane heater on a thermostate to keep the frost off the pumpkin,wood stove as the primary heat source.
I plan on the shop being a "home away from home" I have a lot of projects to get caught up on so I'll make it comfy. Plan on having a sign over the door"No gurls allowed"! ;D
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My first "shop" was a 5x7 foot space by the water heater in the corner of my garage. Very hot in Alabama summers and cold in the winters.
When I moved to a place I could build a shop I opted for a 28X30 building with half being for tractor, mowers, 4 wheeler and assorted garden tools, the other half was strictly a man cave /shop.
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv181%2Fekrewson%2Fshopoutside.jpg&hash=e162f3da145d3eae7692cd0de5a450a40622e799)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv181%2Fekrewson%2Fbow%2520making%2Fshop08-2.jpg&hash=6dc6f0be084e05957542b678ec9e1deebf6f949b)
After filling the house full of saw dust from my garage shop and later working out of my basement while my shop was being built I felt I needed a dust collection system in my shop. I put a 2hp Griz system in, doesn't stop the dust but makes it tolerable.
After sweltering during the summers in my garage I also decided I needed a well insulated shop with heat and air. My wall mounted air conditioner can heat as well, really makes working in th shop a joy.
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I have to move the 10X12 Sears shed off the pad first before my shop gets here. So much to do before it gets here!
I think the 12X24 with 8' walls will be plenty big. I have cut back on the hobbies I have persued in the past. Guns and accoutrement's,Grandfather and regulator clock's,and static model planes and boat's. That's all. Should keep me busy for a while.
The clock's are a nice diversion from gun's and let's me connect with my Father who passed in '08. Him and I have spent a lot of time working together making clock's and restoring piano's. No room for piano's though!
I bough a really nice piece of wood from Dennis and am having the barrel let into,so that may be the first project. I also have a realy nice hunk of 5p+ maple that has curl that looks like the teeth of a fine tooth comb that may be a .32 Bedford. Can ya tell I'm excited?
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Mine is 30 x 40 split into 2, 20 x 30 rooms. I'm thinking about building a 60 x 40 so I have some place to put all the extra stuff that's in my way.
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My "SHOP" is a corner of what in Georgia is referred to as a "bonus room". The actual dimensions of my work area are about 6' x 12' with a couple of benches along the long wall and a small vise table and a stand alone drill press. The band saw gets moved around at times when I need it. If it was any bigger I'd never be able to find anything. HAHA!
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Well the old shop that I showed you pictures of with the top nailed Southern yellow pine floors is going to a new owner April 30.
The new place; a ranch condo with no yard maintenance has a 20' X 18' room above the garage with three windows in one wall!! also adjacent to a full bath!! (Humidifier !!!) Just putting vinyl flooring that look like wood on this one..
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Moved to my present location about 20 years ago. My spouse had 1 major requirement: The shop must be outside the house so that the sawdust and other dirt gets knocked off before you enter.
The place we bought had a 24' x 36' "pole barn". Sheet metal over heavy wood frame, wired 220 volt, just used for storage by previous owner.
I remodeled; split the 36' length into 3 parts. South part has library, office and a head. Middle part is for wood work with 1 bench, band saw on moveable base, floor mount drill press, browning cabinet, finish drying cabinet, stock storage and other miscellaneous storage and also a 9' x 9' roll-up door for large thing access. North part is further divided in 2 parts: 2/3 is metal work with mill-drill, 12x36 metal lathe, metal cutting band saw, and floor mount drill press, and wwork bench w? machinist vise; other 1/3 is grinding , polishing and welding. Have people access dors in each of the 4 corners, one window in office access door, plastic windows between interior rooms. We have a mild climate and I double insulated the walls and ceiling when wiring and dry wall installation. 1500 watt electric heater in each room serves when required.
Has prooved to be just right for my needs and didn't cost too much.
Dave Dolliver