AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Gun Collecting => Topic started by: Longknife on June 26, 2009, 11:51:02 PM
-
I am going Sunday to take a look an original flint rifle signed "W Hoffman", Does anyone have any info on him? Thanks, Ed
.
I just took a look at this long rifle can't maker out ther name and the pic of the signature came out BAD. The initial is a W but the name is HOFFMAN OF GOFFMEN or HOLLMAN or GOLLMAN???? Its realy is NICE with a 46 1/2 inch barrel but a poorly re-converted flintlock. I can also see that it spent much of its life as a perc. and am wondering if it ever was a flint??? Check out the STRANGE engraving on the lock. There is only one lock bolt but a threaded hole is there for another??? any ideas as to maker, school, VALUE--Its for sale...Thanks
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2713.jpg&hash=cbc26042fe668b5be144ee0d2783a6d546385c01)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2708.jpg&hash=c1951610aee2ef6bd37c1f598433b9643c433f59)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2709.jpg&hash=1162731b1373e392aff002680a375641d9ecac2a)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2703.jpg&hash=3a8099eb8a3b43ec895c3a044f53c7efd1dd14c9)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2706.jpg&hash=c0f0b62a23181bad35f31b2b3bf4ff5c8e3b32d8)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2696.jpg&hash=db5ed5198457015d0560120d19ec398bdde5bce4)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2701.jpg&hash=7a15144c69bae8be22ecb38ddba3b98abf5b36e5)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2702.jpg&hash=2f84225f1d3910650e4c284f4a93f2293593bbad)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2704.jpg&hash=93e9a3b98ef77f5939da080dccb166e7426978cb)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2705.jpg&hash=206957cecf379a48d02d0aa722e475c1191ab4b9)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2707.jpg&hash=cb482849f36a3ded05109ac72cf6068226e85fd4)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2710.jpg&hash=99522e70eaefc965c426c88e53709cc4dd3a1405)
(http://)
-
Any Ideas?????
-
That is one really nice rifle. Thank you for showing it to the assembled multitude. Seems to me that if you can get it for a fair price you are way ahead. It appears that it has an arrested case of reconversion, but all of the warts can be cleared up.
Where was it made? Could have been Virginia late in the flint period. Nice box with very pretty engraving. The four petaled flower seems to have been a favorite among the Commonwealth makers. The checkering is a bit of a wild card though.
Check Sellars and the other standards on American makers, You should find the name there.
Let us know if you get to hang it up on your wall. Hope so!
Regards-Dick
-
I agree - from the pictures I would start with the hypothesis that it was made in Virginia in the 1830s. Good luck.
Wayne
-
Any shots of the tang and the top of the comb? Looks like it is definitely a long tang - would love to see the shape. The length of it would lead one to suspect North Carolina or Tennessee.
Is that a diamond shaped silver inlay on the comb?
The patchbox is very "Sheetz/Sheets" in form - almost like it was cut from one of their patterns. But the engraving is more naive. maybe someone who apprenticed with the Sheets.
The sort of squashed-looking star on the cheekpiece is reminiscent of some North Carolina guns, but overall I'd agree its from Virginia - the keys with escutcheons only on the rear one, wriggle engraving on the escutcheon, the triggers (I really love the triggers on this gun) etc. The use of round thimbles in paring with a full octagonal barrel is atypical for the major riflemaking centers in the Valley, but something you would not be surprised to see on an Applachian region gun, from Southwestern Virginia or Tennessee, maybe over to Cumberland plateau.
Whisker does not list any Hoffmans in his "Virginia" books. Jerry Noble lists a Charles Hofman in Shelby County Tennessee in the 1850 census, and a Louis Hoffman who worked late, in St. Louis and later Vicksburg MS.
Other possibilities on the name? There are Huffmans known in Virgnia, and Hollan/Hollands in North Carolina and Tennessee.
So overall to me it sort of has the feel of a Virginia Valley trained smith who moved west/southwest. The sideplate may be a replacement - real unusual form. So most likley Virginia, or points west...
Guy
-
Is there any indication that there was a name engraved on the lock plate just below the pan? The lock is very similiar to a lock I have on an original Tenn rifle made in East TN. My rifle's lock has been converted to cap lock and I am faced with the decision to convert it back or leave it as is. The plate and engraving are unique and your lock is very close to what is on my rifle's lock. My lock is has a makers name engraved on it. I don't have it in front of me, but I think it is marked "A.W. Spies" if my memory serves me right.
Roger Sells
-
Well, I got it!!! I have some more pictures that were asked for and a good picture of the signature. This is one HEAVY gun weighing a full 12 pounds! The 45 5/8 inch barrel measures 1.036 at breech-.934 at 28 inches and .990 at the muzzle, it is about 40 cal with an approx twist of 1-48. The rifling looks surprisingly good too. I can make out this on the lock:
C B Co
P
ant
So I believe it to read:
C. Bird & Co.
Philladelphia
Warranted
Kauffman lists this maker circa 1814. If any one has an original C. Bird & Co flintlock I would love to see it.....Ed
[(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2721.jpg&hash=4db718cf1055598f66427b01368929a67ae5f4ec)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2716.jpg&hash=826eb2f2de54097a12581728b38f4bb52f142266)
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi246.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fgg96%2FLongknife1776-photo%2FIMG_2717.jpg&hash=57c6b1a70a4bbef8764aff8f6e8382900c3d813f)
-
Is it possible that the signature is W. Gohlman? Hard to tell, but that might be one possibility.
Best-Dick
-
Hello,
I just bought a W GOFFMAN longrifle in Houston, TX today. I have not taken any photos yet. Please contact me if you would like to share info on the rifles.
Chris Hirsch
cshirsch@windstream.net
-
Chris,
Congratulations on your purchase!
Once you've taken some pictures, why not just start another thread and post the pictures for all of us to enjoy.
John
-
Didn't this one turn out to be a Zollman fr. Rockbridge County, Va. area? If it didn't I think that is worth considering.
-
Didn't this one turn out to be a Zollman fr. Rockbridge County, Va. area? If it didn't I think that is worth considering.
Yes it is.
-
yes, it is William Zollman. Thanks