AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Black Powder Shooting => Topic started by: wvmtnman on February 18, 2021, 02:23:46 AM
-
I’m at a point where I need to start casting. In the past I’ve always bought my round balls. This past Christmas, I bought my son a reproduction musket. Minie balls are not cheap! I have about 100 pounds of soft lead plumbing pipe. It was still being used in the house until I remodeled it.
What recommendations do you guys have as far as furnaces go? I was thinking about a Lee bottom pour. Any experiences?
Thanks, Brian
-
I have a bottom pour pot that is sitting under the bench. A bought a Waage years ago. You might have to call them regarding their pot made for casting bullets. Might not be on their website.
I like it. The key to good casting is temp. control. For that you need a pot that does not have wide swings in temps.
Fleener
-
Being the simple and frugal type I just use a ladle and an open top pot that I wrapped high temp insulation around and then sheet steel to hold it on . For heat I use an old reclaimed 4 burner range top . I have 220 v in my casting area , if not an older 110v coil type hot plate will work just takes longer to melt the lead . A gas fired Coleman camp stove will also do
-
My 10 pound Lee bottom pour started rusting out around the top edge after 30-35 years. Bought one of their 20 pound bottom pour type.
Came across a Hot Pot on a bargain table. Started using it to pour faster (larger) stream on 550 minie balls. Pour big puddle on the mold over the 20 lb then refill the Hot Pot.
Tried dipping but like chewing Red Man vs dipping Leas. 😁
-
I have several. I like the large lee bottom pour best.
Some will say bottom pour is no good. I do not think it matters. Each type is a learning curve. I use gang molds whenever possible. Using a dipper is fine for onesies and twosies but not a bunch at one sitting . I get about 95% good bullets one heated and running. I also cast hundreds in a session. Usually 20# of whatever I am casting and then I get tired of it.
IF you only want to cast a few in a one cavity mold then a pot and dipper will do OK.
Do get a thermometer. Without it you are working in the dark. You will not get consistent results unless the lead is a consistent temperature.
-
Any pot that gets hot enough will work, but because minies use a lot of lead, a smaller pot will run empty quicker.
-
I used to use a thermometer, and now have not used one in years. Kinda like when I started smoking meat, used one all the time.
Fleener
-
I have two of the bottom pour melting pot. Both leaked out the bottom so fast I gave them up for a 8 or 10 lb open cast iron pot and dipper.
-
I have 2 Lee bottom pour pots, one for hard lead, one for soft. I removed all the bottom pour plumbing, then plugged the inner bottom pour spout with a #6 self tapping machine screw. I dip
for balls and bullets. It's the only way- for me. I also use chips of beeswax for fluxing. Parafin will also work. Marvelux worked, but coats the pot in a skin I do not like.
(https://i.ibb.co/JBCyY09/OLYMPUS-DIGITAL-CAMERA.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mDSXn13)
edited - both of my pots are 20 pounders. I tried 10 pound pots and they were too small for my use.
-
I prefer an old cast iron pot and a Coleman stove. Using a ladle has worked the best for me re consistency , especially when casting 550 gr bullets for the long range matches, or my .715 and .735 balls. Casting a couple hundred or more isn't a chore once you get a good rhythm going.
-
I have the standard 10 lb Lee bottom pour pot... It drips... I deal with it.
I picked these up at a flea market sometime back, got them for a song. I can only guess on the kettle's capacity... But if the Lee holds 10 lbs. I think the kettle will do 20 lbs. without too much trouble. I like the ladel, the gate should help you pour off the bottom and keep dross/junk out of your cast. Haven't used them yet, but I look forward to trying them the next time I make ingots.
(https://i.ibb.co/s5PTs6B/IMG-20210218-012730868.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4sfb4YQ)
(https://i.ibb.co/jrKqHmw/IMG-20210218-012752729.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KrZBmds)
Mike
-
I use a LEE 20 lb bottom pour. I've had considerable experience with it and have learned a couple of things along the way.
It is critical that the pot be filled with CLEAN lead when you're running bullets. Lead such as your recovered plumbing pipe should be smelted first to get it clean and free from impurities. For smelting, I use a cast iron pot on a Coleman stove then pour the CLEAN lead into an ingot mold and use the ingots to load the LEE pot for casting bullets to prevent junk from contaminating my LEE pot. I still flux the "clean" lead in my LEE pot thoroughly with beeswax before starting to cast. That involves considerable stirring and scraping the sides and bottom of the pot to bring out any remaining impurities that can be skimmed off the top of the molten lead. If you're using a LEE bottom pour pot it should be physically secured to prevent it being knocked over. When running bullets, I keep a thermometer in the metal the entire time. I've found my LEE 20 lb pot holds temperature just fine, once I get it where I want it. For lead roundballs I get the best results running at 800 degrees. I keep a field expedient cover over the top of my LEE pot at all times when casting, and while it is in storage. The cover I'm using is fabricated by folding several layers of heavy duty Aluminium foil into a square shape that I lay onto the rim of the pot.
Of course all other normal protocols apply when handling molten lead. NO moisture any where near your hot pot,well ventilated area, gloves, eye protection, fully clothed...( no shorts or flip-flops on your feet).
With decent equipment and following good safety practices you can enjoy casting your own bullets and balls as part of the enjoyment of the hobby. If you hunt, taking game with your own "home-made" bullets and roundballs adds a whole new level of satisfaction to any successful hunt.
-
Have 2 of the Lee 20 lb pots, used them for 30+ years. Keep them clean, the spout may drip, just turn the stopper with a screwdriver like the instructions say.
I put mine in a cookie baking sheet. It will contain all 20 pounds of lead if it were to drop a full pot.
For the money I can buy several Lee pots for the cost of one more expensive brand. Have yet to have a Lee be retired because it failed.
Don
-
Mike
Just please be careful with that pot and not tip it over when you have hot lead in it.
There is a guy that I shot with in WI, a few years ago he tipped his pot over and severely burned his foot. I try to wear a pair of pull on boots that are leather when I cast now. I can get them off in a hurry if needed and they provide better protection then a pair of boots that has an open front and not 100% leather.
Fleener
-
I do exactly as Daryl does, including removing the bottom pour parts of my Lee furnaces and using Marvelux as a flux. Btw, I also use a "Tel True" thermometer at least until the furnace comes up to casting temperature.
-
I have a ten pound capacity lee pot. Had it since 1980. Always works, pours good bullets and balls if the mould is good. I set the temperature at about 730 degs many years ago and haven't changed the temp ever, haven't needed to. If you get one you'll probably be satisfied as many others are. If you like the ladle as shown before it can be modified or just use a coleman stove and iron pot. Enjoy the experience.
-
Brian, I use to shoot musket a lot in mainly local matches and NMLRA territorials as well as the shoots at Friendship. I used a Lyman 20lb pot and a RCBS ladle(it's larger than the Lyman). It's mainly a factor of getting the lead at the right temp and finding a technic for pouring that works for you. When I got everything going right, I could cast upwards to 120 good minies in an hour. Also don't disregard round balls. Many of those repro muskets shoot them well.
(https://i.ibb.co/gmJtnrL/IMG-20140614-174423-447.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JmHrhcw)
-
When I was doing a lot of bullseye shooting with modern pistols I ran two 40 pound cast iron plumber pots on top of the 20 pound propane tanks. I used 6, 8, and 10 cavity H&G molds for .38 & .45 caliber bullets. I used a ladle to dip the lead because you had to get a lot of lead into the molds to fill them. You would never do this with a 10 or 20 pound bottom pour pot and get good bullets. I would cast around 5000 on a Saturday and size & lube them on Sunday using a Star luber/sizer.
-
I have two of the Lyman 20 pounder electric casting pots. They came with a bottom pour option, but I don't like that, preferring to dip from the top, so I removed the apparatus for bottom pouring and plugged the exit hole. They keep lead at a uniform temperature and I cast hundreds of rounds in a session. I like this system.
-
Just purchased one of the Lee 10# bottom pours. My brother in law owns a recycle plant so lead is not a problem.
Received a lot of advice from Daryl before starting. Now my only problem is I am casting more than I could ever shoot. ;D.
I also learned if you get the lead to hot you get some FUNKY colored balls.
-
Chad - you need a gun that uses more lead, obviously. ::)
A .69 will use more, but an 8 bore will use twice as much. ;D :o
-
I’ve used a pair of the 20 pound Lee’s Production Pots for decades, and have cast tens of thousands of 350-550 grain bullets in 40 and 45 calibers for BPCR, and probably as many or more 200-300 grain for pistol shooting (I like big bores). Like Daryl I use one pot for pure lead for muzzleloading projectiles, and harder alloy for center fire rifles and pistols in the other. I’ve always used a dipper, and prefer the one made by RCBS. It’s just whatever you get used to, and like most things a lot will depend on your technique.
Greg
-
Chad - you need a gun that uses more lead, obviously. ::)
A .69 will use more, but an 8 bore will use twice as much. ;D :o
Thanks for all the help Daryl.Slowly building a collection a fowler will be next,
-
I appreciate the responses. I’m thinking pay day I will get a bottom pour 20 pound pot and a minie ball mold.
Currently, I’m running about $1 per shot! When everything is factored in...
Thanks, Brian
-
Pure lead is usually needed & requisite for Minnies. Slightly harder might work, but I expect nothing harder than 30:1 tin to lead.
Now, patched round balls loaded in the .58's and .577's do exceptionally well at round ball ranges, to 200or so yards on target.
I've had 5 .58's now including 2 military rifles and they all shot patched round balls exceptionally well as well as Minnies (altered).
You will 'get' almost or over 2 round balls from the lead required for 1 Minnie.
-
Mike
Just please be careful with that pot and not tip it over when you have hot lead in it.
There is a guy that I shot with in WI, a few years ago he tipped his pot over and severely burned his foot. I try to wear a pair of pull on boots that are leather when I cast now. I can get them off in a hurry if needed and they provide better protection then a pair of boots that has an open front and not 100% leather.
Fleener
Yes sir. I usually "glove up" quite a bit. Always try to be extra careful. But as the old saying goes... caca occurs.
Mike
-
I have a bottom pour pot that is sitting under the bench. A bought a Waage years ago. You might have to call them regarding their pot made for casting bullets. Might not be on their website.
I like it. The key to good casting is temp. control. For that you need a pot that does not have wide swings in temps.
Fleener
Fleener,
What is the capacity of your Waage pot? Does it have the P.I.D. temperature controller? Does it have a model number that can be used when calling for pricing?
Thanks,
Bruce
-
Always wear heavy gloves, eye protection, cotton clothes or an apron, heavy leather shoes.
The man that was teaching me to cast 50 years ago was talking to me and dumped a full ladle of molten lead into his boot. Learned right away to wear proper clothing.
Don
-
Full cap steel toed boots with the thick leather flap that covers the laces, a leather apron like a blacksmith would wear (made it myself from bullhide purchased from Tandy Leather), long sleeve shirt, and leather gauntlet gloves.
I only had to drop molten lead on a pair of regular 10" leather boots once to convince myself to take greater precautions than wnen I first started casting at age 17 with no one to mentor me.
-
My Waage I think holds right around 20 lbs. I cant answer your question regarding the controller. You can see the model number in one of the pictures. I dont know how long I have had it, but it has been a few years and I like it. Might be me, but I think it holds the temp very well, and that is IMO one of the keys to throwing good bullets.
Also since I was taking pictures, a picture of my fume hood. I bought it at the University surplus sale, I like it because it has a light built in and I vented to the outside of my shop. The thick plastic keep me safe. I dont wear any safety glasses, simply no need.
I keep the pot when casting quite a ways from the edge. I have to reach in to get a dipper of lead. Little chance of tipping the pot over. I also use pieces of cement fiberboard siding around the pot. That stuff just does not burn well.
I also use a surplus scientific hot plate for pre heating my mold. I start casting good bullets from the start. Steel molds take longer to get up to temp then a AL one.
I have a dedicated spot on my work bench for the casting setup. I rigged up the hood so I can store it all the way up next to the ceiling on ropes and pulleys, however I never do that.
Fleener
(https://i.ibb.co/0fQ0bV8/fume-hood.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GVFZS3B)
(https://i.ibb.co/N75sqDV/waage-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qxKd8qy)
(https://i.ibb.co/SBTymh5/waage-bottom.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pdDwKtb)
(https://i.ibb.co/44Zqf7G/waage-controler.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WBWh36w)
(https://i.ibb.co/28QpdVy/waage-modle-number.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bHZGXwP)
paypal pic (https://imgbb.com/)
-
That's a cool pot, Fleener. I also wear heavy work gloves when casting nowadays as I open the sprue with my hand and only tap the hinge screw if needed
to drop a ball or bullet from the mould.
I've worn out a Lyman pot, suffice to say my old cousin had used it for 20 years first and he was a prolific caster and shooter of cast bullets. I think he only shot jacketed
for hunting & he was a 3-position shooter.
I've also worn out 2 Lee 10 pound pots and thought I had my first Lee 20 pounder until I opened it up and simply re-wired it. That is why I now have a hard lead 20 pound
Lee pot and a soft lead 20 pound Lee pot. I should have done this eon's ago.
Take note boys.
-
My Waage I think holds right around 20 lbs. I cant answer your question regarding the controller. You can see the model number in one of the pictures. I dont know how long I have had it, but it has been a few years and I like it. Might be me, but I think it holds the temp very well, and that is IMO one of the keys to throwing good bullets.
Also since I was taking pictures, a picture of my fume hood. I bought it at the University surplus sale, I like it because it has a light built in and I vented to the outside of my shop. The thick plastic keep me safe. I dont wear any safety glasses, simply no need.
I keep the pot when casting quite a ways from the edge. I have to reach in to get a dipper of lead. Little chance of tipping the pot over. I also use pieces of cement fiberboard siding around the pot. That stuff just does not burn well.
I also use a surplus scientific hot plate for pre heating my mold. I start casting good bullets from the start. Steel molds take longer to get up to temp then a AL one.
I have a dedicated spot on my work bench for the casting setup. I rigged up the hood so I can store it all the way up next to the ceiling on ropes and pulleys, however I never do that.
Fleener
(https://i.ibb.co/0fQ0bV8/fume-hood.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GVFZS3B)
(https://i.ibb.co/N75sqDV/waage-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qxKd8qy)
(https://i.ibb.co/SBTymh5/waage-bottom.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pdDwKtb)
(https://i.ibb.co/44Zqf7G/waage-controler.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WBWh36w)
(https://i.ibb.co/28QpdVy/waage-modle-number.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bHZGXwP)
paypal pic (https://imgbb.com/)
Thanks very much for images of the pot, and your casting bench set-up. That fume hood is a great idea. When I started at 17 it was in my mother's kitchen on the 4-burner gas stove that was butted up against the rear wall of the row house in Baltimore City. The 1950's exhaust fan was installed in the rear wall of the kitchen directly above the stove at about 6' high. I used the front burner nearest the exhaust fan, a cheap aluminum pot, a ladle made from a commercial serving spoon with the handle sandwiched between two pieces of juniper harvested from a tree in the backyard, and a DGW scissors mold for .445 balls. A pair of dikes to cut off the sprues, and an old bath towel to drop the cast balls onto.
That's all I started with, until common sense prevailed, and that first drop of lead on my boots. Fortunately, boots were all I wore in those days, unless I was playing sports.
-
Take a look at the RCBS easy melt furnace that has the PID controller. I love mine so far and that is based upon 50 yrs of casting with Lyman's, Lee, camp stoves and the old style Saeco pots. The Rcbs is not a bottom pour and controls the temp well. Its also reasonably priced.
kw
-
For years and years I used a pot on a Coleman stove. Last Christmas my wife got me a ten-pound (I think) Lee bottom pour. I had no idea how good life could be. It's neat and clean, very stable, and incredibly quick to temperature. As was noted earlier, any system brings its own learning curve, but that's part of the fun.