AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: 45dash100 on September 15, 2023, 04:16:57 AM
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So, I've recently restarted a Lancasterish build, but it's been pretty much impossible to not eyeball Kibler's stuff. Couldn't resist ordering one. Grabbed a B stock 45 cal. It's Extra Fancy maple but was discounted for a filled hole. Doesn't bother me any, I like the added character.
(https://i.ibb.co/zZMrsFb/Kibler-SMR45.png) (https://ibb.co/yq9X0p5)
(https://i.ibb.co/GH3JZwQ/Kibler-SMR45-2.png) (https://ibb.co/Y0TW59B)
Figured it'd be really nice to have a high quality gun in my hands that I can dig into, and have a standard to aim for. Got the gun last Thursday, and got it mostly assembled over the weekend in between waiting for stuff to dry on the Lancaster.
It went very well, with only a few hiccups. Needed to remove hardly anything for the barrel to drop in. Just a bit around the plug, and some fuzzies in the channel. I think the curl was giving the CNC machine fits. A good problem to have.
Lock fits like a glove, and took zero fitting.
Triggerguard was a bit of a problem, it was twisted in several directions, and was not easy to get it to match up with the inlets. Was way off from the start. Took me several hours with a hammer, vise, and various wrenches and prybars to get it to bend in the right spots. Got it in the end though, it fits right in now.
Buttplate install was pretty smooth. Just took my time with inlet black (heh, sharpie) to get a good fit. Only issue was the top screwholes weren't centered, they were far enough off that the buttplate was overhanging quite a bit on one side. No big deal, did some searching here on the forums, and saw various plug filling techniques. Made a plug from some dowels, and glued them in. Easy.
All the pinning, and inletting of small parts went smooth. Now I'm just sanding out machine marks and planning for some customizations.
There's several things I'd like to add to the gun, and a lot of them will require some drawing which I'm terrible at. I'd like to do some minimal carving, maybe add a patchbox and steel nosecap. Not sure If I want to cover up the nice wood though. Silver wire inlay would also be cool if kept simple. I've been looking at original guns for the past few months, though there are still some books I'd like to track down. I don't want to get too far away from what would have been done at the time, though I little stretching won't bug me.
Since I'm terrible at freehand drawing, I'm turning to the computer. I plan to model the entire stock in Fusion 360 so that I can play with various additions and see how they look. Will also be very handy if I decide to make a nosecap.
Here's my quick and dirty progress. I want to match the lines as close as possible, so that any additions I draw on the computer will be an accurate representation. It's been a while since I've modeled such complex curves, but things are coming along. The comb needs a little work, and the lock area needs a lot of cleaning up. However, it is coming together.
(https://i.ibb.co/LRm679p/Kibler-SMRModel.png) (https://ibb.co/C8gvGV0)
(https://i.ibb.co/B3qQwkJ/Kibler-SMRModel-2.png) (https://ibb.co/DW5vLdF)
The base model is the tricky part. Once it's done, I'll be able to try as many different carving/engraving/inlay bits as I want with minimal effort.
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Nice idea, but the wrong rifle for carving. Inlays yes, carving no.
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Nice idea, but the wrong rifle for carving. Inlays yes, carving no.
Sure, complex carving wouldn't fit, however a little detail around the front of the comb, or on the cheekrest seem to show up on some later Carolina rifles, as well as stuff in Tennessee.
Of course, that's why the CAD is cool. I can draw something up, and if It's blasphemy no harm has been made to any real wood. ;D
Been thinking about sheet metal for the nosecap. If I've got a good model, I can quickly make a 3D printed metal forming jig, and have a really nice starting point. There's not a lot of wood, so precision will be key.
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Be interested if, in, and how you would do a sheet metal iron nosecap '45dash100'. I have a SMR kit that I hope to be starting on very soon and would like to install a nosecap. Brass is out due to the rest of the SMR being iron. I've seen some pictures of SMR's with an iron and finished cap and like the look. W/O a nose cap IMO it looks like something is missing. Due to the thinness of the of the wood on a SMR its tricky but can be done. I know, most originals didn't and if so, Jim Kibler would have done so with his version, but I don't always stay on the beaten path when it comes to originality. I've mentally ran through alot of ways to do it to avoid wood damage but yet to have a secure cap. If anyone else has installed a nosecap on a Kibler SMR successfully I'd be interested in how you did it, maybe even found one to modify.
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I might be wrong but if I were to carve a rifle or install a nose cap I would have done it before I finished and stained the stock. :-\
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Be interested if, in, and how you would do a sheet metal iron nosecap '45dash100'. I have a SMR kit that I hope to be starting on very soon and would like to install a nosecap. Brass is out due to the rest of the SMR being iron. I've seen some pictures of SMR's with an iron and finished cap and like the look. W/O a nose cap IMO it looks like something is missing. Due to the thinness of the of the wood on a SMR its tricky but can be done. I know, most originals didn't and if so, Jim Kibler would have done so with his version, but I don't always stay on the beaten path when it comes to originality. I've mentally ran through alot of ways to do it to avoid wood damage but yet to have a secure cap. If anyone else has installed a nosecap on a Kibler SMR successfully I'd be interested in how you did it, maybe even found one to modify.
Although this one is brass the procedure may help.
Tim C.
https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=9.msg18#msg18
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Be interested if, in, and how you would do a sheet metal iron nosecap '45dash100'. I have a SMR kit that I hope to be starting on very soon and would like to install a nosecap. Brass is out due to the rest of the SMR being iron. I've seen some pictures of SMR's with an iron and finished cap and like the look. W/O a nose cap IMO it looks like something is missing. Due to the thinness of the of the wood on a SMR its tricky but can be done. I know, most originals didn't and if so, Jim Kibler would have done so with his version, but I don't always stay on the beaten path when it comes to originality. I've mentally ran through alot of ways to do it to avoid wood damage but yet to have a secure cap. If anyone else has installed a nosecap on a Kibler SMR successfully I'd be interested in how you did it, maybe even found one to modify.
Will have to decide if I'm going to do it once I get to drawing the front of the gun. It really is quite thin.
Check out this video:
https://youtu.be/8cNeAOpR-Ws
Would be fun to try this, even if I don't actually attach the cap in the end. I've got an old bottlejack shop press that should do the job. If it works, it would be handy for lots of things. I could also share the STL, then anyone with a press could quickly print a set of dies and form their own.
I might be wrong but if I were to carve a rifle or install a nose cap I would have done it before I finished and stained the stock. :-\
I must have been unclear in my first post or something, no staining has occured. My gun has had a bit of sanding done to remove machine marks, but still needs more before I'm at the point of staining.
Here's how it sits at the moment.
(https://i.ibb.co/4mtXXhW/Current-State.png) (https://ibb.co/qyjccTB)
Once I finish 3d modeling the stock, I'll probably at least do the buttplate and triggerguard. Those add so much to the flow of the rifle that they're needed for deciding decoration. Maybe I'll do the lock too. Especially if I want to do a little engraving.
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Although this one is brass the procedure may help.
Tim C.
https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=9.msg18#msg18
That's a good tutorial. Wonder if the front face can be hammer formed like that with steel. Figured I'd have to tig a patch on, or learn to silver solder.
Could probably do it with the press, but would likely require multiple stages of dies.
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Been thinking about sheet metal for the nosecap. If I've got a good model, I can quickly make a 3D printed metal forming jig, and have a really nice starting point. There's not a lot of wood, so precision will be key.
This one is in our tutorial section with photos
https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=24785.0
No CAD needed this one it has a RR groove, but most SMR's did not, just use the a proper round wood template with 2 radiator hose clamps to bend the metal around the template, square the end and solder the oversize flat front piece on, then file off the excess. I make brass or mild steel nose caps this way. Slip on the forearm (without barrel in place) then scribe the bottom of the octagon barrel then cut and file the cap to fit the bottom of the barrel. Properly soldered it looks like a one piece cap. Easy once you get the hang of it.
Dennis
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Yes mild steel can be hammer forged also on 2 piece, flat front need not be tight welded, soft solder or brazed is plenty strong enough.
You might want to practice on a fore end other than a Kibler SMR, you have little wood to work with on the Kibler and if you cut a little too much wood off the fore end can easily be broken off the stock! I cheated on my first one and glued it on with JB Weld to help strengthen the wood.
Dennis
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Be interested if, in, and how you would do a sheet metal iron nosecap '45dash100'. I have a SMR kit that I hope to be starting on very soon and would like to install a nosecap. Brass is out due to the rest of the SMR being iron. I've seen some pictures of SMR's with an iron and finished cap and like the look. W/O a nose cap IMO it looks like something is missing. Due to the thinness of the of the wood on a SMR its tricky but can be done. I know, most originals didn't and if so, Jim Kibler would have done so with his version, but I don't always stay on the beaten path when it comes to originality. I've mentally ran through alot of ways to do it to avoid wood damage but yet to have a secure cap. If anyone else has installed a nosecap on a Kibler SMR successfully I'd be interested in how you did it, maybe even found one to modify.
I used JB Weld (also a copper rivet to look traditional) to glue the finished cap to the wood let dry a couple of days and file off excess. It worked great for the 2 or 3 yrs before I sold the rife, I assume it lasted for the buyer as well. Plus I made the nose cap a loose fit so it released from the barrel easily when removing barrel from the stock.
Dennis
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Been thinking about sheet metal for the nosecap. If I've got a good model, I can quickly make a 3D printed metal forming jig, and have a really nice starting point. There's not a lot of wood, so precision will be key.
This one is in our tutorial section with photos
https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=24785.0
No CAD needed this one it has a RR groove, but most SMR's did not, just use the a proper round wood template with 2 radiator hose clamps to bend the metal around the template, square the end and solder the oversize flat front piece on, then file off the excess. I make brass or mild steel nose caps this way. Slip on the forearm (without barrel in place) then scribe the bottom of the octagon barrel then cut and file the cap to fit the bottom of the barrel. Properly soldered it looks like a one piece cap. Easy once you get the hang of it.
Dennis
Yep, you can do it without CAD. I will still use it in this case though, it'l only take a few minutes to draw the tip of the stock. A ramrod groove will be required, there's just no room to not have one. Also, the forend flares out. The stock is wider at the tip than a couple inches back. It's those little details that make this gun so awesome, the lines are great, and I don't want to mess up the flow.
Once it's drawn, printing out a template, or making a die will go 10 times faster than making a template out of wood.
I'm a farmer, we take any shortcut we can get. ;D At least for a gun that's already mostly CNC machined. If you think about it, I'm just using the tools that were used at the time this gun was created. ;D
If I do make a cap, I think it'd be best to use some JB weld like you did on yours. It's that or remove a bit of wood from the barrel channel and install some metal or carbon strips to beef things up.
ETA:
Here's a pic of the tip of the stock for reference. Need to sand out the fuzzies from the ramrod channel next.
(https://i.ibb.co/rbJ2kf5/Forend-1.png) (https://ibb.co/8zVgM4P)
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Sharp tools would of avoided that. When you start seeing chatter it's time to change your cutter.
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Sharp tools would of avoided that. When you start seeing chatter it's time to change your cutter.
That's quite possible. Though I could see it being almost unfeasible to keep up with some types of wood. It doesn't look it in this picture as I've sanded the outside already and haven't removed the dust, but it's quite curly. Seemed like the curl was giving the machine fits. I have a homemade CNC router I use for RC and models, and while I don't do much profile machining, different pieces of wood can have wildly different machined surfaces even with a sharp tool.
I'm very curious how often they have to swap cutters, and also how in the world they can hold the forend steady enough to machine. Must be strategically leaving wood to keep it stiff or something. It's impressive. Anyway, that's probably mostly academic, as the channel will clean up really quick.
CNC stuff aside, I took a little time to draw up the forend and what it would look like after filing down to fit a cap. Here's a few renders.
The unmolested version:
(https://i.ibb.co/mG7LWTR/SMR-Nosecap-v1-3.png) (https://ibb.co/1LxDWQ0)
Here it is with .040" removed:
(https://i.ibb.co/GFQvkYF/SMR-Nosecap-v1-2.png) (https://ibb.co/x3qSG93)
And here's a cap.
(https://i.ibb.co/0QMGwVL/SMR-Nosecap-v1.png) (https://ibb.co/7bW19ND)
Slightly more material would need to be removed from the tip as it flares out, and is narrower at the back of the cap. But I think it's all perfectly doable. Don't know how much clearance I'm going to need for the cap, fortunately that's easy to measure and test once I get one formed. I'd hope 22 gauge (.0299") steel would work. I've got some coming, and I'll give it a shot.
In the meantime, I can draw up a printable jig for the press or bench vise, or just 3D print a template and hammer the sheet around it.
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Looks good 45dash, but there has to be some source that a nosecap can be purchased that fits or that would require minor fitting is available. Grischi sent me a PM on how he did his by modifying a nosecap he bought from Track of the Wolf. Looks promising.
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I made one out of brass first to form fit. Then I made one out of sheet metal to copy the brass one. Worked out very well. But I'm technically
challenged. So it's the old hammer and fit method.....lol
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If push would come to a lethal shove, I could form one. Do have the ability as I've made/fabricated alot of metal this and that over the last five decades, but I just as soon be lazy and buy something that will fit or needs very little fitting. Guess this attitude goes against alot/most of the idea of doing yerself here on the forum, but since the SMR is basically a minor fitting kit and all you do is finish and put together, guess might as well just keep it that way. Not the right attitude, but don't want to spend the time hammering out a cap unless need be.
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If push would come to a lethal shove, I could form one. Do have the ability as I've made/fabricated alot of metal this and that over the last five decades, but I just as soon be lazy and buy something that will fit or needs very little fitting. Guess this attitude goes against alot/most of the idea of doing yerself here on the forum, but since the SMR is basically a minor fitting kit and all you do is finish and put together, guess might as well just keep it that way. Not the right attitude, but don't want to spend the time hammering out a cap unless need be.
Not a terrible attitude to have for the gun in question. I want to make my own on this so that I can get the best lines possible. A lot of caps I see don't flow well, and sometimes modifying something can be almost more work. If you can find a good shortcut, nothing wrong with taking it though.
Also, I want to see how the 3D printed forming dies do. If it works well, I have other projects that can benefit. Could also probably quickly produce a batch to sell if I end up having the time or inclination. Probably less likely, I have to many projects to finish. We'll see how it goes when I get some sheet metal to play with next week.
I'm currently working on the metal parts, getting rid of casting marks and blemishes in preparation for final finishing. The final bit can wait until the stock is nearly done.
Been trying to research oddball patchboxes. I don't really want to cover up the wood on this one, so have been looking for examples of buttplate and toeplate boxes. The toeplate stuff is pretty cool, and I may just go that way. I've heard that there were some guns with storage accessible from the buttplate, but haven't been able to find pictures yet.
I'd really like to have someplace to stick a spare flint, a cleaning jag, and maybe ball/patch and powder charge for a single shot.
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Could have made a hardwood form; and formed and soldered cap out of thin sheet iron in less time than it took to do all that. Hands on. Old school.
There are plenty of photos, on this forum, of Kibler Southern Mountain guns that have nose caps added.
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Could have made a hardwood form; and formed and soldered cap out of thin sheet iron in less time than it took to do all that. Hands on. Old school.
Not even close. I probably only spent 10-15 minutes measuring the nose and drawing up the CAD models and taking a few renders. It would take me just as long write those measurements on a piece of paper, and then find a suitable piece of wood and transfer them over. If I had a suitable piece of hardwood lying around.
That doesn't even get in to the amount of time it would likely take me to make an accurate model out of wood with some files. And then you've got to consider post processing time. How much longer would it take me to hammer, and then fit and smooth said cap after it was finished? Almost certainly longer than an exactly formed piece of metal from a press. This method will get me a more accurate, faster made part than I could do by hand. The parts involved are just too delicate, and the tolerances too tight for me to win a race against myself old school.
Fortunately, I don't need to race myself here. I'm doing this all for fun afterall. ;D
I can track my time spent on the cap once I finally decide if I'll make one or not. Too busy right now with metal cleanup.
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45dash100,
You talked about adding some embellishments to the Kibler SMR. I realize the particular original rifle that Jim used for an example for his SMR was a very plain rifle and had no decoration. Most originals like this were the same.This not to say that someone CAN’T make this into an interesting rifle created for a wealthy tobacco plantation owner, or noted military figure, or doctor for a story behind it.
Some may say this is heresy but I attended an engraving and carving class with John Schipper’s at Conner Prairie a couple of years ago. He had some beautiful examples of his work and had done an interesting patch box on one. I asked him if he could similarly do my Kibler SMR that I had just not had time to start and the rest is history. The following are a few photos of Mr. Schipper’s work and it is amazing. What an artisan and great teacher! Interestingly I live in Louisiana know for its gators. I was surprised with a neat patchbox that resembles a folklore gator’s profile. Anyway, here are some photos of the finished rifle. Hope you enjoy what can be done.
(https://i.ibb.co/59FTcFP/IMG-5029.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yRS0sSr)
(https://i.ibb.co/44qkhzx/IMG-5025.jpg) (https://ibb.co/frgJjf7)
(https://i.ibb.co/9tv55p7/IMG-0300.jpg) (https://ibb.co/M6h00gm)
(https://i.ibb.co/FX40kjD/IMG-5019.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VxYQ0Pq)
(https://i.ibb.co/8r9qwgc/IMG-5031.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5rLm3hF)
(https://i.ibb.co/J3vRXPb/IMG-5030.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XY7ZmTd)
(https://i.ibb.co/S0V6gwx/IMG-5024.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZKcfrzJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/9qSNKXy/IMG-5022.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Vv5tnyM)
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Nice rifle elkhorne, really sets off that SMR.
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I have the twin to that gun also done by Mr. Schippers. Bought it from him at the CLA show 3 or 4 years ago
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(https://i.ibb.co/6JphNqX/IMG-0245.png) (https://ibb.co/YTK9bV0)
I’m planning on making one of these entry thimbles for my wife’s SMR.
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45dash100,
You talked about adding some embellishments to the Kibler SMR. I realize the particular original rifle that Jim used for an example for his SMR was a very plain rifle and had no decoration. Most originals like this were the same.This not to say that someone CAN’T make this into an interesting rifle created for a wealthy tobacco plantation owner, or noted military figure, or doctor for a story behind it.
Some may say this is heresy but I attended an engraving and carving class with John Schipper’s at Conner Prairie a couple of years ago. He had some beautiful examples of his work and had done an interesting patch box on one. I asked him if he could similarly do my Kibler SMR that I had just not had time to start and the rest is history. The following are a few photos of Mr. Schipper’s work and it is amazing. What an artisan and great teacher! Interestingly I live in Louisiana know for its gators. I was surprised with a neat patchbox that resembles a folklore gator’s profile. Anyway, here are some photos of the finished rifle. Hope you enjoy what can be done.
That's a pretty awesome rifle. I won't be going that far with mine for sure, but it's neat to see. I like all the engraving work and the accents added to the barrel and buttplate.
(https://i.ibb.co/6JphNqX/IMG-0245.png) (https://ibb.co/YTK9bV0)
I’m planning on making one of these entry thimbles for my wife’s SMR.
Hadn't thought of doing anything to the thimbles other than maybe a bit of shaping. That's cool.
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45 dash,
You've done some good things with the modeling. This isn't easy for sure. I've come from a background of doing everything by hand to where machines do most of the work and I can tell you that it is far easier to do it by hand for the customizing you are working on. I can help if you have any questions with this I can help. Now, if the CAD stuff is your comfort and what you like to do, I understand. There are some pretty tricky aspects to forming a nosecap well. The biggest one is forming the groove and ending up with sharp corners where it transitions to the rest of the cap. There are some tricks for this. I see so many that are just rounded and they look pretty bad to my eye.
Anyways, good work and I'll send you a PM.
Thanks,
Jim
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45 dash,
You've done some good things with the modeling. This isn't easy for sure. I've come from a background of doing everything by hand to where machines do most of the work and I can tell you that it is far easier to do it by hand for the customizing you are working on. I can help if you have any questions with this I can help. Now, if the CAD stuff is your comfort and what you like to do, I understand. There are some pretty tricky aspects to forming a nosecap well. The biggest one is forming the groove and ending up with sharp corners where it transitions to the rest of the cap. There are some tricks for this. I see so many that are just rounded and they look pretty bad to my eye.
Anyways, good work and I'll send you a PM.
Thanks,
Jim
Thanks Jim. I'd agree modeling the full stock is certainly overkill, and it would be easier to do some of the simpler things without it. Small bits like the nosecap are fast and easy, but the organic curves and such for the butt, comb, cheek-piece, and lock transitions get tricky fast.
I just like to stretch my brain a bit, I've done quite a bit of complex CAD work for model Airplanes, but that's fallen off a bit as real life eats into hobby time. I wanted to get some more practice in, as I've got some old guns in need of stocks that aren't sold anywhere. For things like that on a hobby budget, you gotta do the work yourself, and I'm more familiar with CAD than shaping things by hand.
I also agree on the transitions. A clunky or rounded edge on the top where it meets the barrel, or on the bottom near the ramrod just don't look quite right. I'd be interested to hear your tips there. I'm thinking I might just need some extra material on the form in bottom spots so it can be filed to final shape. Guess It all depends on if I try and do the printed dies, and how sharp of a corner I can get on the press.
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I made a steel mandrel to shape a nose cap for a Kibler SMR. I incorporated a ramrod groove and the mandrel worked very nicely. I faked a copper rivet and instead made two small copper screws that attach from the inside to the nose cap. I didn’t use any epoxy or glue, the cap slides on tight but could be removed if needed. I’d be glad to send the mandrel out to you if it helps your project (just send it back!).
(https://i.ibb.co/wM8JVtF/IMG-0699.jpg) (https://ibb.co/18Bs1ct)
(https://i.ibb.co/fMsm4fd/IMG-0686.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nrFhz9M)
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CooleyS,
If not too much trouble, could you post a couple of shots of your mandrel for the rest of us to see. There are a couple of master makers that have mad nose cap mandrels made from a foundry but they have been very price prohibitive, like several hundred dollars. We all need to make one for a specific rifle every now and then and a photo of one that has worked would be good to see and learn form. Thanks and great work!
elkhorne
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I made a steel mandrel to shape a nose cap for a Kibler SMR. I incorporated a ramrod groove and the mandrel worked very nicely. I faked a copper rivet and instead made two small copper screws that attach from the inside to the nose cap. I didn’t use any epoxy or glue, the cap slides on tight but could be removed if needed. I’d be glad to send the mandrel out to you if it helps your project (just send it back!).
That's a good looking cap, the lines are nice and clean. I just got the 22 gauge steel I ordered, so I think I'll print out some dies tonight and see what happens tomorrow evening. If plastic doesn't work out I might be interested in borrowing yours.
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I like those faux rivet copper screws.
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Here are a couple of pictures of the mandrels. To make the mandrels I first made card stock templates of the forestock profile at the nose and rear (depends on how long you make the nose cap). I used solid steel stock and then began the job of cutting and filing out two mandrels until they matched the templates. The first two pictures are of the mandrel I made to get sharp edges on the ramrod groove. The next two pictures are of the second mandrel I used to achieve the actual shape of the nose cap. Overkill? Maybe, but the margin for error is small on the Kibler and after a couple of caps that I wasn’t happy with I decided to take the time to make mandrels and they worked quite good.
I’ll thank my dad for showing me the faux rivet thing…
(https://i.ibb.co/c2XVsBq/IMG-3351.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YfTwVCg)
(https://i.ibb.co/9cQ6F4J/IMG-3352.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Bc0bX6m)
(https://i.ibb.co/MP9NGZF/IMG-3353.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KVmyLbT)
(https://i.ibb.co/56PRghD/IMG-3354.jpg) (https://ibb.co/L83ZXdw)
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Here are a couple of pictures of the mandrels. To make the mandrels I first made card stock templates of the forestock profile at the nose and rear (depends on how long you make the nose cap). I used solid steel stock and then began the job of cutting and filing out two mandrels until they matched the templates. The first two pictures are of the mandrel I made to get sharp edges on the ramrod groove. The next two pictures are of the second mandrel I used to achieve the actual shape of the nose cap. Overkill? Maybe, but the margin for error is small on the Kibler and after a couple of caps that I wasn’t happy with I decided to take the time to make mandrels and they worked quite good.
I’ll thank my dad for showing me the faux rivet thing…
(https://i.ibb.co/c2XVsBq/IMG-3351.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YfTwVCg)
(https://i.ibb.co/9cQ6F4J/IMG-3352.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Bc0bX6m)
(https://i.ibb.co/MP9NGZF/IMG-3353.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KVmyLbT)
(https://i.ibb.co/56PRghD/IMG-3354.jpg) (https://ibb.co/L83ZXdw)
Those are certainly beefy. I'm betting I may have to do a two stage thing with plastic. 22 gauge steel is thicker and stronger than I thought it was going to be, picked the size as that's what people were using with brass caps. Gonna give it a shot with a single stage first though.
Drew up a quick design after dinner, and got it printing.
(https://i.ibb.co/JCY6RJ1/SMR-Nosecap-Dies-1.png) (https://ibb.co/Kmt4jvP)
(https://i.ibb.co/yVxYHgh/SMR-Nosecap-Dies-2.png) (https://ibb.co/HX9x5GN)
I'm using glass fiber filled nylon filament. Some pretty strong stuff for plastic, but the steel seems tough. Maybe I should anneal it just to make sure it's as soft as possible.
CooleyS, what gauge is your cap?
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If I recall it was 24 gauge (.0239) and I annealed it often.
-Steve
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Jim i love your SMR i have 2 i have done and about to order number 3, but i wish you would have offered a toe plate. i did the ones i built with them and they are an asset. but personally, i don't care for the nose cap on the SMR,,,,,,,,,,,,,
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If I recall it was 24 gauge (.0239) and I annealed it often.
-Steve
Thanks. I think I will likely want to go thinner, that's 20% less steel, and should bend far more easily. We'll just have to see what happens when I get off work this evening.
Got the dies printed. I also decided last minute to make a pre-forming die, it'll take less load off the second stage. The 22 gauge steel is in a computer controlled kiln at the moment. Got it set to slow cool, and should be ready to take out and use this evening. Overkill, but if you have access to the tool, might as well use it to make sure the steel is as soft as possible at the start. I don't know how much mild steel sheet work hardens when it's manufactured, but I don't think it'll hurt anything.
(https://i.ibb.co/qYXPVnW/SMR-Nosecap-Dies-3.png) (https://ibb.co/s9kMzP6)
(https://i.ibb.co/b2nTHw0/SMR-Nosecap-Dies-4.png) (https://ibb.co/3MH2f63)
Jim i love your SMR i have 2 i have done and about to order number 3, but i wish you would have offered a toe plate. i did the ones i built with them and they are an asset. but personally, i don't care for the nose cap on the SMR,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I've almost got the triggerguard and buttplate to where I want them. Once they're close enough to the final finish I'm gonna tackle designing a toeplate patchbox. I think I could probably hammer out hinges for something the size of a banana patchbox (watched several videos on making hinges), but the toeplate is pretty small. Might try and find something I can repurpose.
I think I'll need to be careful about the release, don't want it catching on anything. Maybe I'll do a slightly recessed button or something.
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Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you, my magic toaster oven. It can turn sheet metal into a pop tart. ;D
(https://i.ibb.co/C2xjQ3s/Sheet-Metal-Pop-Tart.png) (https://ibb.co/ySLzqcB)
Heh, I think a used a bit too much heat. On the bright side, the metal ablated quite evenly, and I ended up with some really soft .0260" sheet steel. That took it down from about .0305", so uh, yeah, I meant to do that.....
Got the press dragged into the shop, and started with the preform dies.
(https://i.ibb.co/dmVvm45/Nose-Cap-Preform.png) (https://ibb.co/DrvFrfR)
It went really easy, no damage to either die, and the metal really filled in like it should.
(https://i.ibb.co/FbrKshS/Nose-Cap-After-Preform.png) (https://ibb.co/SXjPQ6h)
Next up is the rolling dies.
(https://i.ibb.co/JdwbxWr/Nose-Cap-Main-Jig-1.png) (https://ibb.co/VNchH0M)
(https://i.ibb.co/4VY3jK9/Nose-Cap-Main-Jig-2.png) (https://ibb.co/CHMDnmN)
(https://i.ibb.co/DgcshtP/Nose-Cap-Main-Jig-3.png) (https://ibb.co/BKWdbtH)
Oops. I messed up on my design here a bit. It would have been helpful to have a taller center die, so I could press down evenly with more clearance. Could probably have found a smaller load distribution piece for the top too. No problem though, those edges need to be cleaned up anyway. Also, I will probably just press out another cap with some modifications.
(https://i.ibb.co/wwnqM0Z/Nose-Cap-Main-Jig-4.png) (https://ibb.co/jWCYg69)
All in all, it worked very well, even though I didn't get sharp defined edges on the bottom. The steel had basically no spring-back which is great. I can slide the metal off of the center die with just a little bit of resistance.
(https://i.ibb.co/jrL9ntk/Nose-Cap-Main-Jig-5.png) (https://ibb.co/hmKx30F)
I believe the sharp defined bottom edge can be achieved with a differently shaped preforming die set.
I just need to make sharp points like CooleyS's mandrel, and overbend the metal for the first stage. Overbending won't be a problem, as I think the second roller stage dies will perfectly smooth things back out.
(https://i.ibb.co/G3jZvGF/Nose-Cap-Preform-Mod.png) (https://ibb.co/2YBz7R5)
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If you pre-bend your sheet metal in a brake or over the sharp jaw of a vise to 90° at the exact points where you are struggling to form sharp lines by the ramrod groove, in essence, to form a "U" with sharp corners, and then hand bend the "U" open, you now have the perfect stock to place in your die to finish the wrap to completion. This is one way to do it and I have great success with this approach.
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If you pre-bend your sheet metal in a brake or over the sharp jaw of a vise to 90° at the exact points where you are struggling to form sharp lines by the ramrod groove, in essence, to form a "U" with sharp corners, and then hand bend the "U" open, you now have the perfect stock to place in your die to finish the wrap to completion. This is one way to do it and I have great success with this approach.
That's a good idea. I really need to get or make some flat steel jaws for my big vise. The ones on it have some very rough serrations. Great for typical repair stuff, no so great for gun parts. Maybe I can have some success with a straight square punch die. Make two 90's at once, then open by hand, and stick into the roller die thing.
I printed a set of the sharp preform jigs I alluded to in the previous post, and gave them a try. It certainly worked better than the previous method, and I'd imagine I can make it look pretty good with a file.
(https://i.ibb.co/4svwXYf/Nose-Cap-Sharp-Preform.png) (https://ibb.co/7gMxZRz)
(https://i.ibb.co/JnPPWvh/Nose-Cap-Sharp-Preform-2.png) (https://ibb.co/dByysPh)
(https://i.ibb.co/H7NNHWN/Nose-Cap-Sharp-Preform-3.png) (https://ibb.co/nr33LH3)
The sharp corners of the sharp preforming jig did flatten a bit. I printed them with cheap PETG plastic, not the fancy engineering grade stuff the rollers are made of. I think the fancy material would probably deform also. That's why the 90 degree jig might be a really good idea. The 90's will have way more material supporting the edges than those sharp points.
Another option would be to reduce the curve of the ramrod groove, then quickly hog it out the rest of the way with an appropriately sized round file. May need thicker metal for that. I got a Woodsrunner kit in the mail yesterday, it came earlier than expected, and it's cap is quite thick (about .068-.070). That'd be something like 14-15 gauge if it wasn't fully machined.
I don't think I'd need to go that thick for the file in groove method, so it's possible. I probably have some 18-20 gauge stuff in the scrap pile. Would be interesting to see if thicker metal will bend as well with plastic dies. With a reduced groove depth, it may be possible.
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My thoughts 45dash is that there is a few of us Kibler SMR owners out here that like the looks of a nosecap on a SMR that can't find a ready made cap to finish/install. I personally don't have the means to do what you are doing and frankly don't want to take the time to do so. You get all of the bugs worked out and a SMR nosecap that is fairly easy to form, well, there is a little extra source of income for ya. Possibly could make enough over a period of time to fund another rifle kit if the nosecaps are reasonable price. I'd buy one. Just sayin. :)
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My thoughts 45dash is that there is a few of us Kibler SMR owners out here that like the looks of a nosecap on a SMR that can't find a ready made cap to finish/install. I personally don't have the means to do what you are doing and frankly don't want to take the time to do so. You get all of the bugs worked out and a SMR nosecap that is fairly easy to form, well, there is a little extra source of income for ya. Possibly could make enough over a period of time to fund another rifle kit if the nosecaps are reasonable price. I'd buy one. Just sayin. :)
Sadly, I'm still young enough that I have to go to work everyday. Would probably be easier to just work more overtime hours. Maybe not as fun though. I think forming the nose will probably be too time consuming to be able to make money, and still sell caps for prices people would pay. Unless I get really fast at it. ;D
Hammered on the nose a bit this morning, and it went a lot easier than expected. I'll finish forming it tonight when I get off work and post pictures.
Maybe I could just sell the jigs and people can form their own. It took basically no effort from my press to form things, so it could be possible with a bench vise. That's another thing to test.
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Forming the front went pretty well, though I did make a few mistakes.
The roller jig holds everything in place nicely.
(https://i.ibb.co/rHvJDCS/Nosecap-Front-Forming-1.png) (https://ibb.co/2d5BGDQ)
(https://i.ibb.co/3WSrT5Y/Nosecap-Front-Forming-2.png) (https://ibb.co/VDMjL0p)
The metal tends to bulge out around the side a bit, so I started using a punch to go around the outer edge, and to have more control when striking from the top.
While that worked, I really should have been using a brass punch. I have several hanging right by the bench. Oh well, this cap is just practice anyway. I don't think I left quite enough material to contact the sides of the barrel as cleanly as I would like.
(https://i.ibb.co/L8j1rxj/Nosecap-Front-Forming-5.png) (https://ibb.co/zr9ZFX9)
Some scratches left by the punch.
(https://i.ibb.co/SrJMQ8X/Nosecap-Front-Forming-3.png) (https://ibb.co/74bZg5J)
(https://i.ibb.co/vYYSCrB/Nosecap-Front-Forming-4.png) (https://ibb.co/WttLNd3)
(https://i.ibb.co/HVp0gWD/Nosecap-Front-Forming-6.png) (https://ibb.co/zrH1fyh)
(https://i.ibb.co/mSM9PKv/Nosecap-Front-Forming-7.png) (https://ibb.co/hCtBTNX)
I don't think I'll do any more work on this one. It turned out pretty ok for a first attempt, but I know I can do better. I think I'd like to try again with the full thickness 22 gauge steel. That will leave a bit more meat so I can clean things up better, and get everything looking how I want. Will also make inletting the wood a bit more forgiving.
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I spent 30 years in the IT field. I have always been fascinated by the making of 'stuff' and the ingenuity and engineering that goes into making it!!
Kudos
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I spent 30 years in the IT field. I have always been fascinated by the making of 'stuff' and the ingenuity and engineering that goes into making it!!
Kudos
Thanks. I'm the same way, and it's always fun to learn a new skill.
Didn't have as much time to work on things this weekend as I would have like, but I did at least complete a nosecap. Unsure if I will use it as is, or make one more to try and get the best possible cap I can.
Used a chisel to try and move a bit more metal into the points. Not sure I will do this again. I was able to get things a bit better defined, but It's really hard to keep even punches, and I probably gave myself some extra cleanup work on the bottom side.
(https://i.ibb.co/yQt8QZj/Nose-Cap-New-1.png) (https://ibb.co/jrmLrQX)
(https://i.ibb.co/WHSpb1r/Nose-Cap-New-2.png) (https://ibb.co/3TtYDHx)
I did test bends with and without annealing, and both worked. I was also able to do a good bend with just a bench vise. Makes sense. You can crush plastic with a bench vise easy, but you obviously don't have to apply that much force, as the metal bends without crushing the plastic.
The steel does harden when hammering on it though. Took this one to this point before I went and annealed it again. Certainly makes it easier to keep wrinkles out as you're forming things. Also, next time, I'll move even less metal. I've been keeping way too much out of caution, but it's unnecessary.
(https://i.ibb.co/PmJpXtL/Nose-Cap-New-3.png) (https://ibb.co/Rvtnr7F)
A piece of square stock really does help when you need to clean up the front face. You can hammer out most dents without the need to sand things.
(https://i.ibb.co/88VQmKK/Nose-Cap-New-4.png) (https://ibb.co/j4Fj866)
Printed a file guide. Since the wood will be so thing, I want to do as much shaping as possible before I need to do anything to the stock. Doing the majority of the file work off the gun is a lot safer.
(https://i.ibb.co/DkFnxVt/Nose-Cap-New-5.png) (https://ibb.co/TRG5Vvk)
(https://i.ibb.co/xSpCzGr/Nose-Cap-New-6.png) (https://ibb.co/5WNMsvJ)
The picture is a bit blurry, but here's the cap mostly completed and on the barrel. I will wait to clean up the top edge of the cap until I get it on the gun. I'm hopeful there will be minimal work between the metal and stock to get a good clean fit.
(https://i.ibb.co/LZ9sxq5/Nose-Cap-New-7.png) (https://ibb.co/XCFG7d8)
Before I actually fit this to the gun, I may go and finish the CAD model first. Will be easier to judge how long I want the cap to be, if I can tweak it on the fly in the CAD program.
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I've got some Toeplate Hinges (https://www.muzzleloaderbuilderssupply.com/mbs3cart/agora.cgi?cart_id=5234616.23975&p_id=TP-HING-I&xm=on) ordered from Muzzleloader Builder's Supply.
They're a bit wide for the SMR, but hopefully thinning it down on either side won't make the hinges look weird. At the very least, I can weld the hinges to another piece of metal and make a smaller door with metal on either side.
I'll also have a set of small hinges to copy if it comes down to needing to bend my own.
I plan on making another nose cap this Saturday. I want to do as nice of a job as I can on it. The last one came out pretty good, but I made some filing mistakes on the ramrod channel, and I want to refine the process.
Staining the stock is a good ways off, but I wanted to test the iron nitrate I've got with my heat gun (powerful but small re-flow solder gun). Cut off a bit of curly maple from a board I was using for carving practice, and made a small 45 cal loading block.
Probably boring, but good for me to have a log, and some idea of what colors might do.
Bare Wood
(https://i.ibb.co/NtCz7Kw/Iron-Nitrate-Test-1.png) (https://ibb.co/gm9C6Js)
Iron Nitrate Applied
(https://i.ibb.co/gyyZmwC/Iron-Nitrate-Test-2.png) (https://ibb.co/ZddzGKC)
Heat Applied
(https://i.ibb.co/wzPy5TD/Iron-Nitrate-Test-3.png) (https://ibb.co/3Cj1gwt)
First coat of polymerized tung oil. Looks a lot more red under this light.
(https://i.ibb.co/vBs7VCc/Iron-Nitrate-Test-4.png) (https://ibb.co/thZ7QwH)
Final block with two coats of oil.
(https://i.ibb.co/DMJ8Zd8/Iron-Nitrate-Test-5.png) (https://ibb.co/FYr0Fp0)
(https://i.ibb.co/2MppzvY/Iron-Nitrate-Test-6.png) (https://ibb.co/VCkkFgp)
The heat gun worked very well, and colored things up quite quickly. I don't think it'l be an issue on the full rifle. The digital temperature control should hopefully make it easy around any bits that might have a tendency to scorch.
I can also see that this particular bit of maple came out with for more brown tones than I'd like for the gun. It looks very good in person, and has the cool holographic shimmer effect that polished maple has, I would just like some more red tones. Got some LMF stain coming that I plan to combine with the Iron Nitrate.
Just need to come up with some doodads to make out of maple. Maybe I'll make some nicer powder horn plugs, some of the ones I have are a bit rough and ugly. Don't own a lathe, but I think a drill press can accomplish the task.
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I am very impressed with the 3D printing of your forming blocks and the results on your nose cap.
Would it be possible to print forming blocks for the cup of a spurred butt cap for a pistol?
Here is a link to a tutorial I did for spurred butt caps https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=32410.0
I carved the forming blocks from hardwood.Printed forming blocks would save a pile of work. The blocks would have to be hard enough for hammer shaping of 2mm (0.08") brass sheet.
Please forgive the hijacking of your thread, but I'm very curious about whats possible.
Best regards
Rolf
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45dash,
While I do get what you’re trying to do, I’m not sure of your reason why?
It’s pretty simple, and with a few tools, and some sheet brass, a guy can make that nose cap in under an hour.
I understand if you’re trying to build something you can use over and over again for manufacturing purposes. But for just one?
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I am very impressed with the 3D printing of your forming blocks and the results on your nose cap.
Would it be possible to print forming blocks for the cup of a spurred butt cap for a pistol?
Here is a link to a tutorial I did for spurred butt caps https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=32410.0
I carved the forming blocks from hardwood.Printed forming blocks would save a pile of work. The blocks would have to be hard enough for hammer shaping of 2mm (0.08") brass sheet.
Please forgive the hijacking of your thread, but I'm very curious about whats possible.
Best regards
Rolf
No problem on the hijack, the reason I'm sharing this here is for feedback, positive and negative. Also thought this might be able to benefit others.
Designing and printing the forms would be quite easy. You might also be able to bend it all into shape with less steps. The cool thing about printed parts, is you can make shapes not easily manufacturable in other ways. You can also have forms that split into multiple pieces, making them easier to remove from shaped parts.
Whether or not plastic would hold up to the forces required for .08 brass sheet, I don't know. I haven't worked with sheet brass much, but it looks like steel is more than two times harder than brass, so I doubt that thickness is an issue. The plastic survived me hammering 90 degree bends into the front of the steel caps I made, and your design doesn't have any sharp edges. I'd bet it would work out well. Also, if you destroy a form after making a few caps, it's cheap and easy to just print another one.
I plan to eventually try this out for a rounded cap on a half stock block powder rifle. It's a sidelock gun with all the makings of a longrifle, but I think it just escapes the date cutoff for me to talk about it on this forum.
45dash,
While I do get what you’re trying to do, I’m not sure of your reason why?
It’s pretty simple, and with a few tools, and some sheet brass, a guy can make that nose cap in under an hour.
I understand if you’re trying to build something you can use over and over again for manufacturing purposes. But for just one?
Quality, repeatability, and I can share the printable files. I also have other projects that can benefit from the process. Also, I didn't want to hand shape a forming block for something needing this much precision. I've looked at a ton of nosecaps made online. Some are great, others not so much.
I can do a way better job this way, and that matters with everything being as small or as thin as it is here. Also, most importantly for a hobby, it's fun! Making a bunch of sawdust hand shaping a form that needs fractions of a millimeter of precision would be less fun. :)
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Well, still not perfect, but much better than the others. Probably wasted a bit of time polishing it to this degree before fitting, but I really wanted to see what it would look like all tidied up. I think it should look pretty good once the metal is finished. Hopefully it fits the wood well. I think I'll rivet it on, or at the least, make fake ones.
(https://i.ibb.co/VCCnvy0/Nose-Cap-Final-1.png) (https://ibb.co/B66WgDH)
(https://i.ibb.co/WFQfCfX/Nose-Cap-Final-2.png) (https://ibb.co/mtm4p4K)
(https://i.ibb.co/48Z1mBp/Nose-Cap-Final-3.png) (https://ibb.co/1rfzvHT)
(https://i.ibb.co/4V3wMWF/Nose-Cap-Final-4.png) (https://ibb.co/kSvV0KG)
Fitting it to the wood will have to happen another day. In the meantime, I'm trying to decide what to do about the area behind the cheekpiece. The curl kinda dies away there, and I think it could use something to tie everything together.
Obvious answer is an inlay of some sort. I've never tried engraving anything though, so I'm considering wire inlay in the form of a more conventional southern inlay. I think it'd be a good way to get some detail and depth without needing to engrave an expensive piece of silver. I'll tackle that kind of thing after a bunch of practice.
I think an anthropomorphized crescent moon would be cool, if I can come up with a design that looks good in wire. Been watching videos, and reading about how to do it, and it doesn't look all that difficult. Relative to relief carving or engraving anyway. I'll just need to practice on scrap wood first.
Forgive the sharpie on the buttplate. I need to clean it off. Makes it look like I have some terrible gaps.
(https://i.ibb.co/gjrCkpK/Cheek-Rest-Blank.png) (https://ibb.co/HFKQ5s8)
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Nose cap looks good! And it looks like you did good work fitting the butt plate as well.
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Nose cap looks good! And it looks like you did good work fitting the butt plate as well.
Thanks!
The butt plate went on pretty well, just kept removing material until things worked. Did need to drill new holes for the screws on the top, and I need to sand everything to final level. That can wait until I get the toeplate, and any inlays installed.
Was talking to my brother yesterday, he thinks acorns or oak leaves might make good inlays. Fitting bait for squirrels and deer at least.
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Please no acorns and oak leaves! These can be dressed up, but I think it’s best to follow originals for a bit of guidance. Gary Ludwig posted a kit a while back that looked pretty awesome. Search for it. Might give you some ideas. But, in the end, if it makes you guys happy that’s good enough for me
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Please no acorns and oak leaves! These can be dressed up, but I think it’s best to follow originals for a bit of guidance. Gary Ludwig posted a kit a while back that looked pretty awesome. Search for it. Might give you some ideas. But, in the end, if it makes you guys happy that’s good enough for me
Hahaha. With that strong of a reaction, I guess it was further away from normal than I thought. I've been searching for original guns as much as I can online, and have purchased a few books. A lot of the most recommended ones are hard to find. Figured since simple geometric shapes, both abstract and real were common, it wouldn't be that out there. Maybe I just stopped taking things as seriously after I found a gun with a chicken inlay. :D
A lot of the more abstract guns, along with the chicken were from Georgia, maybe there's something in the water down there. I probably need to do a better job separating regions. I'm from the far west, so most states that far away from me kinda get lumped into "East Coast", and "South" in my mind. Sorry if that's insulting. ;D
I did order a ton of CD's and thumb drives and images from the Kentucky Rifle Foundation this last weekend. Hopefully they get here soon, and I can find an external CD drive (think they stopped using those back in the percussion era). That'l give me some more stuff to look at.
I'll also see if I can find Gary's recent gun.
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I've got the toeplate patchbox from MBS, but the knuckle spacing is such that it'l look bad and not leave enough material on the outer knuckles when trimmed to fit the narrow SMR.
Read the great tutorial on bending hinges by Acer Saccharum here: https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=22371.0
The tool he made looked really handy. While I could make something like this out of metal, filing would take forever, and my CNC router would make a mess (I really need to run coolant when cutting steel). Thought about wood, but figured it'd split out way too easy. Since plastic worked last time, thought I might try it again.
I decided to try a two stage approach. Wasn't sure if a small lip would break or not. This is PLA plastic. It's the cheapest and easiest stuff to 3D print. Quite strong, but not very heat resistant. Cost about 60 cents to make.
(https://i.ibb.co/7n8tF0V/Hinge-Formers-1.png) (https://ibb.co/Byd2RYj)
Hammered the metal flat over the edge of the vice first, then put the bigger former in place.
(https://i.ibb.co/dWSdRZc/Hinge-Formers-2.png) (https://ibb.co/bWxSkt3)
Pried up with a screwdriver a bit, then hammered to 90ish.
(https://i.ibb.co/VCgkq4M/Hinge-Formers-3.png) (https://ibb.co/my9PcWh)
Swapped out the big former for the small lip version, and hammered the rest of the way over.
(https://i.ibb.co/Qk77p7k/Hinge-Formers-4.png) (https://ibb.co/ScDD5Dc)
It worked very well. A piece of the 1/16 wire that comes with the Kibler kit for pinning stuff together dropped right in.
(https://i.ibb.co/b2Cwqym/Hinge-Formers-5.png) (https://ibb.co/hZ4Qhn9)
Was surprisingly easy to hammer it cleanly around the wire.
(https://i.ibb.co/K7rNkH2/Hinge-Formers-6.png) (https://ibb.co/wCzJX1S)
(https://i.ibb.co/ZhqBw72/Hinge-Formers-7.png) (https://ibb.co/Hr5tM3h)
Now, this material is thinner than I plan to use (it's 22 gauge - .030"), but I'm still impressed by how easy it was. It probably only took me 5 minutes to make, and I've never tried to do a hinge before.
If the thicker material works this well when it gets here, I'll be very happy.
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If you are looking for pictures of original southern rifles there are several in the library on this forum.
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If you are looking for pictures of original southern rifles there are several in the library on this forum.
I've done some browsing through the library, and there's some good stuff on here. Lots of broken links, and broken pictures as well. Some of that being the typical photobucket rot. May take some time to make a list of stuff to fix, and see if I can salvage the broken photobucket links.
I got the KRF pictures in the mail. And fortunately, even though it says CD's on their website, everything came on thumb drives. Much easier to deal with in case anybody else was thinking of ordering from them.
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The thicker sheet metal for the patchbox didn't arrive on time, so I've spent the weekend on accessories for the gun instead.
First time working with veg tanned leather, but it really came out well. Always good to start with something simple.
It's tiny, but holds 25-26 .440 round balls. Should be perfect for a small hunting pouch to go with the SMR.
(https://i.ibb.co/K9Rwdh6/2-5-Flask-Build-10.png) (https://ibb.co/LCb5mRS)
Just gotta design and make a pouch for it.
Here's a build thread for the flask. https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=78588.0
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Got the steel for the toeplate yesterday, so I can hopefully get some work done on it this weekend.
Drew this up quickly as I wanted to figure out a good release mechanism. Also modded the hinge a bit, as I wanted it as low profile as possible. Then I realized doing so would make it impossible to install the pin. ::)
(https://i.ibb.co/rc4p5GZ/Toe-Plate-Patch-Box-1.png) (https://ibb.co/61gtDR4)
(https://i.ibb.co/nMYTQsm/Toe-Plate-Patch-Box-2.png) (https://ibb.co/DfvNwDW)
Oh well, I'll just have to deal with a hinge that sticks out more, or flip things around and make the hinge bump hidden. I will also likely make the door longer, but this will suffice for now as I play with different release mechanisms. I'd like a semi-recessed button so that it can't be accidentally triggered sending all my stuff onto the ground.
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What's the latest skinny on the nosecap? Waiting for some different steel or just going to let that project sit awhile before you go back and get a final result? Interested in your final outcome.
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What's the latest skinny on the nosecap? Waiting for some different steel or just going to let that project sit awhile before you go back and get a final result? Interested in your final outcome.
Actually, I think I'm done with the nosecap. The last one I made is the one I plan to use, just haven't decided on length for it yet. I need to take the time to get some better measurements of the actual stock rather than relying on the picture in the first post. It worked fine for a rough outline, but for more complex areas like the lock, I want exact dimensions. Once that's done, I'll be able to see the whole thing in the computer before I decide to start removing wood.
I want to do a good CAD model for more than just checking how things look. It'l be good practice for designing my own gun. I'm one of those people who's relatively tall, with freakishly long arms and wide shoulders. Generally wingspan matches height, but I'm way over. Would like to make something with a 15-15.5 inch length of pull. I can adjust to shorter (normal rifles), but it's not as comfortable as a proper length buttstock.
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I will also likely make the door longer, but this will suffice for now as I play with different release mechanisms. I'd like a semi-recessed button so that it can't be accidentally triggered sending all my stuff onto the ground.
The original just used a catch like this one: https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=2613.0
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Curious 45dash, you have your SMR completed with new nosecap. Hae any pics?