AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: David R. Pennington on June 11, 2024, 07:38:00 PM
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I had this idea about building a flintlock survival rifle. Any one else ever considered that notion? I have an old CVA kit gun I could sacrifice barrel from or even an old octagon barrel from a rifle I have that’s chambered for an obsolete rimfire cartridge. Nothing following any historical style, just a small light utilitarian gun. Maybe even fix stock so it could break down to pack.
The flintlock would be the perfect survival weapon. All you would need is a mold, some lead and a little powder. If ammunition and caps were hard to get you can always find a rock.
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Perhaps a small amount of powder and ball in a "patch box"?
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That is how I think of a NorthWest trade gun that's been shortened. Anything from 28 bore or larger.
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Survival gun is the one you have with you when it’s needed, a special made for the purpose one is most likely not with you.
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When I think of the guns, pistols built here, pretty sure, historically, they all where survival guns back then. If we talking nowadays, it certainly wouldn't be a muzzleloader.
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There are some American flintlock rifles, particularly some from New England, that had hooked breeches and the forends had a joint so the barrel and most of the forend could be removed allowing the rifle to be more easily stowed. There are also muzzleloaders with hinged wrists that allow the gun to fold at to be stored. Something like that might make a nice "pack rifle."
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Look up muzzleloader poacher guns.There some ingenious designs of poacher guns some with butt stocks that takedown others with hollowed out stocks and screw off barrels like the screw barrel pistols etc
(https://i.ibb.co/VMggn6C/IMG-0361.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
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Joe S., I think you missed my point. In survival gun I meant one that could be relied on if society totally collapsed to the point modern ammunition no longer available. Just conjecture on my part. Wasn’t very long ago we had “supply chain issues” and certain things were hard to come by.
Just thinking out loud.
I like the image shared of poacher’s gun. Could come a time when we would be forced to poach the state’s game to feed hungry mouths.
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My idea of a survival gun would be a 24 gauge trade gun, with a thirty inch barrel, and a good large flintlock. That would shoot shot,and a round ball, along with a .58 cal. Mini. It would weigh about six pounds and have enough options to allow you to hunt almost anything.
Hungry Horse
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Joe S., I think you missed my point. In survival gun I meant one that could be relied on if society totally collapsed to the point modern ammunition no longer available. Just conjecture on my part. Wasn’t very long ago we had “supply chain issues” and certain things were hard to come by.
Just thinking out loud.
I like the image shared of poacher’s gun. Could come a time when we would be forced to poach the state’s game to feed hungry mouths.
You're absolutely right in your thinking. Having lived for decades in places that are just what the average American imagines when he says "SHTF", i.e. power grid inexistent or collapsed, empty fuel stations but thriving black market, bands of armed miscreants roaming the countryside, undrinkable water, close to zero healthcare available, limited supply of drugs, and so on, I can tell you that: 1.) It's not as bad as one could think, and by far (unless you are in an area of open war or genocide, of course...), 2.) One gets used to it quite rapidly, and 3.) Forget about finding ammo, unless you pick it from the enemy or from friendlies, and that's not hunting ammo. There won't be any spares either.
In this context, a flintlock rifle makes perfect sense: you don't depend on anyone for your supply of ammunition, and can feed yourself off the land. If you have any mechanical skills at all, even rough, you'll be able to keep that piece going as long as you live.
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My thinking in regards to having a flintlock for a survival tool suggests that yes, it’s a good option but I’d want to learn to make powder first and foremost in any attempt to remain sustainable in a grid down scenario. Just my 2 cents.
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I suspect that if anyone would rely upon parts from an old CVA kit gun to build a 'survival gun', that their likelihood of survival would be slim to none.
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Bob did you read my post? The only thing from the CVA I would use is the barrel, rebreached for flint. Despite the junky spanish percussion lock and weird breach with the right load it shot pretty well (when it would go off)
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Bob did you read my post? The only thing from the CVA I would use is the barrel, rebreached for flint. Despite the junky spanish percussion lock and weird breach with the right load it shot pretty well (when it would go off)
I did David. Imagining a worst case social scenario, though, a modern firearm is preferable in every way to a rifled (I assume) flintlock whatever that you are imagining.
That is if one stocks up on modern ammo, as you probably realize ;D
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Well that was my hypothetical scenario, societal breakdown, modern ammunition not available. Flintlock would be handy and small stock of powder would go a long way. No doubt modern firearms superior but if ammunition and primers not available, useless.
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If things go that sideways? Survival is not going to be about shooting something to eat.
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If things go that sideways? Survival is not going to be about shooting something to eat.
A lot of people don’t understand that. About 99% of what people discuss on this particular subject is often abject silliness.
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(**Quote removed due to rule violations.**)
Dennis
I seriously edited my post to what it was because of where I was posting.
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Like this?
(https://i.ibb.co/hcmNc4W/7d0e329d6fd93a130db76a129b8783cd.jpg)[/url
Sorry couldn't resist
(https://ibb.co/Sc3gcMn)
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Joe S., I think you missed my point. In survival gun I meant one that could be relied on if society totally collapsed to the point modern ammunition no longer available. Just conjecture on my part. Wasn’t very long ago we had “supply chain issues” and certain things were hard to come by.
Just thinking out loud.
I like the image shared of poacher’s gun. Could come a time when we would be forced to poach the state’s game to feed hungry mouths.
You're absolutely right in your thinking. Having lived for decades in places that are just what the average American imagines when he says "SHTF", i.e. power grid inexistent or collapsed, empty fuel stations but thriving black market, bands of armed miscreants roaming the countryside, undrinkable water, close to zero healthcare available, limited supply of drugs, and so on, I can tell you that: 1.) It's not as bad as one could think, and by far (unless you are in an area of open war or genocide, of course...), 2.) One gets used to it quite rapidly, and 3.) Forget about finding ammo, unless you pick it from the enemy or from friendlies, and that's not hunting ammo. There won't be any spares either.
In this context, a flintlock rifle makes perfect sense: you don't depend on anyone for your supply of ammunition, and can feed yourself off the land. If you have any mechanical skills at all, even rough, you'll be able to keep that piece going as long as you live.
This. A lot of "survivalists" or 'preppers" envision some fantasy world akin to the "Walking Dead," "Lights Out," "The Postman" and other fictional works where the survivors will be engaging in daily gun battles. If it's like that, the poster who commented that survival won't be about finding something to eat is probably correct because most of the would-be survivors won't even live long enough to die of thirst, much less starvation.
There are plenty of survivors who have and continue to survive for years and decades under conditions that most modern people can't even imagine. Those people don't have Glocks, ARs and AKs, and wouldn't be able to feed them if they did. Instead they have single shot shotguns (and reload the shells with black powder), or even "Dane" guns. In that situation a flinter would be a great survival gun. I would also like to have my .22 caliber Benjamin pumper air rifle. Not only do I have a good supply of pellets for it; I also have a pellet mold.
I would probably use that pellet gun more than the muzzleloader because it would be less likely to draw unwanted attention.
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Bob did you read my post? The only thing from the CVA I would use is the barrel, rebreached for flint. Despite the junky spanish percussion lock and weird breach with the right load it shot pretty well (when it would go off)
Well, all I can add is if you're considering using a CVA percussion barrel here's what happen to me. I wanted a short barrel rifle and I had a CVA barrel in my pile for years. So, I cut off the percussion....plus some more and made a hook breach from that. When I cut the barrel for the hook breech, here's what was hidden inside the barrel.
I'd never use a CVA barrel for anything.
(https://i.imgur.com/khfzENWl.jpg)
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I don't plan on surviving with a flintlock. I have other guns for when times get tough. It will be several decades before I run out of pew pew pew.
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What ever you decide get 2…….one is none, two is one! Just my 2 cents.
I like the idea of air rifles either .22 or .25 caliber……..even Merriwether Lewis took one over the continental divide.
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I'm with Mike...time for the class three's.. I'm to old to play games anymore...
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Let’s stop talking modern guns using code or straight language.
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Joe S., I think you missed my point. In survival gun I meant one that could be relied on if society totally collapsed to the point modern ammunition no longer available. Just conjecture on my part. Wasn’t very long ago we had “supply chain issues” and certain things were hard to come by.
Just thinking out loud.
I like the image shared of poacher’s gun. Could come a time when we would be forced to poach the state’s game to feed hungry mouths.
You're absolutely right in your thinking. Having lived for decades in places that are just what the average American imagines when he says "SHTF", i.e. power grid inexistent or collapsed, empty fuel stations but thriving black market, bands of armed miscreants roaming the countryside, undrinkable water, close to zero healthcare available, limited supply of drugs, and so on, I can tell you that: 1.) It's not as bad as one could think, and by far (unless you are in an area of open war or genocide, of course...), 2.) One gets used to it quite rapidly, and 3.) Forget about finding ammo, unless you pick it from the enemy or from friendlies, and that's not hunting ammo. There won't be any spares either.
In this context, a flintlock rifle makes perfect sense: you don't depend on anyone for your supply of ammunition, and can feed yourself off the land. If you have any mechanical skills at all, even rough, you'll be able to keep that piece going as long as you live.
This. A lot of "survivalists" or 'preppers" envision some fantasy world akin to the "Walking Dead," "Lights Out," "The Postman" and other fictional works where the survivors will be engaging in daily gun battles. If it's like that, the poster who commented that survival won't be about finding something to eat is probably correct because most of the would-be survivors won't even live long enough to die of thirst, much less starvation.
There are plenty of survivors who have and continue to survive for years and decades under conditions that most modern people can't even imagine. Those people don't have Glocks, ARs and AKs, and wouldn't be able to feed them if they did. Instead they have single shot shotguns (and reload the shells with black powder), or even "Dane" guns. In that situation a flinter would be a great survival gun. I would also like to have my .22 caliber Benjamin pumper air rifle. Not only do I have a good supply of pellets for it; I also have a pellet mold.
I would probably use that pellet gun more than the muzzleloader because it would be less likely to draw unwanted attention.
In reality in an end of civilization type survival situation the best way to survive would be
becoming a ghost and have as little interaction with others as possible.Even ganging up with other survivors would not be ideal as that could quickly turn into a Lord of the Flies situation where the weaker members are ruled by the stronger ones.In my opinion the one thing a lot of survivor enthusiasts ignore would be the fact that most would probably either commit suicide or go completely insane do to the mental stress of living in a world that everything and possibly everyone they knew is gone and not coming back and having to live to day to day in a dog eat dog world.How many of us would love to live in a world like that.Saving ones family would give one a strong incentive to live but losing or seeing loved ones die would put most people in a mind set that would probably be counter productive to long time survival.
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Wow, two of my favorite subjects.....IMnotsoHO, the early colonial muskets WERE survival guns. You need a round all big enough to kill a bad guy or a deer, a shot charge for suitable for turkey, pigeon, rabbit or squirrel......barrel length suitable for terrain, a sling....a big lock with a big rock...anybody have anything like this?
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Hey David, keep watching the mini mall for a great deal on a good m/l barrel like you found there several years ago ;D
Dave F