AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Gun Collecting => Topic started by: shaunb on July 01, 2024, 11:20:27 PM
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Hello all,
I'm new here seeking advice and information on this musket which I've acquired, I'm lead to believe it's American but I'll let you guys decide. I've managed to take the barrel off and got pictures of a marking which was previously hidden from sight.
I'm at a loss in terms of information about it which seems sad as it's such a nice rifle, would love to know more about it.
Many thanks!
(https://i.ibb.co/gR1shrr/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-06-f28fbdd3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tJfyFHH)
(https://i.ibb.co/MfcwGNc/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-06-a9c045ab.jpg) (https://ibb.co/68H91sH)
(https://i.ibb.co/K5kKhnV/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-06-0ff69829.jpg) (https://ibb.co/51yK4Zs)
(https://i.ibb.co/YQSWQDH/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-06-1f158cd4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DWFbWG0)
(https://i.ibb.co/sP9bq41/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-06-9a328cf4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JdjmHTp)
(https://i.ibb.co/q5Pk3P9/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-15-02-07-d7bd3ce0.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6Bfg7fb)
(https://i.ibb.co/pPzX9dr/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-12-01-45-a856d98c.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1nq2wTJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/mz00d7Q/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-12-01-02-34658b10.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nkBB4Sh)
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This is not a "Musket" which is a term for a military piece. This gun has no attachments for a sling and is not adapted for a bayonet. That being said, you are very blessed to possess such a gun. The triggerguard suggests Dutch manufacture to me, but others more knowledgeable than I will hopefully chime in. Brass barrels of this length are very rare. Found commonly on pistols and blunderbusses: rarely seen on long guns. Rifled brass barrels are known but rare. Smooth bored barrels are intended for shot mostly and generally considered to be fowlers for bird hunting. I look forward to seeing what others have to say. Wormey
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Is that a solid brass bbl,,or is it a 1/2 round sheath of thin brass formed around the top 1/2+ of the bbl and soldered in place.
Just asking,, I don't know.
Just kind of looks like it might be from the underside pics of the bbl..
Nice looking gun for sure.
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I was thinking the same thing. looks like a brass covering.
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Are you sure it’s a rifle, not a Smoothbore? Looks like a Fowler. It’s in great condition and I wonder when it was built. But I am sure that it’s a very cool gun!
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Thank you for your replies, never actually realised it you're correct it looks to be potentially covered in brass rather than being fully brass.
If you need further pictures/measurements let me know and happy to take them.
(https://i.ibb.co/z8HPJq4/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-02-at-08-14-56-8b2ef68d.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4sg4dhV)
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Hmmm, I've never seen that before. Why cover one in brass, decoration?
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Are you sure it’s a rifle, not a Smoothbore? Looks like a Fowler. It’s in great condition and I wonder when it was built. But I am sure that it’s a very cool gun!
I noted the unworn-looking prominent carving at the entry thimble, and wondered the same. Cool gun.
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Interested to know what date you'd think it's from? I suspect brass covering for decoration, could also be why there's not that many marks on it as they potentially would have been on the original metal.
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I would suggest the brass covering is for protection from rusting on the barrel exposed to the elements and/or for appearance.
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Maybe a brass barrel with a steel liner?
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I've seen a couple old barrels done like that, a thin brass sheet or foil attached to the upper side of the barrel. Can only assume it was either for bling, or for protection, or both.
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I suspect it is "close plated"...a technique where a sheet of brass foil was "ironed" on. The barrel would have been tinned with solder and the brass applied by heating the barrel and pressing it with shaped tools much like a conventional soldering iron. This is how all plating was done in the 18th century before the development of electroplating. Close plating resulted is a far thicker and more durable surface than electroplating so it continued to be used right into the 20th century, especially on early cars which had outside levers to operate the brake and transmission. It didn't rust so it allowed the levers to have the strength of steel but the look of brass (or nickel silver) and it was very unlikely anyone could polish through it. The silver plated officer's sabers made by Nathan Starr were done this way and I know of a 1799 Starr saber with a close plated hilt.
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Yes! This piece was done exactly the way you describe, thin brass foil that looked almost 'ironed on' over a tinned barrel. Bucks Co, probably late 18th century or very early 19th. Red varnish w/ fake striping. Fairly stocky gun too, restocked earlier components.
(https://i.ibb.co/1fDJrLD/bucksmil1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4Z6g876)
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Thank you for your information, really interesting stuff. I'm certainly learning a lot about it. Does anyone recognise what I believe to be the R stamp on the barrel?
I thought it to be a R with crown or something but not too sure.
(https://i.ibb.co/0DrFgMC/Whats-App-Image-2024-07-01-at-12-01-45-a856d98c.jpg) (https://ibb.co/smq60wK)