AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Gun Collecting => Topic started by: rlm on January 27, 2012, 03:52:02 AM
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There are some incredible pictures of a pristine Leonard Reedy rifle at morphyauctions.com . The rifle will be sold February 25th. The pictures are in Morphy's the online catalogue for this sale. I have nothing to do with this sale, only mention it because there is so much to be gained by studying these photos.
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Shortcut direct, nice horn near the top of the page, and other niceties.
http://morphyauctions.auctionflex.com/showlots.ap?co=31120&weid=21695&weiid=0&archive=n&lso=lotnumasc&pagenum=18&lang=En
Bill
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Thanks rim, it is nice to see such a nice rifle in fine condition. I find it very interesting to have J.J. Henry's name on the sweet spot of the barrel and not tucked under the lower flats. Sure is an unmistakable work of L. Reedy though IMO. Anyone have any thoughts why Reedy would have given Henry such high honors?
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Majorjoel, Reedy probably put the barrel in that way because that was the way it was finished. Many old barrels do not have the lower flats filed to be exposed.
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I thought the photos showed alot to a guy like me. A few shots were not the usual photos. For example the underside of the butt that shows the carving in profile was enlightening. A fine rifle and a good study in my opinion ( for whatever that was worth)
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Possibly a restock of a J.J. Henry by Ready?
I have examined a very typical Leonard Ready stocked / carved rifle utilizing the metal from a J. Roop rifle. The barrel signed J. Roop, the PB distinctly Roop, a nice rifle with a fairly crisp stock. tim
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My bet is on Mr. Reedy doing a restock for a customer. JIM
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That's a nice rifle and I don't doubt it'll bring some serious bucks!
As for it being a restock by Reedy, that's a good question. If it was originally all his construction, I can see the lock having a lock makers name on it, but it seems strange that he would build a rifle with another makers name on the barrel, in that location. Obviously this suggests a restock of JJ Henry parts.
But I don't think the remainder, mainly the brass parts are JJ Henry. I think they're Reedy parts.
The PB is obviously his. The side plate has his little filed detail up by the front screw. The butt plate has his wedding band detail at the finale. However, I'm not sure about the toe plate being a Reedy piece?
So maybe a Reedy made gun, except foe the barrel and lock? Can any Reedy experts here point out other parts that are definitely Reedy made? Or definitely Not made by him?
Thanks for posting the link, rim
TimM, Was that the Reedy /Roop at the Vegas show a couple years ago?
John
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That's a nice rifle and I don't doubt it'll bring some serious bucks!
As for it being a restock by Reedy, that's a good question. If it was originally all his construction, I can see the lock having a lock makers name on it, but it seems strange that he would build a rifle with another makers name on the barrel, in that location. Obviously this suggests a restock of JJ Henry parts.
But I don't think the remainder, mainly the brass parts are JJ Henry. I think they're Reedy parts.
The PB is obviously his. The side plate has his little filed detail up by the front screw. The butt plate has his wedding band detail at the finale. However, I'm not sure about the toe plate being a Reedy piece?
So maybe a Reedy made gun, except foe the barrel and lock? Can any Reedy experts here point out other parts that are definitely Reedy made? Or definitely Not made by him?
Thanks for posting the link, rim
TimM, Was that the Reedy /Roop at the Vegas show a couple years ago?
John
In my opinion that is a Reedy toe plate; See the ALR museum Reedy. Very similar toeplate.
Bob
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John
Yep, that Ready / Roop was offered a few years ago at what I thought was a very reasonable price at the January Las Vegas Antique show. I would like to have been able to afford it at the time....That rifle used to live 5 minutes from me along with the nicest Leonard Ready I've ever seen in or out of a book. tim
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Thanks Bob! The toe plate is good too!
Tim, Yes, that was a good buy on that rifle, and seems to me that it sold at the show pretty quickly.
That other Reeedy you mentioned sold for some Serious bucks!
It should be interesting to see what this auction Reedy goes for. It has all the attributes to be a high buck rifle, but I think the price will be dependant on whether the bidders look at it as a true Reedy rifle, or a Reedy restock of a JJ Henry.
After looking at the pics some more, I'm thinking that if it's a restock, the barrel and lock are the only likely JJ Henry parts. It would be nice to get a better look at the trigger guard and thimbles and the like.
John
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I surely don't view this piece as anything but purely a Ready rifle! The elements that make this piece a Ready rifle are all there. If anything the Henry markings are charming,...fuel for the imagination.
I viewed the Ready/Roop re-stock in almost the same light, but points off for the Roop patch box, still a great rifle. Respectfully tim
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In case anyone is interested this rifle sold for $76,800 including buyers premium but not including 6% PA sales tax. I took a day off work to see the rifle before the sale. I have never seen a 190 year old Kentucky rifle look so crisp. The photos in the auction catalog are good but the actual article is remarkable.
The J J Henry mark on the top barrel flat is really rather inconspicuous. The image of this mark was greatly magnified in the photo.
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My take on this rifle is this: Reedy built the rifle for Henry and used barrel and lock from Henry's shop. This identifies who the owner was, an important individual, and Reedy's work was self identified. They may very well have known each other and worked on some projects, perhaps this one, on occasion. Since Reedy rarely ever signed his work, he probably was not bothered by the signature anomoly and the barrel and lock likely didn't cost anything since they could have been furnished to complete the rifle build. That might account for the higher than usual quality of this rifle and it is interesting to note that it brought more than the 'perfect' Reedy mentioned above, by many thousands of dollars. Reedy would be proud that he and his work are so well regarded.
Dick
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Save those 23 photos. The rifle will probably disappear forever into a private collection. Those pictures are worth millions of words.
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My take on this rifle is this: Reedy built the rifle for Henry and used barrel and lock from Henry's shop. This identifies who the owner was, an important individual, and Reedy's work was self identified. They may very well have known each other and worked on some projects, perhaps this one, on occasion.
If we think that Reedy used a barrel and lock from Henry's shop (that is, these components have the J. J. Henry/Boulton stamp because Henry's shop made them), what leads us to think that he made the rifle FOR Henry? Couldn't he have just been routinely using Henry's barrels and locks on his rifles and this is one of those rifles?
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these components have the J. J. Henry/Boulton stamp because Henry's shop made them
The stamps on the barrel and lock are different. One of the H's appears to be an M which was overstruck with an H and it doesn't appear to be double stamped. Did this not raise any concerns for anyone?
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Interesting. I had seen that "H" on the barrel as having a bit of damage (like the "E" next to it) but not originally as an "M." Could be, though. What does that suggest to you?
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I held this rifle in my hands. The people at Morphy's were very gracious in allowing this under their supervision. I don't propose to be the quintessential expert on Kentuckys, but believe me the barrel stamp is identical to the stamp on the lock so you can get an idea of scale, it's small. In the photo the barrel stamp may have the appearance of an M over-stamped by an H, but I am positive that the markings were made by the same one piece die, not made by stamping one letter at a time. The spacing is just too perfect and again identical on the lock and the barrel. Actually the whole issue of J. J. Henry's name on the barrel is in my opinion of no consequence.
I have seen enough Reedy rifles to know that this is the real deal; and again in absolutely pristine condition. Worth every penny paid.
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(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi102.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fm104%2FML-L%2Fstamps.jpg&hash=d1f518541923a8663b7fc16f2fcbf3e3b89ae7a4)
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The two pictures are taken at different angles, it seems to me, the lower one "straight on" and the upper one a bit from the right. That said, the relations of the letters seem identical in top and bottom. Look at how, for instance, the period after the second "J" is directly above the left serif of the "U" in Boulton, and the way the two bottom serifs in the "H" sit directly above, on the one hand, the right serif of the "U" and, on the other, the serif of the "L." In both cases there's an identical, slightly larger space between the "L" and the "T," which, again, ends up lining up (in both cases) the bottom serif of the "N" in Henry directly above the right side of the "T." The bottom right edge of the "R" in the top and bottom stamp falls slightly above the straight line that the rest of the bottoms of the letters of "J. J. HENRY" form. The period after the first "J" falls, in both cases, right above the slightly distended bottom loop of the "B" in Boulton. Seems to me that, though the angles that the pictures were taken seem a bit off, the stamps are the same.
Do others see it differently?
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Looks that way to me too Steve......the H/M may be a blemish on the barrel making the H look like and M... Sure looks like and M in the picture
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I have seen and handled a fair number of Reedy rifles; not all of them by a long shot, but a dozen, or so. One had his name in hand on the top of the barrel, one had J.Roop, stamped, (another gun maker), and the rest have had nothing. There are two other rifles that I am aware of that bear his signature, as well.
Then comes along this rifle with J.Henry in two places; must mean something.
The stamping, (stamps), is not of any consequence as makers often had several for various uses. As to who Reedy relied on for barrels and so forth is not exactly known, but this unique rifle shows a potential association with Henry at least once. To my knowledge there are no other Reedy rifles with Henry stamping anywhere on them, or any other stamping/names for that matter.
Hope the new owner will give us the benefit of his assessment on his fine new rifle.
Dick
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Would not be the first maker to use parts from the Henry Gun Works at Boulton. The Jacobsburg Society has past records from Boulton showing the sale of parts to Nicholas Hawk. J J Henry would be John Joseph Henry. John Joseph Henry I ran away from home so it may be John Joseph Henry II who assumed management of the Henry Works in about 1812. The JJ Henry house still exists at Boulton.