AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Black Powder Shooting => Topic started by: hatman on July 16, 2016, 03:08:57 AM
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Well, on my 2nd outing with MikeT's 1803 Harper's Ferry rifle I'm stuck with a dry ball.
I was using a .530 ball with .018 lubed pillow ticking when I ran a ball with no powder.
We tried shooting it out to no avail so we tried a ball puller.
I had to use a brass adapter to fit both the puller and the rod, but alas the adapter broke off when we tried pulling.
We even ran some gun oil down the barrel and let it sit for a few minutes before extraction.
Now, the ball covering up the touch hole so no hope of trying to shoot it out.
Before I take it to a gunsmith to remove the barrel and breech plug does anyone have any ideas?
One guy at the range wondered if some type of corrosive liquid could be used (like for instance battery acid) to dissolve the patch but doesn't hurt the barrel.
Right now I'm just disgusted with myself. :(
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Sooner or later dry ballin' will get us all. I'd try a co2 discharger before unbreaching.
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
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Sooner or later dry ballin' will get us all. I'd try a co2 discharger before unbreaching.
Not sure how that would work since the ball is clearly below the touch hole. With the pick, there's no room.
But I appreciate all feedback. Thank you.
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
Wait a minute, you can't feel anything sticking out above the ball but you're still trying to capture any threads? Threads to what?
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Shoot a light down the barrel and find out what is down there.
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A friend of mine had this to happen last year. Could not pull the ball under any circumstances. I took the rifle to my shop and used my ramrod hole drill (the one I use to drill ramrod holes in stocks when building rifles) to drill through the ball. Drilling through the ball was fast and simple and the ball easily came out when I removed the drill. Close inspection afterwards revealed no damage to rifling. The rifle shoots the same.
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For heavens sake debreech it. Don't ruin the bore. Bob
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
Wait a minute, you can't feel anything sticking out above the ball but you're still trying to capture any threads? Threads to what?
I just meant we were hoping there WAS something to capture.
Again I appreciate all feedback.
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Shoot a light down the barrel and find out what is down there.
All I have is a flashlight. That didn't work. Thanks.
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A friend of mine had this to happen last year. Could not pull the ball under any circumstances. I took the rifle to my shop and used my ramrod hole drill (the one I use to drill ramrod holes in stocks when building rifles) to drill through the ball. Drilling through the ball was fast and simple and the ball easily came out when I removed the drill. Close inspection afterwards revealed no damage to rifling. The rifle shoots the same.
Would I be better off buying a ramrod hole drill or taking it to a gunsmith?
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For heavens sake debreech it. Don't ruin the bore. Bob
OK thanks for that.
Sounds like "negative" on any patch dissolving (and non-bore hurting) liquid.
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
Wait a minute, you can't feel anything sticking out above the ball but you're still trying to capture any threads? Threads to what?
I just meant we were hoping there WAS something to capture.
Again I appreciate all feedback.
OK, I'm still confused here, is the ball puller still in the ball or not?
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
Wait a minute, you can't feel anything sticking out above the ball but you're still trying to capture any threads? Threads to what?
I just meant we were hoping there WAS something to capture.
Again I appreciate all feedback.
OK, I'm still confused here, is the ball puller still in the ball or not?
Yes sir.
A piece of the brass adapter threads are in the ramrod.
Using a thin metal ramrod I can't feel anything sticking out of the ball.
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That's what I was afraid of. Can you work a worm down in to try and work it free? Some of those worms are pretty stout and can grab it and turn it out of the ball.
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That's what I was afraid of. Can you work a worm down in to try and work it free? Some of those worms are pretty stout and can grab it and turn it out of the ball.
Thank you. I'll try that in the morning.
Assuming that doesn't work, what are my options?
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If you feel anything sticking out of the ball....have you tried another ball screw???
I have 2 different ball screws I use...a longer thinner one and a thicker one with real aggressive threads...
I've pulled the ball screws out of lead when I didn't turn them in deep enough...tried again or switched to the other ball puller and got it in...
Id try working another puller into it...but I'm kinda confused on what is broke off....
Removing a barrel and removing the breech plug isn't a huge deal..if you don't have the right tools you might wanna leave a competent person work on it...find a local BP gun builder or BP gunsmith...i wouldn't trust most modern gun Smith's..they may do the same as you could at home and throw it in a vice and take a wrench to it..but not the proper designed vice jaws or wrench...my thoughts anyways....
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Mmmmmm. May not have the tools to properly remove the breech. Absolute last resort anyway.
Another way is to buy a length of steel tube from the hardware store. Diameter just under bore size. Cut/file series of saw teeth on one end. Smooth the outside so as not to scratch the bore. Drill a hole through the other end to take a cross bar. Use it like a hole saw to eat away the circumference of the ball and the patch. Clean regularly. As soon as the edge is removed the ball will just fall out.
A useful trick too if a stuck ball rotates with the screw. Tap the teeth into the ball, hold the tube firmly with cross bar removed and run the screw down the centre. The tube will stop the ball rotating.
These are old gunsmiths tricks.
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I had something very similar happen to me with a '63 Springfield. The screww just kept pulling lose and I eventually had to pull the breech and drive out the ball with an oak dowel rod. I spent more time pulling it with no results than removing the breech and driving it out. So told it took about 20 min to pull and drive it out.
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Hello Hatman,
Welcome to the sometimes frustrating past time of shooting "powderless" muzzleloaders.
As a "newby" you are most likely ill equipped for the task that awaits you.
You can ruin a perfectly good gun, not knowing what and how to remove a stuck ball in a barrel.
First! NEVER acid like materials in a barrel!
Second! You must protect the barrel at all times. No sharp or hard items that may score the barrel.
A good quality ball puller attached to steel shaft ( not wood or aluminium ) Even brass is not too good as the threads may strip.
A lag bolt of appropriate size works well,( 3/8" lag bolt will handle most calibers .45 to .75)
but it should have a plastic sleeve to protect the barrel from contact, should be used.
I have cut the head from the bolt, drilled and tapped the bolt to accept a full length threaded steel rod. I have also silver soldered the threaded rod to the lag bolt so that it will not separate in the barrel.
If I could post a picture , I would ??!!
The threaded rod has a large flat washer with a nut screwed in place, then I have another nut threaded on just at then end and silver soldered in place so it will not turn.
Slide the whole assembly down the barrel, careful not to touch the rifling.
Rest the lag bolt on top of the ball, give the rod with the soldered nut a good hit with a hammer, then turn the shaft with a wrench into the ball. Soak the barrel with oil.
Now just tighten the nut that turns freely on the shaft. It will draw the ball out easily.
Remember! If the ball is .50 cal. you should turn the ball puller in at least 1/2"
It sounds much more complicated than it really is.
Fred
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Well, on my 2nd outing with MikeT's 1803 Harper's Ferry rifle I'm stuck with a dry ball.
I was using a .530 ball with .018 lubed pillow ticking when I ran a ball with no powder.
We tried shooting it out to no avail so we tried a ball puller.
I had to use a brass adapter to fit both the puller and the rod, but alas the adapter broke off when we tried pulling.
We even ran some gun oil down the barrel and let it sit for a few minutes before extraction.
Now, the ball covering up the touch hole so no hope of trying to shoot it out.
Before I take it to a gunsmith to remove the barrel and breech plug does anyone have any ideas?
One guy at the range wondered if some type of corrosive liquid could be used (like for instance battery acid) to dissolve the patch but doesn't hurt the barrel.
Right now I'm just disgusted with myself. :(
Mr Hammer response is a good one and should do the job ;)- if that does not work I would remove the breach plug and knock out the ball. If you try the other methods mentioned here be careful not to "ding" up the bore ;D.
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https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Search.aspx?search=ball%20pullers
I bought a set of these: 32 - 36, 40 - 45, 50 - 54, 58 - 62, and set them in a block of wood in a plastic bullet box. I attached the box to a spruce tree at the #1 station on our trail, along with a 48" stainless steel rod with a T handle. There is a second box beneath the ball puller box for a small set of pliers and all of the many balls that have been pulled, under circumstances exactly like yours, on our trail. These items are handier than a coat hook on the inside of a backhouse door.
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Does the gun have a removable touchhole liner? When the brass adapter broke, what did that leave sticking in the ball? Anything like threads that you could capture with another rod, or maybe if you were supremely lucky get a piece of very strong fishing line looped over?
I've heard of people removing a touchhole liner and replacing it with a grease fitting allowing them to push the ball out by pumping in grease behind it, or using compressed air from a tank if a BB gun CO2 cartridge wouldn't do the job. Or, maybe removing the touchhole liner would allow more powder to be put in behind the ball for another try shooting it out.
Whatever you try, I'd precede it with a 24 hour soaking with the slickest stuff I could find. Good luck with it. SCL
No touch hole liner. :(
Neither of us can feel anything sticking out above the ball. We tried a couple rods to capture any threads to no avail.
For what it's worth I have a bunch of gun oil soaking in.
Thank you for responding.
Wait a minute, you can't feel anything sticking out above the ball but you're still trying to capture any threads? Threads to what?
I just meant we were hoping there WAS something to capture.
Again I appreciate all feedback.
Battery acid is sulphuric,a BAD idea. Find someone who knows how to take a barrel out of the wood on a
muzzle loader and unscrew the breech plug and push the ball out.
Bob Roller
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Thanks everyone.
Got a buddy coming by tomorrow who's more 'mechanical' than I am to review all these comments and see if there's anything we can try.
If not, I'll take it to my local gunsmith.
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It is normally not that difficult to pull a breech plug if you have a good heavy vise.
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I broke a rod pulling a ball and soaked the barrel in hot water in the bathtub. I boiled water and poured it in heating the barrel and somehow the ball started to work itself free with me working it with a patch puller (worm). After that fiasco I went out and bought the best equipment I could find. Heavy duty brass 'range' rod, all different sizes of bullet pullers and the like. I hope you do the same.
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If not, I'll take it to my local gunsmith.
[/quote]
Most "gunsmiths" know diddly squat about muzzleloaders!
Muzzleloaders are as different to modern guns as checkers are to baseball.
Bring your gun to a "GOOD" black powder gun maker.
Fred
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Pull the breech plug.
If you were shooting before you dry balled you have fouling that needs to be cleaned out soon.
A competent person (one that knows muzzleloaders) can do it in less than forty five minutes clean and reassemble your rifle without changing the form or function assuming it has a real breech plug.
Calling it a disaster is wrong...a embarrassing frustration is more to the point ;)
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If not, I'll take it to my local gunsmith.
Most "gunsmiths" know diddly squat about muzzleloaders!
Muzzleloaders are as different to modern guns as checkers are to baseball.
Bring your gun to a "GOOD" black powder gun maker.
Fred
[/quote]
What Fred Said!
(WFS)
Be very very careful if you cannot find a good BP maker/shooter with more experience than yourself.
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Having reviewed most of the replies now, I have another suggestion that may work and I don't think it has been mentioned.
This depends a bit on the exact location of the ball, but one could drill the touch hole for a liner, install grease fitting (before or after threading, depends on what sizes you have available) to push grease, clean up/thread and finish liner installation.
Both bore lights and bore scopes are dirt cheap these days.
Don't "try" a gunsmith who doesn't understand how gentle he must be with our "soft" steels.
The bloke speaking of acid was standing on the wrong side of the ball. Base, not acid, is where one might find a non-corrosive substance to eat the patch. Specifically, I used to use a lye vat for soaking clean cast-iron skillets. Could leave iron in there indefinitely with no concern. Organic material would be lifted eventually.
Hmmm, we should try this AND I have all the proper ingredients: 12L14, lye, denim for testing. Will report if I actually do such.
Whatever you do, learn how to do it well because there will be another event quite similar. It's simply part of playing our game with the toys we choose.
Despite what you may have heard there are ONLY two kinds of BP shooters:
those who HAVE dry-balled and
those who are GOING to dry ball.
Congratulations on moving from the second category to the first. ;D
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In your case, I would have the barrel un-breached to remove the ball and not take a chance on ruining the barrel.
For future reference, I made my own tool to do this sort of thing and, what I consider the best part, is the inclusion of a ball drill that is applied before the ball screw is used. Without drilling out some of the lead, getting a solid purchase on the ball wedges the ball even tighter into the bore as the lead is expanded by the screw. I am not trying to sell anything here, but this is the tool and the explanation. If you have the equipment, you can make your own similar devices.
http://www.luckybag.us/GunnersMate.html
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OK, my friend posed an option.
What if we heated up a steel rod and worked it up and into the edge of the ball enough to where we could get a small amount of powder down there (light with a fuse) to hopefully get the ball to move forward just a bit so we could then get powder behind the ball to shoot it out?
Another question:
What about putting a small charge down the barrel on top of the ball (igniting with a fuse)? Does anybody think there could be enough back pressure to get behind the ball to move it forward just enough to then be able to get powder behind the ball through the flash hole?
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Maybe I'm just not visualizing what you're suggesting, but the hot steel/fuse ideas just don't seem like they'd do any good to me: most of the force generated would be in the direction of the breech, which is the opposite direction you want it to be in.
If it's a new gun, and the breech plug threads were lubed on installation, it may not be a major chore to unbreech it. If you are in contact with the maker, call him and see if you can send it (maybe just the barrel) back to him. He'll have the right sized and shaped wrenches, the right jaw pads to minimize scratches, etc. Or, he can tell you if there are any pitfalls for the unwary with respect to unbreeching it or any precautions beyond padding the vise and wrench jaws to prevent marring the barrel's browning.
I had pretty much the identical problem a year ago with a .40 cal. The ball and patch prevented any powder through the touchhole from getting behind the ball. Had to unbreech it. I didn't hardly have to grunt to get the plug to turn, and I know that plug hadn't been out of that barrel since the 1970s.
Someday, you'll look back on this episode and chuckle. But that may not be until next month. Hang in there, and good luck. SCL
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OK, my friend posed an option.
What if we heated up a steel rod and worked it up and into the edge of the ball enough to where we could get a small amount of powder down there (light with a fuse) to hopefully get the ball to move forward just a bit so we could then get powder behind the ball to shoot it out?
Another question:
What about putting a small charge down the barrel on top of the ball (igniting with a fuse)? Does anybody think there could be enough back pressure to get behind the ball to move it forward just enough to then be able to get powder behind the ball through the flash hole?
Here's another option.
Put the barrel in a vise and unscrew the breech plug.
Bob Roller
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:) I deserved that.
Soooo, we took the barrel off, put it in a vise and unscrewed the breech plug!
Lesson Learned!
Thanks to all for your wisdom and encouragement through my episode of embarrassment.
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At a shooting match I attended last month, the fellow 2 spots down from me dry balled two times within 5 minutes ;D Good thing I brought a good range rod and a ball screw that fit his gun ;D After the 2nd dry ball, he took a "rest" to get his nerves back in order ;D { Hint ] - A piece of rope to tie the rod to a sturdy fixture , keeps the muzzle of the gun pointed away from you when pulling a ball.
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This entire exchange of ideas only re-enforces my belief that a patched round ball combination should be snug, not tight, and the patch ball combination should allow for a patch that is thick enough to create a little cushion between ball, and barrel. Also, I think another factor is that the patch should be greased, rather than lubed with some modern goop, or spit on. Come on, think about it. If as common as it is for shooters to dry ball their guns, and as involved as it is to get the stuck ball out with modern equipment, would people of the muzzleloading era paint themselves into that corner? I don't think so.
Hungry Horse
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I'd buy a proper ball pulling screw.. the type that look like a sturdy wood screw. Apply downward pressure and screw it in. It will find its way into the ball, though you may need to push the rod down and have a friend turn the rod with pliers to get a good bite.
May take a couple attempts, but it should work.
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:) I deserved that.
Soooo, we took the barrel off, put it in a vise and unscrewed the breech plug!
Lesson Learned!
Thanks to all for your wisdom and encouragement through my episode of embarrassment.
Did your breech plug have a witness mark? If not, this would be the time to make one on the bottom the plug and barrel.
Glad you got it fixed.
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:) I deserved that.
Soooo, we took the barrel off, put it in a vise and unscrewed the breech plug!
Lesson Learned!
Thanks to all for your wisdom and encouragement through my episode of embarrassment.
Did your breech plug have a witness mark? If not, this would be the time to make one on the bottom the plug and barrel.
Glad you got it fixed.
Thanks.
Yes it did.
The plug actually came out quite easily.
Two lessons learned for newbie me:
1. Don't get distracted while in the loading process.
2. Never ever again try ball extraction using a brass adapter to connect the ball puller and rod (8/32 vs 10/32).
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There is a lot of strain on all parts when you are pulling a ball. Buy heavy duty stuff because it will happen again, but this time you'll be ready for it. ;)
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It is said that you are not an experienced black powder shooter until you have
1. Loaded a ball without powder.
2. Double loaded.
3. Fired your ramrod down range.
Congratulations; you are well on your way. Incidentally those functions are not just "one and done".
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This entire exchange of ideas only re-enforces my belief that a patched round ball combination should be snug, not tight, and the patch ball combination should allow for a patch that is thick enough to create a little cushion between ball, and barrel. Also, I think another factor is that the patch should be greased, rather than lubed with some modern goop, or spit on. Come on, think about it. If as common as it is for shooters to dry ball their guns, and as involved as it is to get the stuck ball out with modern equipment, would people of the muzzleloading era paint themselves into that corner? I don't think so.
Hungry Horse
Taylor and I have "dry balled" a number of times, as have just about every one of the lads in our club. We've never had a problem, in fact, pulling the patched ball out the barrel it an easy job, then continued loading and shooting. Guess our loads are not as tight as we thought.
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i have my range rod tapped 10/32 on both ends..(all my accessories are 10/32 as well)
in one end i screw in a T-handle...while hunting i can put a ball starter on that end and use it as my short starter...
to pull loads from the barrel i screw the ball puller in good and flip the gun muzzle down..a foot on each side of the T handle and life the gun skyward and they come right out....
ya...not really traditional....but, it works...
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This entire exchange of ideas only re-enforces my belief that a patched round ball combination should be snug, not tight, and the patch ball combination should allow for a patch that is thick enough to create a little cushion between ball, and barrel. Also, I think another factor is that the patch should be greased, rather than lubed with some modern goop, or spit on. Come on, think about it. If as common as it is for shooters to dry ball their guns, and as involved as it is to get the stuck ball out with modern equipment, would people of the muzzleloading era paint themselves into that corner? I don't think so.
Hungry Horse
I think there could be something to what HH is saying. The Baker Rifle as I understand it had two loads, one with a loose ball for quick reloading and firing, and one with a tight fitting ball for better accuracy. Does anyone know if the US made 1792 Contract Rifle and 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifle used both a loose fitting patched ball load and a tight fitting patch & ball load?
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I think I agree also. I shoot a 490 ball and a .010 patch and I get better than acceptable accuracy ( to me).
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Even when shooting a .540 ball in my target rifle, once the short starter gets it going, the patched ball goes down easily. When I've had to pull them, they've come out just as easily.
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At my club we have a ball puller hung up in the shed with various fittings for different calibers, sadly I have used it once already, till I read about dry balling here I have never had it happen !! It happened with my .451 Volunteer of course as it is more involved to load and I have the concentration of a slightly retarded fig pit !! ;D
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" concentration of a slightly retarded fig pit !! ;D "
LOL!!! :D
We use to have a guy dry ball at least every other shoot we held simply because he'd rather visit when loading. Finally had enough helping him pull loads and told him he could use my ball puller for $50.00 or go to a gun smith, or go buy what he needs to pull a ball,,, or just shut the $#*! up when he's loading and get it done right!
I caved and pulled his dry ball load, and this seemed to cure him for awhile...
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Thanks to all for contributing their wisdom and experience in this thread.
As the (enthusiastic) newbie here I'm so happy I found this forum.
There isn't much interest (relatively speaking) in flintlocks up here in Western WA.
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It is said that you are not an experienced black powder shooter until you have
1. Loaded a ball without powder.
2. Double loaded.
3. Fired your ramrod down range.
Congratulations; you are well on your way. Incidentally those functions are not just "one and done".
Lol 😊
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Still haven't fired the rod downrange. Hmmm - don't want to, either - I use a steel range rod much of the time. :P Betcha that .69 would kick some, firing off it's
3/8" x 40" steel cleaning rod. ;D
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The only time I double loaded was years ago when shooting in the re entry smoothbore matches at the Provincial matches in Chatham, Ont. I was shooting my then new 10 bore, 100 gr FFg and a patched .735 ball It was the first match of the day, and someone interrupted my loading to say hi....and I ended up double powdering . Sure got my attention. My partner said...." you're a tad high " :)
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I double powdered my .69 one day while chronographing loads - 480gr. ball and 330gr. of powder. I was distracted by the fellow shooting with me wo was having trouble with his production rifle. I double powdered - that shot lifted up into the standing position off the 'round' I was sitting on and registered only 70fps higher velocity than the top load of 200gr. GOEX 2F I had tested that 'range' day. This was in 1986 & 200gr. ran 1,700fps average. 165gr. 2F, my decided upon moose load, produced 1,550fps. & gave a point blank range of 125yards using a 3" standard, above or below and produced the rifle's best accuracy on paper at 100 meters. 200gr. shot the same, but kicked too much, I thought at the time.