AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: davec2 on December 04, 2016, 12:11:45 AM
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A while back, a fellow asked me to modify a steel, 4 gage, Ed Rayl blunderbuss barrel with cannon muzzle rings and some engraving. This is an old post about the barrel work:
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=37545.0
At any rate, having watched the progress on the other blunderbuss I am finishing now, Andrei sent me all of the parts he had collected, and a great piece of walnut for the stock, and asked me to assemble yet another one of these shoulder fired artillery pieces. I don't mean to bore you guys with "more of the same", but each of these builds is a little different and the eventual owners can keep track of my progress (and other's comments) by watching here.
Well, here is what I am starting with.....the barrel as previously described, a Chambers English lock, an outstanding piece of walnut, and miscellaneous cast butt plate, trigger guard, ram rod pipes, trigger assembly, etc. Andrei wants this one carved and engraved, so it will be more on the fancy side of things rather than just a "working" style coach gun.
(https://preview.ibb.co/c5fPwv/Andrei_BBB_7.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hUkrbv)
(https://preview.ibb.co/eYpHGv/Andrei_BBB_8.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hj0eUF)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gNc4wv/Andrei_BBB_9.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hGdoOa)
(https://preview.ibb.co/g01m9F/Andrei_BBB_11.jpg) (http://ibb.co/bEW8Oa)
I got as far as bandsawing the stock shape out and pulling the breech plug on the barrel in preparation for sending both up to Dave Rase to have him inlet the barrel for me. (He doesn't like doing these blunderbuss barrels but has been kind enough to do them for me anyway.) While waiting for the inletting to be completed, I will start on polishing all of the metal parts......one of my least favorite parts of any build. But, as my Mother used to say, "worst things first !" .....It always makes the rest of the job go easier.
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I enjoy seeing threads like this when they go start to finish.
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STRIKING job on that barrel, Dave. Absolutely something to be proud of.
What a fun gun to shoot, too.
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Always wanted a Blunderbus but really don't have a need for one of them rascals, so it'll go on my wish list of future projects. Outstanding job on the Barrel Dave! Beautiful work!
Capt. David
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You should change your user name to "Blunderbuses-R-Us!"
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Finally had a little time to get back to this project.......Dave Rase inletted the barrel for me a little while back.
(https://preview.ibb.co/myLhGk/Andrei_BBB_12.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hNHjU5)
I shaped and bent the breech plug tang to contour and got that inlet into the stock:
(https://preview.ibb.co/bRor95/Andrei_BBB_13.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hqsJp5)
Soldered on the barrel lugs....the front one is heavier as it will also support the front sling swivel.......
(https://preview.ibb.co/dkM02Q/Andrei_BBB_20.jpg) (http://ibb.co/eReW95)
(https://preview.ibb.co/ivX7hQ/Andrei_BBB_21.jpg) (http://ibb.co/mcZL2Q)
(https://preview.ibb.co/gHrpwk/Andrei_BBB_22.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hZ0ShQ)
Polished the lock parts in preparation for engraving:
(https://preview.ibb.co/g6tPU5/Andrei_BBB_14.jpg) (http://ibb.co/idUyp5)
Of all the parts of building any gun, the two things I find the most tedious are installing the butt plate and installing the rear ram rod pipe. So I started with the bigger of the two tedious tasks......rough shaping of the butt end of the stock:
(https://preview.ibb.co/jatDNQ/Andrei_BBB_15.jpg) (http://ibb.co/b0dPU5)
Beginning the inlet......
(https://preview.ibb.co/fuCUwk/Andrei_BBB_17.jpg) (http://ibb.co/jtPL2Q)
(https://preview.ibb.co/cArNGk/Andrei_BBB_16.jpg) (http://ibb.co/k8F4U5)
Finished......
(https://preview.ibb.co/nMH195/Andrei_BBB_18.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kJqchQ)
(https://preview.ibb.co/mRjg95/Andrei_BBB_19.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hKpsGk)
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Nice work, Dave. One day, you'll have to explain your lock polishing method.
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Beautiful work - I'd like to play with one of those, some day. Be a blast using silhouette targets at various ranges.
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It's been a long time since I had a free moment to work on this commission. However, today I had enough time to inlet the lock plate. Hopefully, before the next aerospace contract starts in earnest, I will have time to get a few more things done on this 4 gage.
(https://preview.ibb.co/j422eQ/IMG_3977.jpg) (http://ibb.co/efyazQ)
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Beautiful!
A blunderbuss is a bucket list project for me. Did you keep track of a shopping list for the various bought parts? How about a plans drawing?
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Scota,
Here is a link to a finished blunderbuss I made for another guy:
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=38909.75
I have built four of these now and I can give you a list of various parts I have used. No plans but plenty of pictures on the rest of the above link and on a few others I can give you.
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Dave, your metal to wood fit is phenomenal!!! Makes me sick to look at anything that precise. Thanks for posting the pics and looking forward to your progress.
Dan
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That is some fine work.
Just wondering how ya get that tenon dead center on the round barrel?
I have a fully round barrel that I am having a rough time getting a front sight perfectly centered?
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Bigmon,
On this barrel, finding center on the round portion is easy because the breech end is octagonal. I put the corresponding (bottom) barrel flat on a very flat surface (like a marble counter top, surface plate, or table saw) and then very lightly drag a file under the round part where I want the sight or tenon. This will leave a light, straight line on the barrel centered with the barrel flat. For a completely round barrel, you will need some reference point. I would make sure the breech plug is installed in its final position. With the breech plug installed, you can use its top flat surface to do the same thing I described with the octagon flat. You might have to use something with truly parallel surfaces to rest the flat of the breech plug on, but just make sure that surface on the breech plug is flat with the table surface. Then the file mark at the far end will also be right on center and referenced to the flat of the breech plug.
Hope this helps.
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Scota,
Here is a link to a finished blunderbuss I made for another guy:
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=38909.75
I have built four of these now and I can give you a list of various parts I have used. No plans but plenty of pictures on the rest of the above link and on a few others I can give you.
Sounds great. PM me, if you like, when you can, with the list.
I imagine most of it would be Bess parts, and Bess details. I recently saw an original British Navy one in an antique shop. It was rough but all there and would have been a good subject to copy.
Thanks,
Scot
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Scota,
This BB and the finished one are using parts that are not from a Bess. The first BB I made used a fair number of Bess parts.....lock, trigger guard, butt plate....here are a few photos of that BB. I will make up a list of parts that I have used including some options.....
(https://preview.ibb.co/nArSyk/Blunderbuss_and_Horn_7.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kUYwr5)
(https://preview.ibb.co/jzMudk/Blunderbuss_breech.jpg) (http://ibb.co/bP65jQ)
(https://preview.ibb.co/iFbhW5/Blunderbuss_Butt_Plate_2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/e0ywr5)
(https://preview.ibb.co/dGz2W5/Blunderbuss_Left_Side.jpg) (http://ibb.co/fpabr5)
(https://preview.ibb.co/b6ay4Q/Blunderbuss_Muzzle_and_Ball.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iY7pB5)
(https://preview.ibb.co/fagGr5/Blunderbuss_Top_of_Butt.jpg) (http://ibb.co/hmsd4Q)
(https://preview.ibb.co/kj65jQ/Blunderbuss_Underside.jpg) (http://ibb.co/i4nZdk)
(https://preview.ibb.co/muP84Q/Blunderbuss_wrist_low_res.jpg) (http://ibb.co/b0GzB5)
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Thanks DAveC2,
I'll try that, just not real sure how true the top of the tang is with the rest of the gun.
This had been my first build back into the hobby in maybe 30 years.
So there are a few issues with the gun.
It's all nice enough and hard for a novice to see, but even though I have trouble getting back in form, I still know what is a problem.
But I am gonna try that.
Might even have to re-do the top of the gun in that area to true it up?
But I think I can.
Thanks so much
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I have a GAU8 30mm barrel coming. It is about 3' of the muzzle end. I guess I am obligated make a rifled blunderbuss now!
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Scota,
Wow....a 30 mm rifled blunderbuss would go great with the 20mm rifled Dragoons Rolf built !
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=43830.msg453336#msg453336
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Thanks DAveC2,
I'll try that, just not real sure how true the top of the tang is with the rest of the gun.
This had been my first build back into the hobby in maybe 30 years.
So there are a few issues with the gun.
It's all nice enough and hard for a novice to see, but even though I have trouble getting back in form, I still know what is a problem.
But I am gonna try that.
Might even have to re-do the top of the gun in that area to true it up?
But I think I can.
Thanks so much
The tang should be level so a long range Whitworth type folding sight cane be mounted. ;D
Bob Roller
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It’s really a misnomer when you build one of these, Dave. No blunder in your bus!
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Beautiful work as always!!
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yes, Beautiful , clean work as always. Question; do people actually shoot them?
Tim
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Bob, Rich, and Melsdad.....thanks :)
Tim,
I don't know about others but I shoot mine whenever I get a chance. I shoot it with a "handful" of powder, a wad of paper towel, a "handful" of shot (any size will do), and another paper towel over-shot wad. I also shoot what I call an AP round (Armor Piercing...not really, but it does have a $#*! of a lot of mass in the projectile). It is a 1 inch diameter zinc round ball, patched, and with about 200 grains of Fg behind it. Packs a wallop....on both ends....and it also helps to bite down on a piece of leather belt to keep from jarring any teeth loose or leaving a lot of teeth and eyeballs behind because of the recoil. You can load a 4 gage up or down as you see fit. I enjoy shooting mine with 200 grain loads.
The gun is a "blast" to shoot, if you will pardon the pun.
(https://preview.ibb.co/mxWah6/Shooting_Blunderbuss2.jpg) (http://ibb.co/iWuHvR)
(https://preview.ibb.co/ciiXUm/Shooting_Blunderbuss1.jpg) (http://ibb.co/g54HvR)
Dave C
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I made a 1-inch smoothbore a while back. It weighs about 20#. I cast 0.990" lead balls for it. I found the granulation of the powder makes a big difference in recoil. 350 gr of 3F will really pound you. 350 grains of 1f is a manageable push. I am planning to get some cannon grade to try out. The slower acceleration makes a big difference.
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Great photos Dave!
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1 know there's something wrong with that gun. I just can't find it yet. That gun is the kind of stuff that gives me an inferiority complex.
Gotta be something wrong with it somewhere.
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Don't blame you for using a zinc ball, Dave- lead would deplete the supply too quickly not to mention, but I will, kick more.
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Daryl,
I also fire one inch ball bearings (really armor piercing). If you can find them you can shoot them over and over again !
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Daryl,
I also fire one-inch ball bearings (really armor piercing). If you can find them you can shoot them over and over again!
Add a few half-inch ball bearings and you'd have a heck of a "buck and ball" load!
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Tim,
I don't know about others but I shoot mine whenever I get a chance. I shoot it with a "handful" of powder, a wad of paper towel, a "handful" of shot (any size will do), and another paper towel over-shot wad. I also shoot what I call an AP round (Armor Piercing...not really, but it does have a $#*! of a lot of mass in the projectile). It is a 1 inch diameter zinc round ball, patched, and with about 200 grains of Fg behind it. Packs a wallop....on both ends....and it also helps to bite down on a piece of leather belt to keep from jarring any teeth loose or leaving a lot of teeth and eyeballs behind because of the recoil. You can load a 4 gage up or down as you see fit. I enjoy shooting mine with 200 grain loads.
The gun is a "blast" to shoot, if you will pardon the pun.
Dave C
I'll bet it is, if I had one I would have to shoot it. Would be fun to use it like a Mortar with a ball, set it up with a Tri-pod, fire a couple for range, then effect.
Tim
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Daryl,
I also fire one inch ball bearings (really armor piercing). If you can find them you can shoot them over and over again !
LMAO!
Tim
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Patches too!!!! :)
LOL- use em again!
Brought to mind that we (TAYLOR) had some 3" cast iron balls from a gold mill we used to shoot from his 3" cannon, at "The Big Chief"- might have been "The Little Chief" mountain face of almost straight-up granite face - about 300yards from the firing line - the Squamish R&G Club range. The balls were supersonic or close to it, invisible, but would make about a 12' diameter explosion of rock dust on impact. Seems to me, we only used about 1/4 pound of powder, too (1,750gr.). After 4 or 5 shots, we'd go out to the base of the rock face, find and pick up the balls, dig the rock chips out of them and shoot 'em again. Lots of fun. Can't afford that these days.
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The field gun of which Daryl speaks was lots of fun to shoot, but as he says, four shots to the pound. I traded it for a good violin. The balls for the gun came from a gold mine up near Black Tusk in southern British Columbia. At the time I was in the RCMP, and visited the mine by chance one day. I saw a pile of iron balls, asked what they were for, and was told that once the balls ground down to less than 3" they were discarded. They said take as many as you want. So I loaded up the trunk of old 749: think it was a 1975 Dodge, and brought them home. The steering was very light on the home-bound trip.
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Speaking of 1" bores: Daryl refers to this gun in another thread. Back in the late seventies, I was commissioned to make an underhammer gun out of the clients barrel. It was about 55" long, had a 1" smooth bore, was 3" AF octagonal, and it seems to me weighed 64 pounds. I draw-filed and browned it...never again. The butt plate was a schuetzen style brass casting that weighed 6 pounds all by itself. It had a large rifle primer ignition. We didn't have a mould so I ground a cutter out of a spade drill and bored cavities in a pair of maple blocks to cast the balls. Got one ball per cavity - once. We shot it only one occasion at the club by resting it on a blanket on a concrete bench. The load as Daryl says, was a patched lead ball and 300 gr. of Black Powder - don't recall the grain size. Our target was a manila folder opened up and set on the berm at 300 yards. I had installed a lollipop tang sight and an aperture front sight, so the potential for accuracy was there, and we were surprised at how well the gun shot. Recoil was uncontrollable. Sitting on a stump for a seat, upon firing, the gun would push you off the stump, but there was no pain...just a long gentle push.
Now, a 1" ball in an 8 pound BB in front of 200 gr. of powder...that's a different story. Fabulous work on the BB Dave. Love your signature engraving.
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Taylor and Daryl,
I started another thread on making a mold like you did with maple.....but I made mine out of graphite and you can cast all the round shot you want with it....
Dave C
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Well, without too much trouble, another year has gone by filled with the loss of my Dad and a lot of aerospace contract work. I had to stop for most of 2018 on this commission for Andrei. He and I spoke on the phone the other day and he has been really busy in medical school...and really understanding about the delays, but I promised I would get this project done for him in the next couple of months. So I will be picking up this thread again so he can keep up with the progress. I know this type of muzzle loader is not the primary topic of this site, but I hope following along on the details of the fabrication is of some interest to some here as well as being applicable to building long rifles.
I have been polishing up brass parts in preparation for engraving and will post some pictures in the next day or so.
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Hi Dave,
I am sorry to hear that your Dad died. It seems he was an important mentor for you and a lot of his talent lives on.
Dave
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Sincere condolences Dave
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Sorry to hear of your dad's death, I am sure it leaves a hole in your heart.
Dennis
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Dave - so sad to here you lost your Dad. Relish the memories as we all must, sooner or later.
Best wishes for you & those you hold dear.
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I'm sorry for your loss, Dave. My Dad has been gone for ten years and I still miss him.
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Dave, Sorry to hear about your Dad. Mine left here in '91 but there are many times I feel his presence in the shop, especially when something challenging goes well and turns out easier than I thought.
Look forward to the continuation of the build.
Tim
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Thanks for the kind notes. My Dad was born in Brooklyn in 1926, was almost 92, and he passed away in his own home with my Mom and all of his adult children and grandchildren there with him....an unusual event in the modern world. He was still working right up to the last two weeks of his life and he was funny and joking right up to the very end. In fact, my eldest daughter was sitting with him one evening in the living room and I mentioned that I had been up with him since 4:30 in the morning. I said to all gathered there that Dad was still getting up early in the morning just as he had for the past ninety years. And then my daughter started to laugh and said, "But we always know what you say about getting up early." He laughed and asked her to tell everyone what he always said......She quoted him, "All is right by God's world early in the morning..." Then there would be a long pause as he had a sip of his coffee and he would conclude by saying......."until all the idiots get up !"
Dad was a World War two Navy veteran. He was a radioman and gunner in PBYs and torpedo planes and stationed aboard the USS Lexington*. He and my Mom were married for 65 years. She is 93 and still living in their home...and she is doing surprising well although she misses him terribly. I told her not to worry very much. In a twinkling of God's eye, all of us....her, children, and grandchildren.... will be on his side of the Jordan and he will be waiting for us with those twinkling eyes, a big smile....and a wise crack or two.
* He was stationed aboard the second Lex....the first was sunk at the battle of the Coral Sea early in the war. It was his first and only ship but, as it turned out, it was also my first ship when I was assigned to it in 1973 as a Naval Academy midshipman. :)
I'll get some pictures of the progress on the blunderbuss out here in the next day or so, but, again, thank you all for your thoughtful comments.
Dave C
(https://i.ibb.co/nzcXqYZ/E-Crisalli-US-Navy-1944.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Tm8QD7p)
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Thanks for giving us a glimpse of your Dad and his life, clearly one of The Greatest Generation! Very sorry for your loss.
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My condolences, Dave. Wonderful tribute to a wonderful man.
Ed
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Sorry to hear of the loss of your father. I know you and your family will cherish these great memories all of your lives.
Bob
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My deepest condolences. Good to hear he was of Clear mind to the end.
Rolf
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Dave, the best we can do after losing our dad is to revel in the lessons he taught us, and carry on carrying on. I miss mine terribly, but am surrounded by pieces of his shop now in mine, and I think of him every day.
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Dave,
Sorry about your Dad, god bless.
Robby
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Sorry to hear of your father's passing Dave. I look forward to seeing the completed piece as I do always with your meticulous work.
You are right on the money with your comments on the family reunion!
Best
James
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That thing looks like darn hand held CANNON. Looks beautiful I love the barrel.
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I am sorry for your loss, Dave. I am praying for you and your family.
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I'm really sorry to hear about your dad Dave. I know he was a great man and a great father. I am most sorry for your mother. I know how she will miss him because of the way my mom was after dad died. God bless and comfort you and your family. Your Friend Jerry Huddleston. John 11:26
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Again.....thank you all for the kind replies and prayers. And Jerry....yes....John 11:26 :)
"Memento, Homo, quia pulvis es, et in pulverem reverteris"
Now to catch up a little on the blunderbuss........
I forgot to take a picture of the raw casting of the trigger guard before I started in on cleaning it up, but this is a similar guard that has the same starting condition as the one I am using. I did some clean up with files, but most of the guard was scraped with a utility knife blade and then finished to about 400 grit. It is ready to engrave now.
(https://i.ibb.co/G7hzbTJ/IMG-6961.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TcC9FLT)
I did take a before and after on the forward ram rod pipe. The two pipes were finished / cleaned up the same way as the trigger guard and are ready to engrave.
(https://i.ibb.co/6X6yHrF/IMG-6958.jpg) (https://ibb.co/J3XcvmH)
(https://i.ibb.co/bFNfKT8/IMG-6959.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PM1S6Kf)
Inletting of all the lock internals is complete.....
(https://i.ibb.co/YtdvMCn/IMG-6962.jpg) (https://ibb.co/khDYf7b)
The frizzen has been annealed in preparation for engraving and the rest of the lock finished to the surface I want as well. Engraving is next.
(https://i.ibb.co/JjBmqHL/IMG-6964.jpg) (https://ibb.co/23nWSd2)
Side plate ready for engraving except for drilling the lock bolt holes. I will do that first before I start in on the engraving.
(https://i.ibb.co/1K51szh/IMG-6966.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Y8MmD0Y)
And last, I thought I would take a "before" picture of the trigger.....more on that next time.
(https://i.ibb.co/WPvvyYd/IMG-6963.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TbMM8Fn)
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You are a wizard with scrapers and paper.
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😳 You are a wizard with scrapers & paper! I can’t wait to see the engraving!! Really nice, clean work, Dave.
Ed
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Ok....I restarted this thread with the very best of intentions to start right in with the work. No sooner had I gathered all my tools and parts and work interfered yet again. But right after the police chase / car wreck yesterday (another story), I did get started on the side plate. Here the side plate is superglued to a block for drilling and counter boring. (I had to stop long enough before hand to make the correct size pilot for the counter bore.)
(https://i.ibb.co/JjpPw5D/IMG-7066.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k2DFsQN)
(https://i.ibb.co/mRd9hHC/IMG-7067.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GdGWCVv)
With the side plate machining done, I located and drilled through the stock for the front lock bolt and then established the rear lock bolt location and drilled that. The web between the ram rod hole and bottom of the barrel channel is very thin, so I had to put a groove across the bottom barrel flat to let the front bolt pass. And, of course, I had to drill a clearance hole through the bolster on the breech plug.
With the bolt holes drilled through the stock and lock plate, I tapped the lock plate holes through the stock with a long "pulley" tap. Using some 8-32 temporary screws, the side plate was held down tight to the stock to start the inletting process. I cut around the profile with a pointed carving knife and then started to remove the background wood about 1/2 the thickness of the side plate.
(https://i.ibb.co/wCVWh7J/IMG-7087.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k0j82J3)
(https://i.ibb.co/2sZP5tj/IMG-7088.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mXNtSqH)
(https://i.ibb.co/w4MbMmN/IMG-7091.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KWFQFvj)
To do the final seating, I blackened the side plate with a kerosene lamp (much faster than a candle) and made the final adjustments on the fit.
(https://i.ibb.co/wrXbh77/IMG-7089.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qFf4YCC)
(https://i.ibb.co/pvCJjMv/IMG-7090.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MDqMktD)
The completed side plate installation.
(https://i.ibb.co/s3DK6MZ/IMG-7092.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QmqPC14)
So on to the trigger, trigger guard, and ram rod pipes. Once I have all the parts in place, I will start the engraving. More to follow (assuming I survive the next police chase / car wreck !!!)
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Your incredible skill is on display yet again Dave. Thank you for sharing it all with us to enjoy along the way to completion. You make it look so easy. :-)
Yes, in John 11:26 there is a whole like to hang on to in that short verse. Well noted.
Best wishes, and God Bless, Marc
PS, I hope the car accident wasn't yours.
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By the way, the Gunner's Mate you made me is still handy and a delight. :-) Two thumbs up.
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Had some time to start the engraving of parts. Started with the side plate. First photo is of the plate superglued to a block and painted with Dykem.
(https://i.ibb.co/ZJNXzG3/IMG-7095.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DbLWfzN)
Next one is some of my sketching with a stylus and just getting a feel for where I want things to go
(https://i.ibb.co/CV49tvk/IMG-7096.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MPK1hpY)
Third photo shows the first outlining cuts
(https://i.ibb.co/d7Ghkdn/IMG-7098.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pnJm4tC)
Fourth photo is the completed boarders and some shading
(https://i.ibb.co/VpBd8yc/IMG-7099.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2YKwB21)
This one is of the finished side plate
(https://i.ibb.co/qsgFQ6R/IMG-7100.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hWd1z0K)
And then I put the side plate in the stock inlet just to see how it is going to look
(https://i.ibb.co/wK5RJHS/IMG-7101.jpg) (https://ibb.co/khNx3n4)
Working on the trigger next.
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That is gorgeous work, Dave. I hope to do work that good some day. What are you using for tools for actual engraving?
Matt
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Superior work as always.
I use Dykem quite a bit but have NEVER considered it with engraving layout. I believe this might help my ever progressing bad eyesight both in the layout and execution. I need help in both areas ; ) ! I've got to try it! Thanks for showing that Dave!
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Very nicely done Sir.
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The picture thrid up from the bottom shows quite "striking" against the Dykem- almost said Prussian Blue, but this appears darker and not as thin.
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Thanks for the kind words:
M.E.....I use a 35 year old Gravermeister for most of what I do. Sometimes just a push graver and sometimes a longer graver and a hammer.
James....I use a lot of different methods of getting a design on the surface of the work piece, but I can clearly sketch a free hand design into the Dykem so lightly that I can polish any stray marks I might have changed my mind about with the white 3M Scotchbrite or even a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser after the engraving is done.
Daryl....yes, I like the blue / bright brass contrast as well...but I always take the blue off with lacquer thinner...just wouldn't look right on the gun ... :o
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This has been a great follow along, inspiring,educational, and entertaining. Thanks Dave for taking the time to document your build for the rest of us. :)
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Dave: as always, it is such fun to follow your build. Regarding the trigger, if I may; if it were mine, I would remove the trigger from the plate and pin it high - level with the sear screw, and not use the boss cast into the trigger plate. That will go a long way to making the trigger pull sweet. Use the trigger plate, but not the boss.
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I am blown away, by the polish on that lock. WOW!
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Taylor,
I was working on the trigger some before you posted your suggestion. I will rework it now based on your comments......but I had to stop for a bit to make myself a gold crown. Had a posterior tooth go bad and had a root canal. Had a dentist do the prep and give me the impressions. I went home, poured the models, articulated them, carved the crown in wax and then cast it in dental gold (18 K). A little polishing and I went back to the dentist the next day and he cemented it in for me.
My Dad taught me how to carve and cast a gold crown when I was 8.........i have fond memories of his hands working as I watched.....
(https://i.ibb.co/BqCZ7CZ/IMG-6250.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XSCsdCs)
(https://i.ibb.co/sydDrz9/IMG-6251.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4PnDx3R)
(https://i.ibb.co/YXnqfvN/IMG-6252.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5kpfsq1)
(https://i.ibb.co/344kRc3/IMG-6253.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7jjbkKf)
Now with that little chore out of the way.....back to the blunderbuss...
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I did have some time while making the crown to do a little more on the trigger and engraving on the lock for the blunderbuss:
(https://i.ibb.co/JQVC897/IMG-7104.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tXg3n9s)
(https://i.ibb.co/dMRz09P/IMG-7107.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3dnLyXp)
(https://i.ibb.co/D5b9Ssr/IMG-7108.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RzS3VZj)
(https://i.ibb.co/SNsG03x/IMG-7109.jpg) (https://ibb.co/b1WDLK3)
(https://i.ibb.co/nQ7NHJx/IMG-7102.jpg) (https://ibb.co/P1cv7Hq)
(https://i.ibb.co/KsZn5GN/IMG-7103.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7pchSzg)
But now, I need to do a little more "Taylor-ing" on the trigger...
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Dave, great post about the crown, and especially how it tied in with your Dad. I have a bunch of my Dads hand tools that I use daily, and can relate to the fond memories.
The engraving ain’t too shabby either!
Ed
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Dave, I didn't see any engraving on the gold crown.... :) - Wonderful work and it is a pleasure to follow along....
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This is going to be a high end Blunderbuss, Dave!
Very nice work, so neat and beautifully executed.
Altogether lovely.
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Had not had a lot of time but did manage to draw file and further finish the barrel steel in preparation for additional engraving. Not sure how Andrei wants the barrel finished (bright, browned, ???) Need to check in with him. Also managed to start the inletting of the two ram rod pipes. Will finish the lock engraving next, then the barrel and the rest of the brass parts.
(https://i.ibb.co/HFMm1N9/IMG-7175.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DV63sGj)
(https://i.ibb.co/C5QxPhT/IMG-7174.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MD7qBM3)
(https://i.ibb.co/ygrKKw3/IMG-7176.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tY9nn7d)
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A tad more progress:
Frizzen engraving:
(https://i.ibb.co/TTtWnzs/IMG-7190.jpg) (https://ibb.co/j5DJx7S)
(https://i.ibb.co/Rjpj75W/IMG-7191.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nPsPRWS)
I love building these things but......my least favorite part of every gun, rifle or pistol...or blunderbuss, is inletting the rear ram rod pipe. For those of you who really know what you are doing, please, someone make a video of how to do this task. I have to be doing this the hardest, slowest, least efficient way possible and I'm almost positive there are some tricks to this that I am missing. Here is the start for me....and I end up removing wood, apparently, one molecule at a time! I can polish and engrave a complete lock faster than I can inlet a rear pipe !!!
(https://i.ibb.co/vPtKcVS/IMG-7194.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DCqS1zZ)
An hour and a half later.....and still not done !!!
(https://i.ibb.co/k934Mms/IMG-7195.jpg) (https://ibb.co/z78XN6T)
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Wonderful work, Dave. Thanks for the picture journey through it.
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I wish I knew a trick for that too. Took me over 5 hours for the one I just did.
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Lock polishing & engraving is complete.......
(https://i.ibb.co/tXPMMtk/IMG-7205.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bJRggZq)
(https://i.ibb.co/WVkMXWL/IMG-7206.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Rj3sKpq)
(https://i.ibb.co/87SYJSv/IMG-7210.jpg) (https://ibb.co/NyHTXHD)
(https://i.ibb.co/R7QDWPK/IMG-7211.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HXGHQYy)
Back to the rear ram rod pipe..... :o
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Lookin’ good, Dave!
Ed
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Thanks Ed....By the way, after this one is done I would like to copy one of your rifles like I did one of Jim Chambers' (http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=37186.0) and one of Jim Kibler's (http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=32193.0). And thanks for the tip on the trigger guard and butt plate I asked about. Wayne Dunlap had them and I got one of each in brass and in steel.
Dave C
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That’s one special lock.
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You asked …….
{{>>I love building these things but......my least favorite part of every gun, rifle or pistol...or blunderbuss, is inletting the rear ram rod pipe. For those of you who really know what you are doing, please, someone make a video of how to do this task.<<}}
In his video a few messages back, Bill Raby shows how he is doing one on the "Building a Tennessee Rifle". The inletting of the rear ramrod pipe starts in Part 15 and finishes in Part 16. You might want to give it a look to see how he done it.
Such a wealth of information on this forum!!……. Big John
Just like an old Cobweb, just hanging around!
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Hey Dave. Is the back of the frizzen soft enough to engrave as is, or do you have to anneal it to engrave and then re-harden it after?
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Justin,
No, the back of the frizzen is just as hard as the face and cannot be engraved as is. I had to anneal it before engraving and will need to re-harden it now. I don't have a heat treating oven so, to anneal, I just toss the part into the hot coals in my fireplace during the evening and make sure it is covered by the coals. When the fire has died out in the morning, I fish the frizzen out of the ashes. It usually only takes one try at this to completely anneal the part. (I also do this with steel castings that are too hard or have hard spots in them). After re polishing a little, the frizzen can be engraved. To re-harden, I make a wire handle for the frizzen and then paint it with a water based anti-fire scale compound. I use an air / acetylene torch to heat the part to hardening temperatures and then quench in warm oil. The frizzen is then drawn back some (to about 375 degrees F) and cleaned up.
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Crazy nice work Dave!!
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Hey Dave, glad the guard and butt piece worked out! Have at it on the copy, let me know if I can help with anything.
Ed
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World Class!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Thanks for the info, Dave. What is that anti- scale stuff called?
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Justin,
The anti scale compound is ATP-641 Available from Brownells....
https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-tools-supplies/metal-prep-coloring/heat-treating-accessories/anti-scale-coating-prod23076.aspx
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Thanks Dave
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I'm not into blunderbuss but I really like the lock. Nice!
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Not sure how well it works on steel, but for gold and silver, some Boric acid mixed with alcohol is a jim-dandy anti-scale. We would usually put a drop of red food coloring in it, to ensure we covered the whole piece. Brush some on, light it to quickly get rid of the alcohol, and you are good to go.
Here at home, I have been putting some Borax (20 mule team, available at Lowe's in cleaning aisle) directly onto brass and coin silver, works a charm. Cleans off easily too - water, hot if you have it.
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Craig,
Yes, I use the boric acid and alcohol all the time for silver and gold work. However, it doesn't hold up as well when you are heat treating steel. The temperatures are about the same but the length of time at temperature seems to drive off most of the boric acid leaving the steel susceptible to oxidation.
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Thanks, Dave - hadn't thought about the duration of the heat. I do have some of Brownell's anti-scale on order.
Made a plane iron for an old wooden skew plane, used O-1 tool steel. When I went to heat it, I found that the only oil I had was some synthetic sperm whale oil - seems to have worked well. But the next plane iron I make is going to be from 1/16" steel, NOT 1/8" ! Man, that took forever to shape the blade on my diamond plates!
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Still working on the rear ram rod pipe :o But I did get in touch with the fellow I am building this one for and asked how he wanted the barrel finished and what he wanted engraved on the butt plate. He decided to keep the barrel bright (and there is a lot more engraving to be done at the breach end) and he liked the engraving I did on the butt of my own blunderbuss. Now....if I can just remember how I did this.......and improve on it.....
(https://i.ibb.co/hYWxhqF/Butt-Plate4lowestres.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jJM9Bpk)
(https://i.ibb.co/BPPcG21/Butt-Plate3lowestres.jpg) (https://ibb.co/266WS3b)
I did this several years ago now and I hand sketched the design, as I usually do. Might be tough to do it again without too many changes....
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Ooooooh. That is one fine looking buttplate and engraving. God Bless, Marc
PS, that is some pretty good photography too. :-)
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That is sweet....., can’t wait to see Mod 2!
Ed
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The best anti oxidant I have found is Black furnace flux. I use it when I braze barrel ribs on. It has aa long duration time. I think it is the same thing Brownell sells for anti oxidant.
I bought mine at a welding supply.
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Have not had much time to work on this but I did manage to get the trigger and trigger guard in.....and I did finish the rear ramrod pipe. I will shift back over to the final engraving work on the barrel, butt plate, trigger guard , and ram rod pipes before completing the stock shaping. Slow, but deliberate progress.....
(https://i.ibb.co/tK0bBdJ/IMG-7389.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jfCLhpr)
(https://i.ibb.co/gVr0Txr/IMG-7391.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4dFbTHF)
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Man, Dave - that is sure a LONG trigger guard! Great job on the inletting, BTW.
Will PM you on another project.
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Time, tide, and formation have slowed down progress again, but I have all of the parts in place now. The stock is still just a profiled block of walnut, but before I finished the engraving, I will knock off anything that doesn't look like a blunderbuss. This is one of the parts of a project like this that I like the most....releasing the fine lines and artful shape that have been silently trapped for many decades inside that piece of walnut. As it is today:
(https://i.ibb.co/k5v3SVt/IMG-7458.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KbSNrcJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/dDGd1Gb/IMG-7459.jpg) (https://ibb.co/L1nLbnQ)
(https://i.ibb.co/Gv9Ygjk/IMG-7460.jpg) (https://ibb.co/qMCqbw9)
(https://i.ibb.co/X4Y0fZw/IMG-7462.jpg) (https://ibb.co/thLjwMd)
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I had a little time (between midnight and zero three hundred hours) to have at the stock with a spoke shave and gouges. Not done yet but much closer to a finished shape that it was a few hours ago. All that stuff on the deck is the walnut that had trapped this blunderbuss inside the plank....and it is all the stuff that didn't look like a blunderbuss to me. And I will not be repeating the mistake I made on the very first of these that I built and that was succinctly pointed out to me by John Ennis. When I showed him the first 4 gage blunderbuss I built some 15 or so years ago now, I asked him for a candid critique. The very first thing he said was, "Well....it's OK but you left enough wood on the stock to build two of these."
I have been very careful to not leave too much wood on any build since John was kind enough to be honest with me..... ;)
(https://i.ibb.co/svnKnGZ/IMG-7472.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6RzHzxk)
(https://i.ibb.co/Cz2x5bH/IMG-7471.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wRsDNSz)
(https://i.ibb.co/VTrgJhJ/IMG-7473.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RcZ3YMY)
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Looking nice - coming a long.
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Now you're cooking! Bench and floor in chaos!
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I took off some additional wood ......and I cleaned up the bench and the floor. I like the chaos for a while....makes me feel like I'm making progress. But then it starts to drive me even a little nuttier than I already am...
(https://i.ibb.co/pyyVdmG/IMG-7479.jpg) (https://ibb.co/m88Z4x1)
(https://i.ibb.co/0fRKjGm/IMG-7480.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vJ6hxjV)
(https://i.ibb.co/JpnQ4vd/IMG-7481.jpg) (https://ibb.co/t2BXtqh)
(https://i.ibb.co/bP5brWV/IMG-7482.jpg) (https://ibb.co/G0QHVxD)
(https://i.ibb.co/gdGN10Q/IMG-7478.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xYyWvnw)
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What a beast!
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OK.....with all the recent talk about a blunderbuss, I really need to get this one finished for Andrei. I have a break between rocket test contracts at the moment so I will be finishing this project to clear the decks for a few others that have accumulated over the past year. There is a fair amount of wood still to come off the stock. I will start there and then proceed into engraving all the remaining metal that needs engraving. No bayonets on this one though ... :)
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Wow Dave, you and Runner could sweep alot of streets with those beasts! I love e,m. :)
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Lovely, Dave - pure art!
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I started in this afternoon refining the stock.....I thought it was nearly done with shaping it when I left off back in March. But in looking over the contours, I remembered a piece of advice I saw here on ALR one time. Someone was asking how much wood do you remove when shaping the stock. The best answer was, "take off everything you think you need to....then take off more until you start getting nervous that you have removed too much......and then take off even more."
So, looking at the floor in these photos, I apparently found more wood to take off........
(https://i.ibb.co/dc25rR2/IMG-8294.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wLWzRfW)
(https://i.ibb.co/SBwXZ2C/IMG-8293.jpg) (https://ibb.co/L1dzsM7)
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Hi davec2! You build beautiful delux guns for the officer, I build simple working guns for the soldier ;)
Runar
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Runar,
There is nothing simple about your guns ! Your posts and your work are always fascinating because of the skill and ingenuity you show in making components out of whatever material comes to hand. As much as the pictures of the guns you make, I enjoy seeing the tools and set-ups and raw materials you start with. I am an assembler of parts. You, Sir, are a gunsmith !
All the best.
David
P.S. Oh, and by the way, your English is far, far superior to my (non existent) Norwegian ! (Alle de beste ønsker)
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Thank you David, I am humble!
Runar
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Been scraping and smoothing out stock contours. Not much to take a picture of, but time consuming. However, I did cast the sterling silver thumb piece (along with a couple of others) and am getting ready to inlet it. Slight problem do to lack of planning on my part.....I usually retain the thumb piece with a screw from the underside of the stock hidden under the trigger guard inlet. Was planning the same thing this time around, but the through hole for the screw will be right where one of the trigger guard pin lugs is. I will have to drill deeper for the head and use a shorter screw so that the trigger guard lug has room under it. Should have thought a little further ahead... :o
(https://i.ibb.co/mFpDp2G/IMG-7908.jpg) (https://ibb.co/M5d2dts)
(https://i.ibb.co/CmpNT9x/IMG-8312.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sbpkM1L)
(https://i.ibb.co/VNzQDKh/IMG-8298.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CtYMvrX)
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Hi Dave,
Are those as cast? Great work all around as always.
Tim
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Tim,
Yes, those are as they come out of the casting investment. They have been pickled in HCL and then scrubbed with a fine wire brush to get all the investment off. I will polish them up from here.
Dave C
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Dave,
are you centrifugal casting them? or just doing a pour into a burned out investment 'tree' ??
Thanks
Respect Always
Jonathan
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Metalshaper,
Centifugal cast. Very precise. This is from an old post of mine......
I have been making a bunch of sterling silver castings lately (the sterling silver flint charms). I just ran a dozzen centrifugal investment castings like this one that include some 19 or 20 small items per cast. Thought I would post a picture before I cut them all off the sprue and finished them. The ring gate the charms are sprued to is about 3 inches in diameter. Thought you might be interested in seeing this.
(https://preview.ibb.co/dp5ncH/Flint_Cock_Casting.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kPLaWc)
Dave C
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Dave,
Thanks for the picture and explanation. Your castings look great!
Respect Always
Jonathan
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Tim,
Yes, those are as they come out of the casting investment. They have been pickled in HCL and then scrubbed with a fine wire brush to get all the investment off. I will polish them up from here.
Dave C
Thanks Dave.
Tim
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Do you sell your castings, Dave?
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Justin,
I do a lot of castings in both silver and gold including a lot of muzzle loading jewelry. And yes, I do sell some specific castings.
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Well.....no matter what, the one thing I can count on with this project is interruptions ! At any rate, I finally got the stock whiskered and the sterling thumb piece inlayed last night. Because of the size of the piece and the curvature of the stock, this one is a little tricky to inlet without gaps . Here are a few pictures.
Initial layout for location and drilled hole for threaded bolster:
(https://i.ibb.co/XxjFbKz/IMG-8322.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MkZPstR)
Placement on surface:
(https://i.ibb.co/tXV4spC/IMG-8323.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KwTXqxy)
Taping the bolster for the attachment screw:
(https://i.ibb.co/mDXfWkd/IMG-8324.jpg) (https://ibb.co/2nsG4xR)
Outline cutting:
(https://i.ibb.co/GRvR1KY/IMG-8326.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QMFMq2S)
Inletting:
(https://i.ibb.co/7Spv7DY/IMG-8329.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QJH9sVb)
(https://i.ibb.co/5YfTJgM/IMG-8327.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PTfxVvm)
Finished:
(https://i.ibb.co/Zmjzz7v/IMG-8332.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k1722vz)
Now for the stock carving.....
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As usual, Dave, very nice work - from carving the thumbpiece, casting, inlaying - all superb! It is good to see that sniffing rocket exhaust has not affected your precision any.
I didn't realize, until seeing the thumbpiece photos, just how narrow the comb is at the front. Pretty neat.
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Very nice Dave! I like the design. Craig, Dave's stock has a bit of military flare to it. Hence, the end of the comb is blunt. The photo below shows how thin the nose typically is on sporting guns from the same period.
(https://i.imgur.com/QoShVUm.jpg)
dave
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I don't care much for blunderbuss guns but I do enjoy seeing your work. I really like the engraving you have done on this one. What kind of pistols are laying on the bench?
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1st Pic 9 Aug post, looks like it was tapped it in place to get the rough outline?
Thanks, Tim
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Dave Smart Dog - thanks for the response. Not quite sharp enough to shave with, but I imagine it might be a bit fragile.
Overall, both Dave C2 and Runar make some very fine firearms. And I agree with Dave C2 that there is nothing at all plain about Runar's work - both are Master Craftsmen! You give this old guy something to aspire to, for sure. Thanks!
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B. Barker,
The pistols on the bench are a project I started in 1972-73 when I was a plebe at the US Naval Academy. The stocks are Brazilian rosewood. I cut up a Green Mountain rifle barrel and machined the two pistol barrels octagonal to round with a tapered and flared profile. I had to stop working on them when I went to sea on my first destroyer. Over the years, I didn't want to finish them because I realized how much I didn't know. A while ago I had Bobby Hoyt rebore the original .50 cal barrels to .54 and re-rifle them to a more appropriate twist for a pistol. Now, all these years later, I am confidant enough to finish them. They will be silver mounted.
Tim,
Yes, I tapped the silver into place on the stock before I started the inletting, but it was not to mark the inlet. It was to re-contour the silver to exactly fit the curvature of the stock,
Craig,
Thanks for the compliment. Runar just blows me away with his creativity and ability to take scrap materials and make beautiful parts out of them !
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Your inletting is phenomenal!
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Started with the fore stock and lock panel moldings. Went fairly quickly so I moved on to the breach tang carving.....
Rough carving of lock panels and fore stock molding:
(https://i.ibb.co/7KhbWx5/IMG-8333.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QM0XN7R)
(https://i.ibb.co/vd0H9ct/IMG-8334.jpg) (https://ibb.co/rpDm9QW)
Layout for the breach carving:
(https://i.ibb.co/3s6thWH/IMG-8335.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mBZQzt7)
Roughed out carving:
(https://i.ibb.co/DLhNyLg/IMG-8336.jpg) (https://ibb.co/stnhGtJ)
Some smoothing of the background and start of sculpturing:
(https://i.ibb.co/LJ9vqNy/IMG-8338.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mXhSYNK)
(https://i.ibb.co/VD22TtV/IMG-8337.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5vBBL6T)
None of this is finished yet, but that is all the carving that I'm going to do on this one. I will get the backgrounds all smoothed up and then switch over to the last of the engraving.
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After polishing and engraving, the lock is now case hardened. I don't know if the fellow I am building this for wants the colors left or polished off. I have done it both ways but I will let him decide. The colors do hide the engraving.
(https://i.ibb.co/P4qzS1P/IMG-8349.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5vbx7sS)
(https://i.ibb.co/bKqQxVc/IMG-8350.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MCWZbHF)
(https://i.ibb.co/ynRNFtp/IMG-8351.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QFcJvLk)
(https://i.ibb.co/Qrr6bYM/IMG-8352.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MMMR2P7)
Here is one I did where the colors were left:
(https://i.ibb.co/5WgTftL/Small-Rifle-Finished-4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/WW4nYqf)
And one with the colors polished back off:
(https://i.ibb.co/yWxW9T9/Maple-50-cal-21.jpg) (https://ibb.co/J5S51L1)
The stock scraping, whiskering, etc., is done....but I have learned to pretend that it isn't and start all over again. By doing that I will lessen the chances that I will find areas that I missed as I am applying the final finish :o
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Mighty fine. You sure this customer deserves such fineness?
Just kidding. It’s just natural for you to do very fine work.
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Rich,
The customer is a medical student down in Texas. I want to do a good job for him.....at my age, I need all the friends in the medical profession I can get ;)
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Absolutely superb workmanship!
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Hi Dave,
The color will last quite a while especially if you lacquer it. From a historical perspective, the colors would be polished off. Some British authors from the period credit William Bailes with popularizing case hardening colors as a decorative finish during the mid 1760s. It did not appear to become widely used as a decorative finish until the late 1770s or later but it is hard to say because it faded or was polished off over time . The round-faced lock and decoration on your gun suggest a first-quality gun from the 1750s before case colors were popular. I temper my cased parts unless they were made from mild steel. I usually temper the plates and flint cock to 490 which deepens the amber colors to a rick yellow bronze. A lower temperature around 460 will give a lighter yellow tinge. I temper the frizzens at 375-390 and then heat just the toe to blue with a mini-torch later. I believe that as rust bluing and browning, and color casing became popular, British gunmakers preferred their engravers to cut deep bold designs often with relief because it showed up against the colors. The finer, shallower, line engraving on older guns was obscured. It is going to be a beauty Dave as always.
dave
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Absolutely beautiful, Dave.
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I have developed a new technique as a result of posting things on ALR. Because of the technological advancement of digital photography, things that look fine in real life start to show all sorts of flaws on the computer screen at 5 times actual size. In the past I have finished projects and then posted them here only to see all sorts of things I should have corrected before the end game. So my new modus operandi is to do a fit check with all the metal and wood before I start the wood finishing process and it becomes really difficult to go back and fix something. Although I have not finished all of the engraving, all the metal is in place and all the wood has been shaped and smoothed. I took these pictures and found a bunch of stuff that needs to be re-worked. I think I should make a contest out of this.....sort of like the Burger King "Where's Waldo" advertising campaign. You guys look for flaws and let me know what you think and I will compare it to the list I made up for myself.....We can do a Round 2 when I finish the engraving......
(https://i.ibb.co/k0DTs7w/IMG-8355.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Cv9y3cY)
(https://i.ibb.co/tDMxFNS/IMG-8356.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9W9VSfJ)
(https://i.ibb.co/jJHd8MC/IMG-8357.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hYCkgWG)
(https://i.ibb.co/mGDqKh0/IMG-8358.jpg) (https://ibb.co/37rNbSv)
(https://i.ibb.co/Pcszn3H/IMG-8359.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Mcy54W0)
(https://i.ibb.co/n679wGj/IMG-8360.jpg) (https://ibb.co/S5tb6jB)
(https://i.ibb.co/n8hmWW4/IMG-8361.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BK8311v)
(https://i.ibb.co/jbnFWZM/IMG-8362.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4KhxYgT)
(https://i.ibb.co/ngmbfMJ/IMG-8364.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Gxp0kQS)
(https://i.ibb.co/fn2h4SK/IMG-8365.jpg) (https://ibb.co/BrtXqP7)
(https://i.ibb.co/44PmmQG/IMG-8366.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Dw5VVqy)
(https://i.ibb.co/XsspFh7/IMG-8367.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Phh417c)
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I vote for leaving the case hardening colors, do not lacquer it, and letting them fade gracefully with time.
Fascinating work as always sir.
God Bless, Marc
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So beautifully done and presented.
Only thing I could see (through the almost tears - it's just lovely) was the thin gap at the tang/breech, left side.
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It boggles my mind to try to understand how you get the shell carving behind the tang so crisp and perfect!!
Glaring mistakes!!...I would have left 1/32" more wood on the lock panels. To my eye, the lock doesn't appear to be fully inlet. Glaring mistake - hardly!
But I would inlet the side plate just a bit further...it appears to me to be just a little proud. Glaring mistake - no!
I suspect there isn't a blunderbuss extant that is finished as well as this one, so lighten up Dave.
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Marc......I would have left the colors myself but the fellow I'm building this for voted for the colors to be removed....although he had to struggle some with the decision.
Daryl.....I think what looks like a gap is a discolored edge on the inlet wood. I went to check and some of the soot from inletting is still on the edge, I guess from handling.
Taylor.....I was in the midst of setting the side plate a little deeper in its inlet and shortening the lock bolts when I saw your post. And I feel the same way about taking 0.030" too much off the lock panels. I may decide to leave it but right now I am setting up a diamond plate to hone off some of the lock bolster which would allow me to seat the lock a tad deeper.
Thanks.....this is exactly the type of help I appreciate to sharpen my eye to catch flaws early enough to either avoid them or to correct them early.
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Daryl.....I think what looks like a gap is a discolored edge on the inlet wood. I went to check and some of the soot from inletting is still on the edge, I guess from handling.
LOL - I made a mistake once too, but found out I was wrong - I hadn't made a mistake. ::)
Well done.
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Ok....per the customer's request, I polished off the colors. Didn't want to over do it and make the lock look like a chrome trailer hitch, so I didn't take ALL the color away. I think it will look good on the finished gun....
(https://i.ibb.co/qFX8S49/IMG-8379.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DgsFJ6k)
(https://i.ibb.co/C6z3Ky3/IMG-8380.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YX3FBSF)
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Really made the engraving stand out when you polished off the color.
Overall grade: A+
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Polishing was definitely the way to go! No question. Incredible work.
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Wood work is mostly done. All the major components are complete and set in place. Only the final wood finishing and final part engraving remain. Started on the small bit of decoration on the ram rod pipes the customer wanted..... and then started on the trigger guard.
(https://i.ibb.co/JFfCQMP/IMG-8383.jpg) (https://ibb.co/S7hJr9p)
(https://i.ibb.co/mBCFKSv/IMG-8384.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dc0Jv7b)
(https://i.ibb.co/GJGF8Rx/IMG-8385.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9vBG1W8)
(https://i.ibb.co/z59tRBC/IMG-8387.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mBZPq2d)
(https://i.ibb.co/zZsYqvp/IMG-8392.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5LTybHm)
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Shaking my head, spectacular, as usual. I especially like the rope effect on the center ring of the pipes. Crazy nice....
Ed
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Jez Dave, Does it get any better than this? Knowing your work over the years I would say "Stand back". Each piece is a learning experience but for you it is more of a challenge to yourself.
Tim
(https://i.ibb.co/KmJtTTK/bravo-zulu-1.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
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Tim,
Thanks for the "Bravo Zulu".....I like the nautical flair... ;)
Ed,
I didn't know what you meant by the "rope effect"....then I looked at the picture. Talk about photos being deceptive at times.....the "rope effect" is some sort of weird lighting phenomenon over my engraving bench :o Here is another picture of the ram rod pipes as they really are:
(https://i.ibb.co/G98H9ff/IMG-8399.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sCNWCpp)
But I LIKE the rope effect......now I just have to figure out how to do with a graver rather than trick photography !
P.S. I sent you an email to the "wipingstick" address I had. Did you get it ?
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That's funny..., still look awesome!!
Ed
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One of the more tedious jobs.....I had to finish polishing the butt plate before the engraving goes on. I take the polish to this level and then knock it back some after the engraving is in place. And what looks like a black gap there at the edge of the plate return is just polishing compound I didn't wipe off before I put the plate back on the stock to make sure the fit was still good.
(https://i.ibb.co/8zWNhsb/IMG-8402.jpg) (https://ibb.co/28DWbhS)
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Breech plug engraving in work and then completed....
(https://i.ibb.co/HNMFBxD/IMG-8405.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Q8qbpCF)
(https://i.ibb.co/DwBGMkY/IMG-8407.jpg) (https://ibb.co/P12TW4M)
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Beautiful work as always, Dave! Thanks for posting!
Ed
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Perfection! Thanks for posting the photos.
dave
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Spectacular. Loving following the progress.
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Hi Dave,
I am very curious about using Dykem layout blue. I really like the stuff but have not used it to lay out engraving. Do you scribe your designs in freehand? Do you find that better than using some sort of transfer lacquer and designs printed on transparency or paper?
dave
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Hi Dave,
I am very curious about using Dykem layout blue. I really like the stuff but have not used it to lay out engraving. Do you scribe your designs in freehand? Do you find that better than using some sort of transfer lacquer and designs printed on transparency or paper?
dave
I was just about to send a personal message to Dave about this very thing!! My problem would be the repetitive drawing it takes me to get my curves correct. Scribing the straight lines no problem but tendrils and leaves and vines oh my!. Is there a secret to transferring on Dykem you can share?
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David, James,
I started using the Dykem a while ago. I don't transfer anything to it, I just sketch the design on the Dykem surface very, very lightly with a sharp scribe. Boarder lines I mark out with a very small set of dividers. I do the spacing on the nick and dot cuts "by eyeball" (close enough). Straight lines I scribe with a thick piece of mylar that I scribe some 90 degree lines across to use a reference when I need it. I also cut the end of the mylar strip at a true 45 degrees so I can lay out things like a compass rose, etc. The cross hatched areas I do a couple of different ways. The one on the breach plug here was done by sketching the very slight curve that forms one side of the triangular area. I cut that and then hand sketch a matching curve on the other side. The cross hatched area is laid out one line at a time by using the small divider again. One point rides in the existing cut and marks out the next line inboard. I cut that line and then repeat the process until all the lines in one direction are cut and then I start on the opposite side. Sounds laborious but it goes fast.
The scrolls are a different matter and I am not always happy with them. I scribe them very lightly free hand. The scribe lines are always lumpy, but I roughly lay out the size of the scroll I want and the area to be covered. Then I just start cutting....I really do not follow the lumpy line and it seems to be easier for me to cut the scroll fairly well even though it is not drawn very precisely. Hard to explain... but I will take some photos of what the sketch looks like when I start and then what the cut scrolls come out like.
For repetative things that have to be the same, I use a trick Jerry Huddleston taught me. I cut or draw one of the designs I want to duplicate. Then put a thin piece of mylar over the design and trace it with a scribe. The scribe cuts into the mylar enough to retain some of the thick printers ink I rub into the scribe line. I then flip it over to where I want the matching design and burnish the inked line with a polished burnisher. This will transfer enough ink to the surface to be able to see it and cut the matching design. The way I just described it is the way I do mirror images. If the designs need to be the same. I scribe the cut in the mylar on both sides so I can transfer a duplicate design or a mirror image design.
I have dabbled with a lot of transfer methods using a computer but none of those have worked very well for me. They all depend on specific printers that get outdated and then the system doesn't work any more....at least for me. The best was the trick of using a laser jet printer and acetone to transfer a design. But I don't have a laser jet printer any longer. So everything I do is mostly free hand sketches that get cleaned up (more or less) with the graver.
I will take some pictures as I do the butt plate and barrel.
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Thanks, Dave! I’d be very interested in the Mylar method you described. I’ve had pretty much the same experiences as you when it comes to printers and transfer methods. I typically just draw a design in pencil, then go back over it with a drafting pen. These pens have a thin wire plunger that allows the ink to flow. The ones I use are in the .03” or .05” range and make a very fine line. Best,
Ed
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Very fine work Dave.
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Mr. Barker.....thank you. I appreciate the vote of confidence.
Ed....I need to do a bunch of that transfer method on the barrel. I will take pictures and explain as I go.
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Ed,
As promised. Here are some pictures of the transfer technique Jerry H taught me........I don't do it as capably as he does, but I can make it work for me......OK, here goes....
This is a piece of the engraving I did on the barrel quite some time ago and that I want to duplicate at another place on the barrel. In this picture, I have all ready taped down a piece of clear mylar film over the lower portion of the design I want to copy:
(https://i.ibb.co/YWLxD5b/IMG-8426.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PY6dT2t)
In this next photo I am using a scribe to cut into the mylar surface tracing the major components of the design:
(https://i.ibb.co/vvBSMXf/IMG-8427.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PzYdVDJ)
Here is the scribed tracing of the design with as much detail as I need to get it placed and transferred. I don't try to get every little detail on the tracing.
(https://i.ibb.co/hV48m6h/IMG-8428.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9W1YrDz)
This is the very thick ink I use for the next step. This is a several year old can. The surface skins over deeply and it looks like the ink is no good any longer. But if I jam a coffee stirring stick through the skin and deep into the can, I can always come up with fresh ink.
(https://i.ibb.co/Khp05v1/IMG-8429.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XLr2WRw)
Getting ready to ink the scribe lines:
(https://i.ibb.co/8dv31m8/IMG-8430.jpg) (https://ibb.co/k9bnNGc)
Inking the scribe lines:
(https://i.ibb.co/BBkCVnM/IMG-8432.jpg) (https://ibb.co/vk9jxXn)
Excess ink wiped off with a paper towel.....not too hard but clean enough to keep the ink from squeezing out too much:
(https://i.ibb.co/cwp7bWb/IMG-8433.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nBV53X3)
The mylar is now flipped ink side down and taped into place on the barrel where I want the design duplicated. (Since this design is symmetrical, flipping it over it is just the same design. If the design was not symmetrical, and I wanted it to look the same as the original, I would retrace the underside of the mylar and ink that side.)
(https://i.ibb.co/6t88Xxj/IMG-8434.jpg) (https://ibb.co/QHkkDRy)
Burnishing the inked lines with a smooth burnisher:
(https://i.ibb.co/BVtx8zG/IMG-8435.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KjXkC0D)
The design transferred to the surface to be engraved:
(https://i.ibb.co/cNg1VZS/IMG-8436.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JzBKgGw)
This is the thicker mylar ruler I made for myself to help with layouts....the blue tape on the end makes it easier to find the clear plastic piece lying in all the junk on my bench !!! :o
(https://i.ibb.co/MS9mN83/IMG-8437.jpg) (https://ibb.co/542PcYf)
Close view showing the perpendicular and 45 degree scribed lines on the mylar strip:
(https://i.ibb.co/Yp40Sqs/IMG-8438.jpg) (https://ibb.co/jg9JY1X)
I used the mylar ruler to re-scribe the straight lines of the triangular portion of the design and then made those first two outline cuts. In this photo, I am using the small dividers to scribe parallel lines:
(https://i.ibb.co/t2h35Fc/IMG-8439.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fNSQ7Lt)
Half of the overall design cut:
(https://i.ibb.co/rZzq51N/IMG-8440.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dQVXkzx)
Major portion of the design cut:
(https://i.ibb.co/zsk5q6J/IMG-8454.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wyvL5cs)
Start of the cross hatched area:
(https://i.ibb.co/P9stmXm/IMG-8455.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4YwJmvm)
Completed duplicate design:
(https://i.ibb.co/ns4SR6h/IMG-8456.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KjBHmbC)
Original design I was trying to copy:
(https://i.ibb.co/0qbwNCg/IMG-8457.jpg) (https://ibb.co/K6v1Z2M)
All in all, to duplicate this little design took me about 30 minutes, including stopping to take pictures. I'm not a fast engraver.....but I'm not a slow engraver.....I'm just sort of a "half fast" engraver.... ???
I hope this helps explain how this works......
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Hi Dave,
Thank you. That was very helpful.
dave
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Dave..., thank you (and Jerry) very much for the great tutorial and information! That’s a simple, yet very affective method, and can’t wait to give it a go. Thanks very much!! Best,
Ed
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This is amazing. Through skill and art and created something extraordinary. Just wonderful
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That is Really neat, Great Pix and clear writ-up. You must be steady as a Rock.
Tim
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Been too busy to get much done on this blunderbuss....and I am anxious to finish it as I have at least 6 other rifles and pistols started and on the bench awaiting work. Anyway, I did have a chance to finish up the thumb piece engraving per the customer's request.......
(https://i.ibb.co/pKK5hPJ/IMG-8475.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PWW0DYw)
Back to work on the butt plate and final barrel engraving.
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Very nice work Dave and thanks for sharing your transfer method.
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love the detailed engraving you do Dave
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A month has gone by.....again.....life has a way of intruding. A close friend (younger than me and in much better physical condition) passed away very unexpectedly....funeral arrangements, helping his family, food preparation for visiting family....since most of us are well past the middle of our projected life cycles, I'm sure I'm not telling you guys anything you don't know. Then work rears its ugly head again (but I have become addicted to eating.....so off to work I go.....) Nonetheless, I did have a few minutes to start the engraving on the butt plate for this gun. The first photo relates to earlier questions about using Dykem for laying out engraving. I applied the Dykem but then just sketched with a scribe (very lightly) the design I wanted to engrave:
(https://i.ibb.co/rpmJm4J/IMG-8509.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZgVCVWC)
This second photo is the initial engraving.....not finished by a long shot, but all the major pieces are in place. I will go back over the design, straighten out a few things, and then complete the shading:
(https://i.ibb.co/Zh13qVx/IMG-8627.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kh6pNxX)
I'm off to Tennessee for a couple of weeks (house there needs a new roof). No rest for the wicked....and the good don't need it !
Dave C
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Dave, I worked in printing for longer than I care to admit, and I think almost any printer's ink would be suitable for your transfer method. Most shops would likely just give you a small amount, like 4 to 6 ounces.
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@!*%!!! Can I say that on here? It was my first thought when seeing those pictures.
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Single Malt,
Thanks for the idea. I bought a tub of printers ink to do this originally and I can still use it, but I have to dig through a very solid, very thick top layer to find some usable ink. I will try getting a smaller amount from a print shop.
Mick C,
Thanks...this is a link to a finished one of these I did a while ago...This one is taking so much time, I'm not sure any of us will live long enough to see this gun finished !!!
http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=38909.0
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Doggone, Dave - you can engrave anything on one of my rifles any time you want. And no fair running off to the desert for some ol' missile tests!
Really like that cannon and the crossed implements!
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Thanks Craig. I’ve been running off doing rocket stuff for nearly 40 years now. Getting close to time to quit and finish all the other projects I haven’t had time for !
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Single Malt,
Thanks for the idea. I bought a tub of printers ink to do this originally and I can still use it, but I have to dig through a very solid, very thick top layer to find some usable ink. I will try getting a smaller amount from a print shop.
Dave, I just thought of this, rake the skin out of the can and keep using it. Use a putty knife, preferably with a metal blade, and cut around the wall of the can and rake it out onto a sheet of paper and discard. The ink will continue to "skin" over because of the dryers in the ink, but you can manage that. There are products in the printing industry to prevent ink skin, but they aren't foolproof. Give it a try and let me know how it works.
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Will do, thanks
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Well....this thread seems to go on forever.....I just have not had a long enough run of free time to get it done, but I am determined to be finished before Christmas. I finally had the time to concentrate on engraving enough to finish the butt plate. Now on to the last engraving on the barrel.
Note to Dennis : Can you fix the "old URL" issue with the photos in this post as well ? Thanks
(https://i.ibb.co/dfC17W7/IMG-8826.jpg) (https://ibb.co/YNnYbRb)
(https://i.ibb.co/s2BRZLn/IMG-8830.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0cw2xPT)
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I love this thread. High art. God Bless, Marc
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I have a real soft spot for all things artillery, so this motif is exemplary to me! Superb composition and execution!
kw
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Marc.....thanks for the vote of confidence... :)
45-110.....having been a gunnery officer in the US Navy, I share your enthusiasm for the big guns. I love the quote from Fredrick the Great in the 18th century sometime. He said, "Artillery lends dignity to what would otherwise be an ugly brawl." One of the things that I dislike about 18th century engraving is that whenever the engraver decided to throw a cannon barrel into a panoply of arms, it always came out looking like a lopsided beer barrel that had been used for target practice. The cannon of the 18th century have a beauty and symmetry all their own. They should look the way they really looked in any depiction rather than looking like a non descript, thick walled piece of pipe laying around.... :(
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Ah, Dave - you've done a splendid job on that old carriage piece. Modern cannon are not very "picturesque", but they are very effective. On the carrier (Intrepid), we had a 5" 38 cal right outboard of my work space - and I learned every position on that except gun captain. It is very accurate when firing, which always amazed me. Ship moving forward at about 20+ mph, rolling and pitching, yet able to hit a towed sled with no problem! Wish we were ab;e to do that with our muzzle loaders!
PS - never mind the jets taking off and landing, or the AD's, or banging/screeching from the arresting gear engines - I believe my hearing loss is from that 5" and it's penetrating bark.
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Hi Dave,
That is great!! Yes, all the engraved guns looked like howitzers at best. It gets worse when it comes to animals. Beautiful work as always, Dave. Please keep posting!
dave
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Thanks for posting this excellent work, Dave. It’s always humbling to study.
Bob
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Craig - I understand completely. On the destroyer, I had a 5-54 automatic gun (along with torpedo tubes, an ASROC launcher, and a Tartar missile launcher). The 5"-54 could put out ~30 rounds per minute. It was on the foc'sle and I was usually stationed on either bridge wing maybe 30 feet from the muzzle with a set of sound powered phones talking to gun plot in CIC. Between that and then being the Main Propulsion Assistant and working in the engine and fire rooms for years, my hearing went early.... :-\
David - YES !! The animals in the old engraving !! Most of them looked like knock kneed, broke winded, somnambulating excuses for what they were supposed to be. Funny how the old engravers could do such beautiful design work and yet not be able to do animals very accurately.
And thanks to all for the kind words
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Dave.
The engravers in the guild and I have often talked about the cartoonish looking animals the old gun engravers in Europe did. The most popular consensus is that they knew the difference but did this intentionally probably because it was popular. In that era there were hundreds if not thousands of book engravers who did very realistic looking animals for the printing of books. Most of the book engravers were just kids some of them were only 12 years old. so they knew the difference and had the ability to do the same on guns. For some reason they just didn't.
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Jerry,
Thanks. I have not looked at much in the way of book engraving, but I will. I remember our conversation about how young many European engravers started out in the trade. For those who missed it, below is an excerpt from an old post of mine ......
On the subject of young engravers:
In 1978 I was a junior officer aboard a Navy destroyer on a western Pacific deployment. We had been in and out of the US Naval base at Subic Bay. One day as I was on the pier, there was a small boy with a little portable work bench doing something for a sailor from another ship. I walked over to see what was up and the lad was engraving brass belt buckles. He asked me if I wanted a buckle. I asked how long it would take... and he said about 20 minutes ! He had a small vice, a single square (obviously home made) graver, a sharpening stone, and a little hammer. This is what he engraved for me…..in about 20 minutes. He wanted $5……I gave him $20. He smiled a lot. I asked him how old he was. He was 9.
(https://i.ibb.co/F8LV79Q/My-Navy-Buckle.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wpFs6Tn)
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Dennis was kind enough to explain to me how to fix the photos at the beginning of this thread so that they pop up automatically....and I fixed them. Thanks Dennis !
Dave C
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Absolutely beautiful work, Dave! I agree wholeheartedly with your sentiments regarding cannon and animals. Probably why I’ve always been a little on the fence about “folksy” attributes as well.
Ed
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Ed,
I understand the desire to do things the way they were done in the 18th century (or 17th / 19th), but I just cannot force myself to engrave or carve funny looking stuff on a gun I just spent a lot of time trying to make look great. Is I also understand your comment about being on the fence about "folksy" designs. What I engrave may not be traditional, but then again, it really isn't the 18th century and I'm chatting with all of you about this on a computer ! (It just looks better to me.)
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Amid the maelstrom of Christmas preparations, I am completing one of my least favorite chores....final polishing of the barrel in preparation for engraving. The good news is that the breach of the barrel is the last engraving to be done on this gun. The only thing left after this is the final finish on the wood. I will probably not get this project done done until after the first of the year, but the end is in sight. I got the polishing done today, along with some engraving on the underside of the barrel. Tomorrow I will start in on engraving the breach.......
(https://i.ibb.co/n3N95SG/IMG-8885.jpg) (https://ibb.co/N1d5Hzv)
(https://i.ibb.co/XpVW7tG/IMG-8886.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bL76sXG)
(https://i.ibb.co/x3yfh9K/IMG-8887.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TrZbcjD)
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There’s something very satisfying about well polished metal. Looks great!
Ed
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Ed,
You're right....there is something very satisfying.....but there is also something very tedious about getting to the "satisfying" part... ;)
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After the pandemonium of the holidays, I had a little time to head into the final engraving run on this blunderbuss. I am really so close I am anxious to get this gun finished for Andrei.
Started tonight with the barrel breach and wedding band boarders......
(https://i.ibb.co/SB6XcR3/IMG-8982.jpg) (https://ibb.co/7KSJQ21)
(https://i.ibb.co/bL0FKTy/IMG-8987.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5v0kRmz)
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That's beautiful neat work Dave!
Congrats!!
Very elegant and tasteful.
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Elegant work that just ‘pops’ - wow!
And can you imagine the work/art that 9-year old boy must now be capable of? Yeesh, at age 9 ... some of us were still struggling to keep the crayon ‘inside the lines’, LOL!
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Commendable engraving.
Dave, are you using a Lindsay Airgraver?
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Smokepole - No. Most of the work is done with a 40 year old GraverMeister. Some I do by hand and some with a hammer and graver....depends on what I am doing
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Hi Dave. Great looking stuff. If you use mostly square gravers, how many different sizes do you use if more than one and what sizes are they. Smylee
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Smylee - All of the engraving I have done on this gun has been done with four gravers. The three primary ones are all ground from 1/8" square Glenn Steel blanks. One of them is a flat (about 0.050" wide) that I use for all the pick and dot work. Two others are simple 90 degree square gravers. One has the end ground to about 0.050" wide and the other, for shading and finer lines, has the tip ground to about 0.025" wide. The fourth graver is a multiple liner I use for shading things like the cannon barrel on the butt plate. Of course, I have dozens of other gravers that I have made up for one thing or another, but the four I mention here are the only ones I needed for this job.
However.....come to think of it.....I did make a new beading punch to make the little round beads at the breech. I didn't have one the right size, so I made up a new one. Not really a graver, per se, but one of the tools I used on this gun just for the border beading.
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What is that tool your guiding with your index finger as you polish the top barrel flat?
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Smokepole- I am polishing the barrel flat with these sanding sticks:
(https://i.ibb.co/M6k82y6/Sanding-sticks.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
They are plastic and spring loaded to hold 1/4" wide sanding belts of various grits. I have a half a dozen of the sticks and keep one for each of the grits I use. I use them for polishing lock parts, brass parts, barrels, and stock details. When polishing metal I usually use them with a light oil (as in the picture you refer to). The belts don't load up as much with the oil. Here is a link to some available on Amazon but the sticks and belts are available from many sources including jewelry supply houses:
https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B079GHS13V?aaxitk=BjhPW.OfNRwSAJO2fZcH6w&pd_rd_i=B079GHS13V&pf_rd_p=591760d1-6468-480f-9b10-0ee9c85706fd&hsa_cr_id=9367417650701&sb-ci-n=productDescription&sb-ci-v=5%20Piece%20Sanding%20Detailer%20Stick%20Set%20with%202%20Extra%20Replacement%20Belts%20Per%20Stick%2C%205%20Grits%20120%2C%20240%2C%20320%2C%20400%20%26%20500%20Grit%20Made%20in%20The%20USA%20for%20Sanding%20Wood%2C%20Metal%20%26%20Plastics%2C%20Long%20Life%20Sanding%20Belts
And here is a set from Rio Grande. They also have better belts.....more expensive but better.
https://www.riogrande.com/product/sanding-stick-assortment-set-of-6/337286
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I really appreciate that information. Schippers always emphasized making sure metal was polished well before engraving. This will help.
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Working away on the barrel breech engraving. This part is fairly delicate and complicated, so I go fairly slowly. The first picture is a paper drawing glued onto the barrel with rubber cement. I put Dykem on the surface first and then glue the drawing in place. Then I trace through the drawing with a fine pointed scalpel to mark the blueing. The second photo shows the resulting tracing and the start of the outline engraving. The third photo is some of today's progress and shading........It will look a lot better when I get all the details cleaned up...
(https://i.ibb.co/nwDzRws/IMG-8988.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yN8WVNn)
(https://i.ibb.co/t8vfrVC/IMG-8989.jpg) (https://ibb.co/r4zPrDy)
(https://i.ibb.co/mzYpvQD/IMG-9005.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LpqKQ4k)
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P.S. I posted this photo of another blunderbuss I built for a fellow over in the "Black Powder Shooting" section, but in case you missed it, this is what a 10 gage version looks like.....the one I'm building in this thread is a 4 gage ........ ;) :) :o These things aren't much good for long range target shooting, but you can't beat them as an "area denial" weapon !!!
(https://i.ibb.co/nBj1Ltf/IMG-9002.jpg) (https://ibb.co/W0fz2jF)
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Dave, you just need some 40 mm grenades to be launched via your 4-gauge. Or make do with a handful of rusty nuts and bolts..
I truly like the globe and anchor design you are scratching in on the rear of the barrel. About how long does the engraving part take?
Sure appreciate you showing us progress photos - please continue as best you can.
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More progress on the barrel engraving....the hardest parts completed.....
(https://i.ibb.co/y8dzKPP/IMG-9022.jpg) (https://ibb.co/D7zBmWW)
(https://i.ibb.co/TKNVyht/IMG-9023.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GsrKmPR)
Some lettering on the barrel and then the final finish on the wood. It's been a long time coming on this one. Just too many other things going on ...
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Super work, Dave. I am in awe.
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I am in awe as well. Not even sure if awe is even the right word to describe your fantastic talents.
Dave
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Dave, I envy you and your signature style. That's very nice work, and it adds so much to the already superlative gun.
Question: do you chase with chisel and hammer, or do you use a pneumatic engraver, or both?
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Thanks for the kind comments.....not sure I deserve them, but thank you.
Taylor.....mostly I use my nearly 40 year old Gravermeister but I also use hand gravers (not very much but some) and a hammer with other longer gravers and punches. I'm not too sure about whatever "style" I may have since I seem to jump from one thing to the next......but I am expecting a style to develop out of all this.....if I can hang in there for another decade or so... :o
(https://i.ibb.co/0m7JDT4/IMG-9028.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VJ1BjRn)
(https://i.ibb.co/DLVf4NP/IMG-9029.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HXFT70L)
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The incredible talent displayed on this website amazes me. What a great group of "man art" producers!
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Craig.....I missed your question about how long this engraving took me. I have had to do it in bits and pieces but, all told, all of the barrel engraving (muzzle to breech and tang) has taken me about 4 evenings to complete......probably about 18 to 20 hours total.
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Thanks, Dave. I am totally in awe of your abilities.
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It was a long time coming, but all the engraving on the gun is complete with the final bit on the barrel......"VICTORIAM".......Victory !
(https://i.ibb.co/7zx1G7p/IMG-9041.jpg) (https://ibb.co/H2LHrmP)
The last step in the whole process is finishing the stock wood. Andrei found a superlative piece of walnut for this gun. Here the stock has the first application of Sutherland & Wells polymerized Tung oil. It is turning in the sun on my "stock rotisserie"....
(https://i.ibb.co/7S7wdLD/IMG-9035.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XWmhrMP)
I hardened the heads of all the screws and started the finish on the ram rod today as well.
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Dave: I bought an old Gravermeister too, about twenty years ago, but I've never hooked it up to try it. I should probably drag it out and plug it in...
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Excellent job!!!!!!- Proud FEGA Member!!!!!!!-- - - love the nautical theme and the shading -
Jon
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Stunning work Dave.
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Taylor,
You should try out the Gravermeister. GRS makes upgraded hand pieces and also has at least one modification kit for older models to increase the stroke speed. I have installed both types of upgrades. I also have a Graver Max and a Graver Mach. They all have slightly different features, but I don't need an air compressor running for the Gravermeister. I plugged it into a momentary "ON-OFF" foot switch so I don't have to leave the Gravermeister running. I turn it on with the foot switch under my left foot and then operate the throttle with my right foot. If your unit has one of the older hand pieces, I would heartily recommend looking at the more modern versions. The 901 hand piece I am using now is far easier to use than the older versions.
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And Taylor, should you not want to hook it up and try it out, just send it to me and I will take very good care of it.
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Wow what a thread. Pretty much speaks for itself Dave. Talented work,.....and the dental work :o
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Dave..., I think your “style” would be described as “superb”! Your knack for shading brings a whole ‘nother element to the engraving. Beautiful work!
Taylor..., do yourself a favor and get to know your Gravermeister, I think you’ll be in for a pleasant surprise. Although I have to say, you’re hand engraving is to level where I would have guessed you already used a Gravermeister.
Ed
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I nearly choked when I checked the price of Gravermeisters on Brownells!....looks like I'm sticking with my hammer and hand gravers.
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Smokepole,
I recently had a friend buy a used Gravermeister for a few hundred dollars. But you are correct, unless you just use a hammer, an oil stone, one graver, and a bench vise, engraving isn't an inexpensive hobby.
Ed,
Thank you....you and others are too kind.
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Dave, thanks for the tip about the detail sanding sticks. Ordered a set Wednesday, and started using them Friday - pretty quick shipping, seems to be a very solid product.
I WOULD like to make some 12" belts of grades between 600 and 2,000. Those little sticks concentrate the sanding/polishing effort in a very small place, and going 90* to the previous direction really gets out the small scratches very easily.
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Craig,
They do make those sanding sticks and belts 1/2" and 1" wide.
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Dave sent a PM
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This has been a long time coming......work.....life....death.....medical stuff......but it is finally done. For those of you who have followed along, thank you for your patience and for the many helpful suggestions. Andrei has been particularly patient in waiting for me to finish. He didn't want a sling but I told him I would make up a 4 gage jag and some other items to help him clean this gun after firing. And the very last thing will be to build a packing crate to get this gun safely to him in Texas.
I think this will be my last blunderbuss. I would like to finish the pistols and English rifle that have been on the bench for far too long.
(https://i.ibb.co/smpvfLb/Andrei-BB-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/h7xR6pL)
(https://i.ibb.co/WWNSfFF/Andrei-BB-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ynmLq55)
(https://i.ibb.co/SKx42Lk/Andrei-BB-3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cNvSPmW)
(https://i.ibb.co/PWQ8Dsb/Andrei-BB-4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5jFVKXz)
(https://i.ibb.co/xXWSfnZ/Andrei-BB-5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gmNMP0Y)
(https://i.ibb.co/DMGphdx/Andrei-BB-6.jpg) (https://ibb.co/NN1S5R8)
(https://i.ibb.co/KxCXDL5/Andrei-BB-7.jpg) (https://ibb.co/4RB72YF)
(https://i.ibb.co/yQwsS6V/Andrei-BB-8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/tJ7CXq3)
(https://i.ibb.co/t4bbcXv/Andrei-BB-9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hyKKHf4)
(https://i.ibb.co/S0jFqr2/Andrei-BB-10.jpg) (https://ibb.co/XpQcm89)
(https://i.ibb.co/P6DLNZh/Andrei-BB-11.jpg) (https://ibb.co/MCBvsDV)
(https://i.ibb.co/G50yRhy/Andrei-BB-12.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6WmzFdz)
(https://i.ibb.co/W6TfbM4/Andrei-BB-13.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CzrQkY3)
(https://i.ibb.co/0c2ZSDT/Andrei-BB-14.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9Ng2L86)
(https://i.ibb.co/JsXMtdf/Andrei-BB-15.jpg) (https://ibb.co/1mHwQnD)
(https://i.ibb.co/RPxJrhV/Andrei-BB-16.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fthT68P)
(https://i.ibb.co/9pjVRFW/Andrei-BB-17.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kGF9YRX)
(https://i.ibb.co/PN6ctjX/Andrei-BB-18.jpg) (https://ibb.co/SP3tJyY)
(https://i.ibb.co/ykR92Vb/Andrei-BB-19.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DMbJdLS)
(https://i.ibb.co/hBvfnHq/Andrei-BB-21.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Pc8Qb4S)
(https://i.ibb.co/GV69B3w/Andrei-BB-22.jpg) (https://ibb.co/K9PDRzZ)
(https://i.ibb.co/hXvf55x/Andrei-BB-23.jpg) (https://ibb.co/VH8myy0)
(https://i.ibb.co/1fJChnM/Andrei-BB-24.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gMF0H7d)
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Dave you do superlative work, always beautiful and great architecture. I've learned a lot from your posts and especially photos. I plan a return trip to the U.K. this year to visit museums and maybe pick up a specimen or two. Thanks for the inspiration and entertainment!
Carl
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I agree with Carl’s assessment. Crisp, clean, wonderfully executed! Not much more I could add... Best,
Ed
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I see a lot of fellers with talent on this forum, but gosh, I’d give my right arm for that scatter gun.
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That is fantastic Dave!! Best blunderbuss I have ever seen for sure.
I have a question for you. What tools and techniques do you use to get that nicely defined transition through the wrist into the buttstock?
(https://i.ibb.co/j3pd6FD/Andrei-BB-24.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9yMJ8jW)
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That is a work of art!!!
Best regards
Rolf
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Some fine work right there,beautiful!
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This piece should be in a museum somewhere. Just sayin’. Great work David!
Greg
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Wonderfully done Dave. Perfectly executed.
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Stunning - agree with all the other posts - you are exceptional...
Jon
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I second Justins question about the wrist into buttstock definition. Im always trying to learn a new technique. Thanks....Lynn
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Over the top, Dave, over the top!
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Thank you all for the kind comments. I'm actually hoping Andrei doesn't like it.....and then I can pay him for the parts he sent and keep it myself ;)
To Justin and LynnC: The tools I use to shape that part of the butt stock are shown in the picture below:
(https://i.ibb.co/74xcmm2/Andrei-BB-Stock-Shaping-Tools.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TLDX33m)
Depending on how the wood behaves, I use the fine saw to establish primary lines from the comb down and then from the side in. I can't see where the saw cuts would intersect too well and it is easy to trash a stock by cutting in too far. So I cut part way in each direction and then remove wood with the gouge to see where I am. As soon as I have established the line of the wrist down toward the butt, I use the little plane to remove as much wood as I can on both the flat side of the butt and for rounding the wrist extension. If the grain is too contrary to use the plane very effectively, as it was on this piece of wood, I start in with the rasp. Once the shape is very close to finished, the fender file straightens all the surfaces and makes the wood much smoother without very much effort. That saves a lot of scraping and / or sanding time.
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That is one magnificent firearm. Beautiful!
David
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I also finished the cleaning attachments....a 4 gage jag and a "T" handle. Both thread into the 10-32 threads in each end of the ram rod. The "T" handle is the same one I use on the Gunner's Mate tools I make, so it has a screwdriver tip, a touch hole pick, and, when the touch hole pick is in place, the end of the pick handle works well for knapping the edge of a flint. The smaller jag is a .54....not useful on the blunderbuss but just something to screw onto the threaded end of the "T" bar.
(https://i.ibb.co/9gKp5xm/Andrei-BB-Ram-Rod-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/8svmZyn)
(https://i.ibb.co/rxLqFSC/Andrei-BB-Ram-Rod-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/LxqBYWL)
(https://i.ibb.co/Svc81rH/Andrei-BB-Ram-Rod-3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GP9L1TG)
(https://i.ibb.co/60VS96X/Andrei-BB-Ram-Rod-4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HT1ywmh)
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Thank you for the detailed explanation. I never tried a fender file or bull nose plane on the wrist into butt area. I have both tools an will give it a try. My last fowler i did with gouges, chisels, rasps and files. The one before a back saw and gouges. I can see the fender file straightening things out and doing a much better job at smoothing.
Thanks again for the tips. Lynn
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thanks for the explanation. I've never even heard of a fender file before. Seems like another tool to add to the shop
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Justin, they are also called "body files". The continuous arced teeth cut quickly but very smoothly.
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I guess you can find them at auto parts stores?
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Dave this is one of the finest guns I have seen in a y category or school. Very Very impressive...
Oldtravler
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The fender/body files were used to cut the lead body filler used waaaaaayy back in the old days before Bondo. I have a few files but never found much use for them till now maybe.
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Justin,
Also called "curved tooth files". I have some made by Nicholson, Vixen, Grobet. I don't remember where I got mine but looked up a few places.....here you go......
https://www.tinmantech.com/products/hand-tools/files-holders/super-shear-files/
https://atmsupplyco.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=2676
https://www.grainger.com/product/CRESCENT-NICHOLSON-Flat-Babbitt-File-1G520
https://www.ebay.com/itm/TSUBOSAN-Curved-Tooth-Files-6-14-Bastard-Cut-Hand-Type-240-made-in-japan/253661231666?hash=item3b0f633a32:m:m2uw0AjPNAa_DDcH3lPCGYg
http://www.warrensvillefile.com/index.php/american-pattern/milled-curved-tooth.html
This las outfit looks good. They also make these with a handle like a plane and a replaceable file blade. I always wanted one of those....loks like you could really bear down with that arrangement.
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LynnC,
They will cut most metals and the large teeth don't load up with soft metals like lead, babbit, aluminum, copper, etc. They work great on hardwood but if they are not sharp, they will skate over the surface. Mine were old and not too sharp but I sent them to Boggs Tool and had them sharpened. They work great now.......Come to think of it, I may have found a few of these at an old tool sale somewhere.
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Thanks Dave. I'll pick one up
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That's magnificent work, Dave. It's almost too pretty to shoot.
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This one should come back up to the top for everyone to see again.
I'm getting one of the same Ed Rayl barrels, so I'll be tackling one pretty soon.
I have a few questions for you, Dave.
How thick was the stock blank that you started with?
Do you make the stock with a standard length of pull like a fowler, or are they shorter?
What size ramrod did you use, and do you have to drill it at a weird angle to clear the muzzle flare?
Thanks
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I didyknoe a Blunderbus could look so graceful. Beautiful work as always 👏
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Justin,
I think the stock blank was 2 1/2 inches thick to start but could have been a bit thinner. In the beginning pictures of this thread I had already planed the stock to near final thickness in the lock / side plate area. Yes, the pull was the same as my long rifles.....I didn't try to shorten the stock any. I used a 3/8" hickory ram rod but made a flared brass button for the end as shown in the photos. The ram rod hole was drilled parallel to the bore. When stowed, the ram rod button is caught behind the muzzle rings. You have to flex the rod slightly to disengage is and pull it out of the stock.
They are a blast to shoot (if you will pardon the pun.... ;)) Have fun building and shooting it !!
daveC2
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Curved edge files were called "Body files"and were primary tools in fender and body shops.A lot of dings and dents were filled with lead and these files were used to level out the lead.The lead was sold in "sticks" at any automobile supply shop and I used one to repair a ding in the 1937 Cadillac I had while in high school.It was a Series 85 with a V12 engine and all 4 doors were locked with a key.I still have a big Vixen in my tools but never tried it on wood.Old line parts shops like NAPA and Motor Car Supply may still have these "sticks" of body lead and vixen files.
Bob Roller
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Thanks for the info Dave.