AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: Marcruger on February 23, 2018, 04:50:41 AM
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Hi Gents and Ladies,
In my limited knowledge, it appears that pans became narrower as time went on. Perhaps just selected ones, but that is my impression. If this is so, why did the pans get narrower? It seems to defeat the purpose of giving powder exposure to flying sparks. Here are examples:
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.ibb.co%2FieGp5x%2F1431a.jpg&hash=05c03928b7961336519ee5e8b57397f0c1e748ae) (http://imgbb.com/)
Wide and early.
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimage.ibb.co%2Fij3rJH%2FLock_2.jpg&hash=456785ac035c7b8c24f25dbaa629a72dc2b93f22) (http://imgbb.com/)
Narrower and later.
Just curious. Best wishes and God Bless, Marc
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Well for starters, you are comparing a military musket lock to a very late period waterproof sporting lock. If you compare locks that were designed for the same purpose, I suspect the pan sizes will be more uniform in size.
Hungry Horse
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Good question. Maybe quality of powder?
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I agree Hungry Horse. Still, notice that the later pan appears to be "cut away" from the fence and the bridle for the frizzen. Was it for style? It just seems like a wider pan would give a better chance at reliable ignition.
Best wishes, Marc
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...notice that the later pan appears to be "cut away" from the fence and the bridle for the frizzen. Was it for style?
The intent was to make the pan less subject to water collecting/condensing and running down into the pan, wetting the priming charge.
Carl
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Hi,
There are at least 2 reasons of which I am aware. One was to concentrate the priming powder near the vent hole enabling more reliable ignition and use of less priming powder. Second, the small pan was more easily isolated from the fence so water was not directed by the fence into the pan. Also keep in mind civilian locks (and to a lesser extent military) trended smaller in all dimensions during the late 18th and early 19th centuries.
dave
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The water that will spoil your hunting trip is the drop that runs off the 45 degree flat
above the pan.There were some locks that were made in such a way that partially
helped with water run off.
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To quote Robert Held in the American Gun "TINY,gold plated corrosion proof,sure fire pans in
the old man's 25 year old Manton Double".The reason we have the marvelous relics to admire,try to copy
and use today was the obstructionist goals of the flintlock advocates who were trying to forestall the
percussion system then making advances into the hunting fields.Also they claimed that war using the
percussion system would create casualties beyond number by more certain ignition of powder.
These little locks with their powerful springs,linked to the tumbler that that when released would slam fire into the tiny
priming charge. The big military locks more or less dumped the fire into the pan and there IS a noticeable
difference in these locks.I well recall Tom Dawson's 16 bore Manton whose ignition was abrupt and as Tom
said, "It feels like the cock is kicking back under the gun". Another less thought of thing was the little sporting
locks were more apt to fire in a strong wind.
The water that will wreck a hunting trip with these guns was the drop or two that ran down off the 45 degree
angle above the pan.
Bob Roller
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Thank you folks! Now I know. Sometimes the obvious eludes me.
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The water that will spoil your hunting trip is the drop that runs off the 45 degree flat
above the pan.There were some locks that were made in such a way that partially
helped with water run off.
My LAST post was much longer and is widely separated from this one. How did this happen?
Bob Roller
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To quote Robert Held in the American Gun "TINY,gold plated corrosion proof,sure fire pans in
the old man's 25 year old Manton Double".The reason we have the marvelous relics to admire,try to copy
and use today was the obstructionist goals of the flintlock advocates who were trying to forestall the
percussion system then making advances into the hunting fields.Also they claimed that war using the
percussion system would create casualties beyond number by more certain ignition of powder.
These little locks with their powerful springs,linked to the tumbler that that when released would slam fire into the tiny
priming charge. The big military locks more or less dumped the fire into the pan and there IS a noticeable
difference in these locks.I well recall Tom Dawson's 16 bore Manton whose ignition was abrupt and as Tom
said, "It feels like the cock is kicking back under the gun". Another less thought of thing was the little sporting
locks were more apt to fire in a strong wind.
The water that will wreck a hunting trip with these guns was the drop or two that ran down off the 45 degree
angle above the pan.
Bob Roller
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Bob, I thought maybe you posted some pictures that didn't load :o
Mark
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Bob, I thought maybe you posted some pictures that didn't load :o
Mark
Mark'
No pictures.I suppose it was another electrobooger that escaped.
Bob Roller