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General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: smart dog on October 21, 2019, 01:48:22 AM

Title: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: smart dog on October 21, 2019, 01:48:22 AM
Hi Folks,
I am building a Chambers Isaac Haines kit for a customer.  I don't like kits but he wanted me to carve and engrave the gun as close to RCA 81 as best I can.  The kit was profiled for a wooden patch box but I added a brass copy of RCA 81.  Although I don't like kits, the challenge of trying to recreate Haines' carving on that rifle is intimidating.  I rarely back away from a challenge so here are some of my efforts.  I'll post more as I go.
(https://i.imgur.com/DgBJgwm.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/fnblyw3.jpg)

dave
 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Daryl on October 21, 2019, 01:50:36 AM
Looking purty sweet, Dave.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: B.Barker on October 21, 2019, 03:26:47 AM
Really nice carving on the rifle. Haines did some really fine carving on the rifles he made.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Dan Fruth on October 21, 2019, 05:47:39 AM
Your work never ceases to amaze me...Great job!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Mike Lyons on October 21, 2019, 07:10:40 AM
You have it whooped.  It turned out beautiful. 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: alacran on October 21, 2019, 01:51:46 PM

(https://i.ibb.co/Jxn22FK/P1010017.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cbJttX1)
I tried that a few years back I got lost drawing it quite a few times. Went through a lot of erasers. I think yours will turn out better than mine.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Mike Brooks on October 21, 2019, 02:55:03 PM
Looks fine to me.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: smart dog on October 21, 2019, 03:21:21 PM
Hi Guys,
Thanks for looking and commenting.  Alacran, that is nice carving and you captured Haines' style very well.  My only sources are the photos in RCA Vol 1.  I have color photos of some of Haines' other rifles showing almost the same designs but it is clear that he took #81 to a higher standard.  I am using my KRF CDs and zooming in on the Haines rifle included on one of the CDs (RCA#78) to understand how he carved his designs but there are quite a few details on #81 that do not match.  One problem with the photos is the white stuff that obscures some of the edges of the carving and details.  It is almost like some sort of wax build up.  I made scaled tracings of the original carving and transferred them to the stock but those were just the outlines of the edges of the carving.  Carving the details from those photos is challenging.

dave
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Craig Wilcox on October 21, 2019, 04:28:30 PM
Dave, what I have seen of your work makes me think that you will excel in your task.  You are extremely talented, and I for one really appreciate your work.  Keep us posted - looking great already!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Marcruger on October 21, 2019, 06:25:26 PM
That is some nice looking carving. I was pondering the grain and the carving pattern. I don’t think that one was easy. God bless, Marc
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: D. Taylor Sapergia on October 21, 2019, 06:47:22 PM
Dave:  I really like what you've accomplished in your box and carving.  I built that rifle (several times actually) back in the 80's, when I was first experimenting with carving and driving a chisel through brass.  Here's one of my first efforts...incidentally, this rifle, a .54 cal. is still shooting well.  Our small group shot our trail yesterday, and this rifle is still a contender.


(https://i.ibb.co/wg19D3p/DSCN0513.jpg) (https://ibb.co/C8FkxNV)

(https://i.ibb.co/C0wRJV4/DSCN0517.jpg) (https://ibb.co/88m1zPG)
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: J. Talbert on October 22, 2019, 04:15:14 AM
Looking fine.
I have no doubt the rest will be just as good.

Jeff
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: alacran on October 22, 2019, 01:50:53 PM
Looks fine to me.
I think his carving on the bottom has a longer curve and looks less truncated than mine. Then I'm never totally pleased with my carvings.
Usually just happy to get them done.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: Jim Kibler on October 22, 2019, 06:50:40 PM
I think that looks nice.  Just one suggestion...  On the large lower right hand scroll there is a smaller leaf / scroll feature which wraps over the backside of the big scroll.  I think it would look better if this diverged a little more gently.  My eye keeps stopping at this point.  Great work!

Jim
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving
Post by: smart dog on October 24, 2019, 03:46:40 AM
Hi,
Thank you all for looking and commenting.  Jim Kibler, thank you for your  input.  I believe I understand your point and can work on that detail.  I mostly finished the cheek side wrist carving.  It came out well but still needs a little clean up and a few more details.  I won't finish defining the checkering until I've put the first coat of finish on the rifle.  I am concerned the diamonds will chip and want the wood hardened by the finish before finishing.  I'll come back and clean up the details after getting other areas carved. 

dave

(https://i.ibb.co/zNnrq2g/cheek-side-wrist-carving-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/JCBKDpT)
(https://i.ibb.co/NK98mQG/cheek-side-wrist-carving-2.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
(https://i.ibb.co/D5fbCMs/cheek-piece-side-carving-almost-finished-3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/HnT2zP1)
(https://i.ibb.co/5xX38x5/cheek-piece-side-carving-almost-finished.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Pzsyhz5)
(https://i.ibb.co/C9LMDW8/cheek-piece-side-carving-almost-finished-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PWk90tj)











(https://i.ibb.co/DgzhtFt/barrel-tang-carving-almost-done.jpg) (https://ibb.co/sJbn242)

(https://i.ibb.co/T0ch8XF/lock-side-wrist-carving-almost-done.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pK2XzD9)
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: smart dog on November 02, 2019, 06:49:40 PM
Hi Folks,
 finished the carving and stock on this Chambers Isaac Haines kit.  The owner wanted the carving to be a close to RCA 81 as I could.  I did the best I could given the limits of the photos.  Anyway, here are some views of the carving after stain and the first sealing coat of tung oil.

dave
(https://i.imgur.com/6S21mbA.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/yWONzyL.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/vM9K3CM.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/rzpf6jP.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/MWupYsX.jpg)
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Craig Wilcox on November 02, 2019, 06:53:54 PM
Dave, that is absolutely splendid!  Really like the way the curl and the carving give an impression of great depth, and fluid movement.
You provide a great example for those of us still learning to carve.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Mike Brooks on November 02, 2019, 07:27:53 PM
That's coming along great. There is always a tremendous difference in carving before and after staining, looks completely different. I always like the looks of mine before the stain, the stain makes all my mistakes stand out!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Jim Kibler on November 02, 2019, 09:24:35 PM
Looks great!  Nice work.

Jim
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: smart dog on November 16, 2019, 02:17:09 AM
Hi Guys,
Well I finished the carving and patch box engraving.  I tried to closely copy Haines' style. Here it is.

(https://i.ibb.co/Mnfwp3d/barrel-tang-carving-edited-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Jnq62MZ)

(https://i.ibb.co/Hzrvkxq/barrel-tang-carving-edited-3.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)

(https://i.ibb.co/FxYqCWJ/engraving-patchbox-9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yfkB7R5)


(https://i.ibb.co/T0VwLGH/rubbed-back-forward-cheek-piece-carving.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Smh6rgK)

(https://i.ibb.co/G9WVcr0/rubbed-back-patch-box-side-carving.jpg) (https://ibb.co/C6bnhSz)

(https://i.ibb.co/QDqCCRh/rubbed-back-rear-cheek-piece-carving.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)

dave
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: john bohan on November 16, 2019, 02:36:09 AM
Haines guns are my favorites, I wished mine looked like these photos.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: kentuckyrifleman on November 21, 2019, 07:24:11 AM
Impressive!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: bama on November 21, 2019, 03:17:27 PM
Top notch work that you should be proud of. Thanks for sharing your work and the progress photos. It is always interesting to see how other builder's go about their work, I always pick up a pointer or two. Again great carving and rifle.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: t.caster on November 21, 2019, 05:30:24 PM
I think you really nailed it! Carving is crisp, clean and flowing smoothly. I don't think any will recognize it as a "kit gun" now!
Great work!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: heinz on November 21, 2019, 05:41:21 PM
Well done!
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: bob hertrich on November 21, 2019, 06:22:21 PM
Very, very nice.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: smart dog on November 26, 2019, 02:07:11 AM
Hi,
Almost done.  I need to polish and tune the lock, clean up and finish the screws, finish the barrel, and finish polishing the trigger guard.  The stock also needs a little more finish and possibly a light rubbing back.  I'll post a full series of images when it is done.

dave
(https://i.imgur.com/NFtwbd0.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/FtVyMyF.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PZ6hpAi.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/m0nWC3T.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Hey5F9W.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/98FNXfI.jpg)
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: rich pierce on November 26, 2019, 05:26:56 AM
Mighty fine. You might be hard pressed to let that one out the door.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Marcruger on November 26, 2019, 05:36:29 AM
Lovely work.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Mike Lyons on November 26, 2019, 07:33:31 AM
I really like it.  That’s a beautiful rifle. 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos
Post by: Mark Elliott on November 26, 2019, 03:10:06 PM
I love the details in your modeling.   It is masterful. 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: smart dog on December 22, 2019, 08:07:41 PM
Hi,
Here is the finished rifle.  I will rub in some wax after Xmas as soon as the finish is fully cured.  The finish was a struggle due to the roller coaster temperatures and humidity.  I used sandpaper to smooth the wood before staining but the final step was a light scraping. The slight texture from that is evident in some of the photos.  The barrel is just degreased and coated with instant bluing.  Then I rub it back to a tarnish.  I installed a front sight but not the rear.  The owner wants to install it where he can see it best.  It came out pretty nicely and looks credible as a Haines product.

dave   

(https://i.ibb.co/Pr5bX08/finished-rifle-1.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3T086QH)

(https://i.ibb.co/LRMhnWw/finished-rifle-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PjRzwnp)

(https://i.ibb.co/MGpxr17/finished-rifle-3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/9V2k64W)

(https://i.ibb.co/nkKCHrG/finished-rifle-4.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bdGJS10)

(https://i.ibb.co/Gc6d2fb/finished-rifle-5.jpg) (https://ibb.co/m6jRqrM)

(https://i.ibb.co/7VXqSz5/finished-rifle-6.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3W7nTsq)

(https://i.ibb.co/hLgycwy/finished-rifle-7.jpg) (https://ibb.co/RYg9Nd9)

(https://i.ibb.co/mvFKNLb/finished-rifle-8.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TKqGWVY)

(https://i.ibb.co/gjr3c15/finished-rifle-9.jpg) (https://ibb.co/p01xkDt)

(https://i.ibb.co/9ywYM7C/finished-rifle-10.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gtvgnxB)

(https://i.ibb.co/nQQL4ky/finished-rifle-11.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KVVrByg)

(https://i.ibb.co/X5HF4Dn/finished-rifle-12.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pKq4PQH)
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: rich pierce on December 22, 2019, 08:25:48 PM
That’s a real delight.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Mike Lyons on December 22, 2019, 09:49:09 PM
That is a fine rifle.  Thanks for posting your progress. 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Tim Crosby on December 22, 2019, 10:07:57 PM
 Beautify crafted Dave. "It came out pretty nicely and looks credible as a Haines product." and Extremely humble.

   Tim
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Craig Wilcox on December 22, 2019, 10:38:57 PM
Loving your work, Dave, great stuff.

At first glance, your toe piece looked like a weird snowman!  Took a minute to see it correctly - LOL~
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: SBachner on December 23, 2019, 12:08:29 AM
Loving your work, Dave, great stuff.

At first glance, your toe piece looked like a weird snowman!  Took a minute to see it correctly - LOL~

Reminds me of the Ghost of Christmas Past from Disney's "Christmas Carol".
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: smart dog on December 23, 2019, 12:47:25 AM
Hi Guys,
Thanks for looking and commenting. As I posted previously, it was a Chambers Isaac Haines kit.  I am not fond of doing kits because they rarely fit well with my objectives.  In this case, the owner wanted the decoration to copy RCA #81, which is the rifle I think the kit was loosely based on.  However, I can't build an accurate copy because the barrel is way too short, the lock is too large (a standard Siler would be perfect), and the side plate is too large. Because those components were partly machine inlet, I really could not change any dimensions.  Despite that, the project was a lot of fun and I learned quite a bit about Haines' style, which was rewarding.  I think the owner will be happy as the rifle is exactly what he requested of me.  I aim to please. 

The toe plate is funky.  It is inspired by but not a copy of a plate on one of Haines' earlier rifles. The engraving is from that rifle as well.  Maybe Haines meant to do a busty liberty cap lady but had second thoughts and turned it into something else. 

Thanks for looking folks,

dave 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: alacran on December 23, 2019, 01:31:12 AM
Dave, you did an outstanding job on what I consider to be very challenging carvings. I don't believe any of them could be considered simple. I also like your finished stain. Your client is going to have a Merry Merry Christmas.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: TommyG on December 23, 2019, 02:41:06 AM
Beautifully done.  I really like all the small details that you executed.  Great work Dave.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Rolf on December 23, 2019, 12:13:04 PM
Beautiful rifle, elegant carving.

Best regards
Rolf
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: hawkeye on December 23, 2019, 04:16:07 PM
Beautiful work, very well executed
I love it
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: bama on December 23, 2019, 07:33:10 PM
Dave as the others have said this is a fine rifle and very well executed workmanship. I enjoy building from a blank as much as anybody but I do put together a few of the better kit rifles and this particular kit is one of the best out on the market and has been for many years. You can and have built a spectacular rifle and it just goes to prove what can be done with a good set of parts if one has the knowledge and skills, which you definitely have.

Great Job and thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: D. Taylor Sapergia on December 23, 2019, 07:55:48 PM
The praises of all these contributors is well deserved Dave.  Not having seen the Haines rifle personally or in colour in print, I cannot attest to the colour you have presented, but it is very charming.  The rifle certainly compliments Mr. Haines work...appears to have come from the same shop.  Nicely done.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Daryl on December 23, 2019, 08:59:49 PM
Absolutely lovely. I do like seeing new rifles, new.
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: Ed Wenger on December 24, 2019, 04:08:47 AM
Good job, Dave..., looks great!!



         Ed
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: smart dog on December 30, 2019, 04:00:33 PM
Hi,
Thanks for looking and commenting. It was more fun than I originally thought and I learned a bit about Haines from doing it.  He was a great maker and carver who seems to have held on to classic European style and quality longer and better than his contemporaries.  I wish we knew more about him.  I wonder to whom he apprenticed?  I wish the barrel was 45", and the lock and side plate smaller and more like the original gun.  There is only so much you can do with a kit.  Thanks again.

dave 
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: flehto on December 30, 2019, 05:31:39 PM
Impeccable workmanship and carving....you captured the "flavor" of Haines. Did you reduce  the size of the cheekpiece and slightly relocate it?.....anyways it allowed the carving, behind and in front of the cheekpiece just  the right amount of space for the carving. A fine LR.....Fred
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: A.Merrill on December 31, 2019, 02:40:48 AM
   Great craftsmanship.  I hope mine turns out half that nice.   Al
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: David Price on December 31, 2019, 03:04:12 AM
Dave,

Another great job.  Thanks for showing it.

David Price
Title: Re: RCA 81 Carving Updated With More Photos FINISHED
Post by: kentuckyrifleman on January 01, 2020, 03:49:23 PM
One of the prettiest rifles I've seen in a long time. Love the wood.