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General discussion => Gun Building => Topic started by: Bill Raby on May 09, 2020, 12:41:48 AM

Title: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 09, 2020, 12:41:48 AM
   Here is the start of a new video series. This one is a 4 bore English rifle. I know, I am nuts and my arm is going to fly off. Its OK. I am not going to load 20 drams of powder for every shot. Problem is that I read to much. I always have. So I will blame this one on the old adventure stories. I have wanted one of these since I was about 16 years old.

   This one is going to be fairly complicated. The barrel is so massively oversized that nothing is going to fit without a bit of work. Some parts will need to be modified and a some made from scratch. This one may also be of some interest to those have you that like the Hawken rifles. The style is a lot different, but there are many similarities in how it goes together. This one should be fun. I hope that you enjoy it. Please do not hesitate with any comments or questions. The description will include and index of what is in each video. The plan is to post a half hour video every weekend.

Here is Part 1

https://youtu.be/JRbZfcm6igg
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: redheart on May 09, 2020, 01:42:35 AM
Now by Gawd, that's gonna be a true manly man's rifle. I hope you have a good chiropractor Bill. :o ;)
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: flatsguide on May 09, 2020, 02:08:12 AM
Good luck with this project! I remember when I was a boy reading Selous’s adventures in Africa hunting with a 4 bore, wild stuff. I fired an English 4 bore smooth bore cap lock when I was about 14 quite the surprise. I don’t remember how many ounces of shot I loaded but when I pointed it up at a tree and fired it cleared a large hole in the canopy. 
Looking forward to your videos.
Cheers Richard
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: smylee grouch on May 09, 2020, 02:39:09 AM
Will this creature have any cross bolts or other recoil lugs of sort in it?
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on May 09, 2020, 03:03:34 AM
16 drams was the full load for the ctg. guns, with a round ball.
12 drams with a round ball broke W.W.Greener's recoil machine which only went up to 200 pounds.
16 drams is 436.8gr.
12 drams, which broke the machine at well over 200 pounds is a mere 327.6gr.
The ball weight in pure lead is 1/4 pound at 1,750gr.  That being 1.052" in diameter and of pure lead.

Now, this is roughly 50 to 60pound recoil from a 14 bore rifle.

(https://i.ibb.co/MGVvqCk/cid-98-E0-D5-BF-F282-463-E-A8-CD-91-EBEAE69-D22local-zps47b38888.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KLqPCrx)
(https://i.ibb.co/wp8LB9K/cid-60-C1-E34-C-7-AC8-4-D74-9-E25-C4-D1204-C0-E3-Alocal-zpse9583bea.jpg) (https://ibb.co/GCGJnKV)

Good luck with that, Bill. Looking forward to the results.

 
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: smylee grouch on May 09, 2020, 03:28:43 AM
Building a horizontal volcano. If you shoot full power loads you will have to notify the US Geological labs.  ;D One of my old gunsmith buds has built two and maybe three of them. Should be interesting!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Mike Brooks on May 09, 2020, 03:08:33 PM
I have a friend that shoots 4 bores. Google Mark Quade and watch his video. Not something I'd pull the trigger on. ???
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Deuce50 on May 10, 2020, 01:05:48 AM
The deer won't know what hit them!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: redheart on May 10, 2020, 05:38:51 PM
The deer won't know what hit them!
There won't be enough of the deer left to know anything! ;D
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Canuck Bob on May 10, 2020, 06:34:02 PM
Great video, very informative.  I was deeply influenced by J. R. Hunter's book Hunter about his African exploits.  It transformed me from a plinker to a big game hunter. 

What do you estimate the final weight will be?  You should have no clearance issues with dovetails in the barrel ;-) .
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: OLUT on May 10, 2020, 07:19:42 PM
Bill, for your ramrod, consider a steel one. That's what is on my original old 4 bore percussion rifle; it works well and allows smaller ramrod pipes. I'm too much of a wimp to fire a 4 ounce ball out of mine, but with blank loads, it sure makes a major boom and lots of smoke. I'm interested in following your videos as this is a unique build. Have you decided on express sights for this monster, or?  As an aside, I noticed your Green EDGEWOOD T-shirt. Is this the same as the old Edgewood Arsenal that was south of Aberdeen Proving Grounds? If so, I spent most of my army days in the mid-1960's there in the Toxicology Division of AEHA
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: smylee grouch on May 10, 2020, 07:33:47 PM
I,m thinking that if I fired a full bore load out of this piece I would want to blow my nose before I shot just to keep the snot off the stock.  ;D  :)
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 10, 2020, 07:53:47 PM
Bill, for your ramrod, consider a steel one. That's what is on my original old 4 bore percussion rifle; it works well and allows smaller ramrod pipes. I'm too much of a wimp to fire a 4 ounce ball out of mine, but with blank loads, it sure makes a major boom and lots of smoke. I'm interested in following your videos as this is a unique build. Have you decided on express sights for this monster, or?  As an aside, I noticed your Green EDGEWOOD T-shirt. Is this the same as the old Edgewood Arsenal that was south of Aberdeen Proving Grounds? If so, I spent most of my army days in the mid-1960's there in the Toxicology Division of AEHA

   I am going to go with an ebony ramrod. It is an excellent ramrod wood and was used often on this and similar kinds of rifles. Its an African hunting gun so why not use African wood? It will look really cool also. I am sure steel would be a bit more practical but it does not really matter. I am not likely to ever actually use the ramrod. I always use a steel range rod instead. I don't know anything EDGEWOOD. I just have the t-shirt.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 16, 2020, 02:24:30 AM
Here is Part 2

https://youtu.be/bUnh9uYPDr8
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Craig Wilcox on May 16, 2020, 02:36:42 AM
Love your "Bo Jangles" intro!  This will be a fascinating build - gonna follow you all the way.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on May 16, 2020, 05:22:39 AM
Crown looks fairly decent, Bill. Well done.  Good tool. I'd likely have used one of the 3/8" drive stones with paper on it for the initial chamfer. Your tool worked just fine, though.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 16, 2020, 05:32:34 AM
I just wish I would have thought of putting it in a drill BEFORE I finished it.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on May 16, 2020, 05:35:59 AM
Only makes it go more quickly - mistakes, too.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 23, 2020, 01:43:46 AM
Here is Part 3

https://youtu.be/WNcu-Vh_1h8
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Deuce50 on May 23, 2020, 02:14:10 AM
Great quality video as usual Bill.  Very instructional!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 29, 2020, 11:14:52 PM
Here is Part 4

https://youtu.be/IYHpt7Zm8Ig
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 31, 2020, 03:04:15 AM
Here is Part 4.5

No building in this one. This is just talking about the tools that I use for a while.

https://youtu.be/zZTat4QMJPk
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 06, 2020, 03:46:00 AM
Here is Part 5

https://youtu.be/znmjt8_tipU
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Blacksmoke on June 06, 2020, 07:28:55 PM
Bill: Are you NUTS!  But worthy of comment.  I had an acquaintance that built a 4 bore double that fired conical projectiles ahead of 400 gr. of black.  The gun weighed 17 lbs. but it would knock you down if you weren't firmly planted.  He shot an African Buffalo with it.  Good Luck,     Hugh Toenjes
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bob Roller on June 06, 2020, 08:31:40 PM
Bill: Are you NUTS!  But worthy of comment.  I had an acquaintance that built a 4 bore double that fired conical projectiles ahead of 400 gr. of black.  The gun weighed 17 lbs. but it would knock you down if yoareu weren't firmly planted.  He shot an African Buffalo with it.  Good Luck,     Hugh Toenjes
This reminds of a line from a movie about some kid that has walked from North Africa to
about as far South as he could go and he found an aunt that took him in and asked him'
if he wanted and he said, "an old fashion elephant gun and a quart of whiskey".The startled
aunt asked him what on earth for? The kid said he'd drink the whisky down below the bottom
of the label to give him nerve to fire the elephant gun.Maybe the booze and the 4 bore rifle
are related ;D.

Bob Roller

Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 07, 2020, 05:02:15 AM
   Everyone seems to think that the idea of shooting this rifle is nuts. But the fact is that people DID use these things on a regular basis.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on June 07, 2020, 06:29:44 AM
Absolutely, they did. Francis Selous used a shortened 4 bore Dutch Fouler for a while in securing ivory for the trade.
He wrote, after switching to nitro-express rounds, that he wished he'd "never shot that accursed 4 bore. It gave me a such a flinch
I could never shake it" (or words to that effect) he added about it ruining his accuracy for life due to the flinch.
So- well, it's up to you, Bill. ;) Selous had a "kaffir" loading it for him. 2 hands-full of powder (small hands, maybe?) & a round ball, of course.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 12, 2020, 11:48:27 PM
Here is Part 6

https://youtu.be/gnZ2XnsSIoA
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 19, 2020, 01:16:29 PM
https://youtu.be/UTFwSFecGGA
https://youtu.be/3nFe8p7HIgU

   The only way to get the videos out on time every week is to work ahead a bit and have several of them saved up. That way when it takes a few weeks to get one finished or I get stuck on house projects for a while, I have some ready to go. It seemed like kind of a waste to have all these videos just stuck on the computer waiting for their turn so I decided to post them on Patreon. So now the Patreon members don't have to wait until next week for the next video. I will post them there as soon as they are done with the editing then move one over to the regular You Tube every week. All of the videos will be coming out on You Tube on the regular schedule, but the Patreon members can watch everything that is done a bit early. As of right now I am up to Part 18. It takes a few hours to upload each one so it will take a week or so to get them all up there. Right now Part 8 is already posted to Patreon and Part 9 will be on there this evening. Maybe I can get Part 10 later tonight. The rest will be coming over the next few days. I hope that you like them!

Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: ingramcl on June 21, 2020, 05:36:11 PM
   Everyone seems to think that the idea of shooting this rifle is nuts. But the fact is that people DID use these things on a regular basis.

You are talking about a group of people in this day and age that made the .223 the most popular round in our hemisphere. That is a tic tac compared to a real gun. Our grandparents carried a 30-06 to war. Can you imagine firing 300 rounds out of an M1 garand at the advancing Japanese over the course of 12 hours? The older generations shot those guns business as usual because it is what they had. It is what they knew. Guns like this build were a status symbol. Wealthy brits would go to Africa on Safari back when they thought dinosaurs might be found there. They wanted to be prepared.

My dad did work on a 4 bore. I think it was a double rifle. He has done gunsmithing most of my life, on the side. He has also followed your builds and showed me a couple of your videos, back when I was collecting components for mine. He did a .62 caliber off the same set of plans you are using now. He is a little technologically impaired and was asking how to get in contact with you, send pictures of it. I directed him here. If he can figure out a forum, he will likely be along shortly.

Great builds and information from you Bill. I tend to binge watch your videos every few months. Keep it up!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on June 22, 2020, 03:13:54 AM
Piece of cake, except for the 4 bore. (the shooting part, not the scenario)
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 26, 2020, 12:41:46 PM
Here is Part 8

https://youtu.be/fQ5qllBLZ98
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Deuce50 on June 26, 2020, 07:18:04 PM
Good work Bill!  Your videos are catching up to where I'm at.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: WadePatton on June 26, 2020, 10:46:20 PM
I always laugh at the fear of firing a big bore because you never have to fire a full-house load.

Of course plinking with a 4oz ball is more than many folks could stand and would still take a few grains to keep the ball from landing at your feet.

 ;D

looks like good fun to me, because I'd not be hunting with one. Unless I was on the Dark Continent.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 26, 2020, 11:26:12 PM
Good work Bill!  Your videos are catching up to where I'm at.

   I'm posting the videos on Patreon as I get them finished. Up to Part 18 on there now.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Keithbatt on June 27, 2020, 03:25:59 AM
New subscriber here for you on YouTube.  I’m slowly plodding along with a 2 Bore project. 

Keith
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 27, 2020, 05:50:02 AM
New subscriber here for you on YouTube.  I’m slowly plodding along with a 2 Bore project. 

Keith

   That would have even more complications than a 4 bore! How much is that thing going to weigh?
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Keithbatt on June 28, 2020, 03:31:56 AM
Not sure yet, and yes it has it’s challenges.  The width is difficult.  The breech tapers to allow the wrist to get thin enough.  All compromises.

Keith
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: ingramcl on June 28, 2020, 05:42:49 PM
New subscriber here for you on YouTube.  I’m slowly plodding along with a 2 Bore project. 

Keith

   That would have even more complications than a 4 bore! How much is that thing going to weigh?
Those are a couple interesting projects. In my mind, I am thinking it would be a 25 or 30lb gun. Can you imagine hiking around africa with a gun that weighs that much? haha
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 28, 2020, 08:25:27 PM
The guys that owned those guns could afford to pay someone else to carry them.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: WadePatton on June 29, 2020, 03:55:22 PM
The guys that owned those guns could afford to pay someone else to carry them.

Exactly, and another guy to carry a few balls and a keg of powder.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on July 02, 2020, 05:26:11 AM
Exactly, and another guy to carry a few balls and a keg of powder.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D Wade!  That's about it, I guess.

Historically, there were no 2 bores that I know of, aside from wall pieces, perhaps & the few modern made ones by Steve Z and Colin S.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 02, 2020, 08:21:01 AM
   What I saw was that there were six 2 bores made in the 19th century. One of them was referred to as being brought to Africa. It did not see anything about it actually being used for hunting. Maybe it was, maybe not. I don't see how anyone would know how many were made so who knows if that is accurate or not. I think it is safe to say that the 2 bore rifles are mostly a modern creation with only a slight basis in history.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on July 02, 2020, 07:41:13 PM
Interesting, Bill. Most people quote Samuel Baker's Baby as being a 2 bore, but that one shot a 3oz. round ball
 (according to Baker's own words in Forsyth's book), so was likely a 4 or 5 bore.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 03, 2020, 06:38:42 PM
Here is Part 9

https://youtu.be/gfOgU5B8aAo
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 10, 2020, 07:55:24 PM
Here is Part 10

https://youtu.be/UTCKagkVL4Q
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 17, 2020, 12:51:03 PM
Here is Part 11

https://youtu.be/DG66CbvcrII
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 24, 2020, 01:06:21 PM
Here is Part 12

https://youtu.be/4bki7paxgfM
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on July 31, 2020, 01:12:58 PM
Here is Part 13

https://youtu.be/5lhTGP_H8H8
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Coastal Plain on July 31, 2020, 09:25:40 PM
I've been following your builds since you first posted the French Trade Gun videos.  As I get ready to take on my first build in the coming year, its been good to see someone go through the entire process on different styles of gun.  They have definitely given me a little bit more confidence before I dive in. 
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 01, 2020, 12:26:22 AM
There is nothing hard about doing this stuff. The rick is to pay attention and take your time.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 07, 2020, 05:26:54 PM
Here is Part 14

https://youtu.be/FjHzMHRVJ5I
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on August 10, 2020, 06:57:08 PM
Bill, the top gun is a 6 bore 1/2 stock - for dimensions & layout, etc. I have noticed the flintlock 1/2 stocks
generally had 2 barrel tenons/keys, while the 1/2 stocked percussion English guns had but one. You likely knew that.

(https://i.ibb.co/2n1KfMX/halfstockandfullstock-Engoish-Rifles.jpg) (https://ibb.co/5Mgcfjq)
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bob McBride on August 10, 2020, 07:01:08 PM
Based on Daryl's pic Bill you may not be too far out with your end cap.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 11, 2020, 03:52:28 AM
   I looked at a lot of pictures of old guns. The proportions that I went with are not normal, but they are historic examples. The proportions of the 4 bores are all over the place. Seems likely that every one was built to order in the 19th century. I am trying to stay historically accurate, but making it something that I can actually shoot is going to take precedence. What finally decided it was when I shot one of the larger modern elephant rifles holding it with the same hand position that would be used with a short fore end. Much harder to control that way. The 4 bore will have over triple the recoil of that modern rifle.

   This rifle is definitely a challenging one. I am working on inletting the entry pipe right now. And the the intros. I am spending way to much time on the artwork for those, and having way too much fun with them!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on August 11, 2020, 07:10:44 PM
There will be a LOT of push, that's for sure. Thankfully, the velocity of recoil will be lower than with modern guns,
however when discussing recoil of over 200 pounds, that is a rather moot point.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 21, 2020, 12:48:14 PM
Here is Part 15

https://youtu.be/IjEVJ53UW80
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 21, 2020, 12:49:17 PM
Here is Part 16

https://youtu.be/eEAm8Dl85yY
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on August 28, 2020, 12:43:36 PM
Here is Part 17

https://youtu.be/n9EUJoWxWJo
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on September 04, 2020, 03:21:42 PM
Here is Part 18

https://youtu.be/g7DQseVHbdU
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on September 12, 2020, 02:29:58 AM
Here is Part 19

https://youtu.be/_-PoLQgJjKs
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on September 18, 2020, 02:42:57 PM
Here is Part 20

https://youtu.be/sEY79oba0Mc
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Craig Wilcox on September 19, 2020, 07:24:41 PM
Really enjoying the build-along.  You ae approaching each step in a carefully planned manner, and giving reasons for doing as you do.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on September 25, 2020, 02:43:25 PM
Here is Part 21

https://youtu.be/uVR64OcoOMY
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: sz on September 27, 2020, 02:11:57 AM
I have made a few of them. They do kick. Here is a man firing one.  He is shooting a light load (no I am not kidding) and the barrel fires a "true 4 " so the ball is 1750 grains.

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4285/34817540434_96d4e3a62c_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/V3GZKh)4 bore in action (https://flic.kr/p/V3GZKh) by Steve Zihn (https://www.flickr.com/photos/156296479@N08/), on Flickr
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bob Roller on September 27, 2020, 02:38:12 AM
An old fashioned big boom elephant gun for sure.
On my first trip to Friendship in 1954 I heard a
powerful rifle being fired across the road from the
foot bridge that crossed Laughery Creek.There
were several men shooting a 600 double rifle
at big carp that were near the bridge.I was offered
the chance to fire it and turned it down.That gun
packed an abrupt and hard kick and to lean over the
rail on the bridge and fire down into the creek to me
was a bad idea.Fishing with a 600,I will pass thank you.
Bob Roller
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on September 27, 2020, 02:58:18 AM
Detached retinas I do not need.
The stuff I do shoot, kicks plenty enough to satisfy those yearnings for being abused, LOL.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bob Roller on September 27, 2020, 03:45:19 AM
Detached retinas I do not need.
The stuff I do shoot, kicks plenty enough to satisfy those yearnings for being abused, LOL.

I was not thinking of detached retinas but was thinking in terms of a cracked
collar bone 180 miles from home and not having my own car.My own yearnings
for personal abuse is to eat my own cooking and were satisfied 6 weeks ago
when my wife fell and cracked 3 ribs.
Recoil induced detached retinas,Hoodathunkit? Not me----never.
Bob Roller
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on September 27, 2020, 07:09:13 AM
   It is not very likely that I will ever actually go elephant hunting. I do not need to load it with 500+ grains of powder for every shot. This is all just for fun.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on September 27, 2020, 09:43:45 AM
   It is not very likely that I will ever actually go elephant hunting. I do not need to load it with 500+ grains of powder for every shot. This is all just for fun.
10 drams is merely a 273.5gr. load. 
Full charge, at least for the ctg. version is 16 drams, considerably higher than that.
Interesting choice for a "Sporting Rifle", Bill.
Steve Zihnn has considerable experience with these, along with 2 bores.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 02, 2020, 02:43:22 PM
Here is Part 22

https://youtu.be/bWLVQKBijks
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: snapper on October 02, 2020, 03:16:28 PM
Bill

Enjoyed the video.   Looking forward to when you get it done and actually shoot it.

Fleener
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 03, 2020, 03:14:01 AM
So am I.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: LilysDad on October 06, 2020, 02:20:57 PM
Where do you find that cutter lube stick seen in your videos?
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 07, 2020, 03:05:43 AM
You can get that from Rio Grande
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 09, 2020, 01:58:40 PM
Here is Part 23

https://youtu.be/rIVgAZBO6dQ
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 16, 2020, 02:40:54 PM
Here is Part 24

https://youtu.be/Zwz6qWwJTCk
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 23, 2020, 02:35:47 PM
Here is Part 25

https://youtu.be/Lhu2MJRVag8
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on October 30, 2020, 02:14:16 PM
Here is Part 26

https://youtu.be/HtXKnN7mpEg
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: snapper on October 30, 2020, 02:57:00 PM
Bill.   Very vice.    Cant wait to see you shoot it.

Thanks

Fleener
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on November 06, 2020, 03:19:28 PM
Here is Part 27

https://youtu.be/2QNQY4wEpso
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Herb on November 09, 2020, 07:16:17 AM
I enjoy your videos and have learned some things I can use.  Thanks!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on November 14, 2020, 04:16:14 AM
Here is Part 28

https://youtu.be/LEWa5kPla5k
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on November 23, 2020, 04:48:33 AM
Here is Part 29

https://youtu.be/tLQ7CxG5gQw
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on November 28, 2020, 02:58:19 AM
Here is Part 30

https://youtu.be/X_fx14N9Myg
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 04, 2020, 02:48:05 PM
Here is Part 31

https://youtu.be/LGM0t9dGVVw
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: snapper on December 04, 2020, 03:44:23 PM
Billy just got done watching the latest video.   Well done.

In 2021 we need to meet in person and shoot that rifle.

Fleener
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 05, 2020, 02:20:39 AM
Sounds like a plan.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 11, 2020, 04:36:17 PM
Here is Part 32

https://youtu.be/E61q0z332SI
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on December 11, 2020, 09:47:45 PM
Thanks Bill. Champing at the bit now, for finishing and shooting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Curtis on December 13, 2020, 09:31:20 AM
Bill,

Finally got enough internet bandwidth to watch some of the videos.  Cool stuff!  I agree with Snapper, would like to shoot that puppy in 2021!


Curtis
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 18, 2020, 10:17:36 PM
Here is Part 33

https://youtu.be/b9rDcO1NOXM
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 25, 2020, 02:57:24 AM
Hear is Part 34. Normally I do these Friday morning, but I will do it a day early this time.

https://youtu.be/E2qN7PG_QR8
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 25, 2020, 07:12:14 PM
Here is Part 35. I put up an extra one this week for Christmas.

https://youtu.be/w70vC8vpIEs
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: snapper on December 25, 2020, 10:31:45 PM
Ah shoot you are going to make me watch the next one to see if you get the butt plate off.

Good job.

Liked the comment about the hot babe with tattoos.

Fleener
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 26, 2020, 07:41:38 AM
The butt plate does come off. But it was a bit of work.

I live with a good looking girl that used to be a tattoo artist. She still does it sometimes. Entirely covered in tattoos. I like it. But she don't like ti if I wake her up when she is trying to sleep.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on December 27, 2020, 09:36:30 AM
   I figured this project would stir up a bit of interest, but it has just gotten crazy. This is my gun. Not going up for sale. I wanted one of these since reading all those adventure stories when I was about 16 years old. I'm finally getting one. I have gotten a few offers to buy it already. Some of them have actually been for real money. No. Not selling.

   Talking to someone tonight that wants to buy it. Not selling. Sorry. So he wants me to build one for him. I don't do any custom work. Sorry. Told him I will probably make another one sometime but I got a few other projects I want to do first so it will probably be a few years. I have an actual job so it takes me a while to finish one of these. Well not right now. I got laid off from the virus nonsense about a week ago but I will get another job after holidays. No big deal. Good story on that one. Anyway, I will likely make another one some time and put it up for sale when it is finished. He don't want to wait a few years and offered me $35,000 for it right now. It is not even finished yet. Told him no. Not for sale. Sorry. Starting to think that I might have to build another one sooner than I planned on.

Any of you other guys ever run into this sort of thing?
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: snapper on December 27, 2020, 06:06:52 PM
Sell it and start making one for you ASAP.  Take a few weeks off working and finish the two rifles

Fleener
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Woodland on December 27, 2020, 07:14:02 PM
I'm with Snapper.  Your YouTube presence has drawn someone willing to pay you fair money in exchange for your work.  I say sell it.  Use the money to build yourself one.  Who knows, you may just turn your hobby into a career and never have to get another job.  I'm saying this as a guy under 40 who owns 3 company's.  All of them were hobbies that have turned into VERY profitable businesses.  My "job" is to drive around and cash the checks, praise my employees and enjoy my "hobby"!  It's worth considering.

Jon
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 01, 2021, 08:15:59 PM
Here is Part 36

https://youtu.be/22eYHsdsScs
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 08, 2021, 03:35:59 PM
Here is Part 37

https://youtu.be/DJms1HJMkQI
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Sand Watcher on January 09, 2021, 10:08:13 PM
Thank you for making this video series, Bill! It’s probably the best-documented custom build I’ve ever seen.

I came across this a little while ago, and have been watching your posts out of order. So, maybe I’ve missed it, or haven’t gotten there yet, but what is the twist of the barrel, and where did you get it? ...or more specifically, where can I get one? :)

I once built a little 4-gauge smoothbore from Rayl that I plink around with quite a bit, but I’d love to make one with rifling.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 10, 2021, 03:50:30 AM
Its 104 inch twist. I got it from Oregon Barrel.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Sand Watcher on January 14, 2021, 02:08:13 AM
Thank you, Bill! I just placed an order, after talking with Suzy yesterday. They seem pretty good to work with. She did say to expect a 9-month turnaround due to production limitations.  I wound up asking for a 32 inch. It will be interesting to see whether those extra few inches affect practicality or performance.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Daryl on January 14, 2021, 02:34:45 AM
Sandwatcher - interesting you got the longer barrel. Forsyth noted the larger bored guns did quite
 well with 24" to 26" bls. but he was talking double rifles.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Sand Watcher on January 14, 2021, 03:50:01 AM
Was Forsyth saying that the shorter barrel was perfectly adequate for  his needs, or that a longer barrel would be a detriment?

In a pinch I could always shorten it, but I got the longer barrel for a couple of reasons. One is to eventually add more data points to the limited body of knowledge surrounding this class of guns. Another is to avoid issues I have with my 20” 4-gauge, which are twofold... For one, the barrel (at 6-7 lbs) is too light, meaning excessive recoil. Secondly, it’s too short to get high muzzle velocities (and maybe to some extent accuracy).
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 14, 2021, 05:19:18 AM
   I got a 29 inch barrel. I think 32 inch would be fine. These barrels are pretty heavy. Mine is a bit over 12 pounds. My only complaint is that the gun has a lot of weight on the muzzle. I suppose there is not much way around that.  Barrel is 1 3/4 inch at breech tapering to 1 1/2 inch at muzzle. If I were to get another I think I would go for 1 7/8 inch at breech and 1 1/2 inch at muzzle. A little more weight on the breech end would be nice. But that would complicate things a bit more than they already are. I have gotten a few people offering me enormous amounts of money for the next one I build so I will probably do one more sometime and let them fight over it.

   This one is a bit of a challenge, but all is going well so far. There is a good amount of stuff that I had to figure out as I go. Good part is that all the videos will on You Tube by the time you get a barrel. Maybe there will be a few things in there to help you out.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Sand Watcher on January 14, 2021, 07:19:56 AM
Yes, I think your video series will be an important reference when I get around to doing my build. I’ve been wanting something like this for a while, but thought it would too hard/expensive to have a barrel made for it. What I will probably do when I get the barrel is drive it over to ToW (I live fairly close) and rummage through their locks to find one that fits easily. With the patent breech, I’m going to need to be a little more careful about where the vent lands.

If you are concerned about balance, maybe you could bed some lead slugs or a mercury filled tube into the stock (kind of like shotgunners do)? You’d have to find a way to do it without compromising the strength too much, or your sense of PC. That would also help absorb a little bit of recoil.

Fortunately, with a PRB, the heaviest projectile you’ll be shooting will probably be only 3.3 ounces. Maybe 3.2 ounces with a thick patch (plus the weight of the powder).
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 15, 2021, 03:00:09 PM
Here is Part 38

https://youtu.be/sfjvkBlt4us
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 22, 2021, 06:58:30 PM
Here is Part 39

https://youtu.be/SWKmeOodg0s
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Sand Watcher on January 23, 2021, 09:45:50 PM
Bill, have you worked out your patch/ball combination for this gun yet? I have a casting setup for making .981 caliber round balls. If you want to see how that size performs before getting your own custom mold, PM me an address and I’ll ship some to you.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 24, 2021, 07:20:56 AM
I already have a mold for .975 balls. That seems to work pretty good. Of course I have not fired yet so I am not sure what patch thickness I will settle on. Looking for something that will be easy to load. These things are meant for shooting very large targets at very short ranges and I doubt it will ever be fired from a bench so accuracy is not much of a concern.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on January 29, 2021, 03:51:01 PM
Here is Part 40

https://youtu.be/ph1wp-2Czog
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on February 05, 2021, 05:38:55 PM
Here is Part 41

https://youtu.be/JJbjo-7_YdI
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on February 12, 2021, 06:34:45 PM
Here is Part 42

https://youtu.be/1dqLswFGNfk
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on February 19, 2021, 07:15:39 PM
Here is Part 43

https://youtu.be/BGkmKHhACOo
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on February 26, 2021, 07:41:10 PM
Here is Part 44

https://youtu.be/VLqE-AInCIc
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on March 05, 2021, 06:36:14 PM
Here is Part 45

https://youtu.be/RWZa7DelwdE
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on March 12, 2021, 08:19:04 PM
Here is Part 46

https://youtu.be/3ykublGSTSs
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on March 19, 2021, 05:25:33 PM
Here is Part 47

https://youtu.be/wLOIO9pQba0
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on March 26, 2021, 04:51:54 PM
Here is Part 48

https://youtu.be/9ue5YDE3sfU
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 02, 2021, 05:44:52 PM
Here is Part 49

https://youtu.be/8MeWzgIaTIM
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Ron53 on April 05, 2021, 11:22:26 PM
Before my Dad passed away, he always set up as a vendor at the NMLRA shoots at Friendship.  I believe it was in 2007, I was visiting, and a friend of his (cannot remember the name!) had built a 4-bore wall gun replica...flintlock, of course.  It weighed 27 pounds, if I remember correctly.  I was offered the opportunity to shoot it, which I readily accepted!  I got to fire 2 rounds downrange, on the long range at Friendship.  On the second, with a charge of 500gr. Fg, I hit the 500 yard target.  It rang like a bell!  I was resting the rifle over an upturned pallet, while sitting on a log, to shoot it.  I still have the photos taken of that somewhere.  I need to go looking and find them!  The recoil was a little heavy, but 27 pounds of rifle absorbs a lot to it!  I found it a lot of fun to shoot.
Ron
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 06, 2021, 01:04:42 AM
This one is about 17 to 18 pounds.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Ron53 on April 06, 2021, 05:46:09 AM
The recoil will be "interesting", I'm sure!  But I sure would jump at a chance to shoot it!
Ron
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 06, 2021, 07:35:54 AM
Rifle Shoppe sells a kit to build a 4 bore wall gun

http://www.therifleshoppe.com/catalog_pages/english_arms/(727).htm
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 09, 2021, 05:13:47 PM
Here is Part 50

https://youtu.be/Mu7WFnlnCVI
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 16, 2021, 02:33:10 PM
Here is Part 51

https://youtu.be/JpCWbBJL4xU
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 23, 2021, 07:03:35 PM
Here is Part 52

https://youtu.be/qJWLKihxpkc
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on April 30, 2021, 05:18:53 PM
Here is Part 53

https://youtu.be/tt4ApPPK7Jo
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bsharp on April 30, 2021, 08:18:58 PM
Bill, not sure if this was covered or not.

I would leave clearance at the front of the butt plate tang surfaces and the rear of the breech plug tang.

In case the gun gets dropped on the butt plate, all the force will be driven into the tang.

Same affect on the rear of the breech plug tang. As the wood behind the barrel compresses the tang will be a wedge.

Just my thoughts!
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 01, 2021, 03:05:42 AM
I did think of that. The back of the tang and front of the butt plate are tapered on the bottom. That way any impact from recoil or dropping is going to push that part up slightly instead of straight into the wood. It is also fully bedded around the butt plate and tang. There is no direct wood to metal contact. So I think it should be fine.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 07, 2021, 05:14:55 PM
Here is Part 54

https://youtu.be/HBsqV3Yz4H0

Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 14, 2021, 01:09:53 PM
Here is Part 55

https://youtu.be/vO_3JhSjT4Y
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 21, 2021, 12:08:26 PM
Here is Part 56

https://youtu.be/8jD3sIDafKE
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on May 28, 2021, 09:30:00 PM
Here is Part 57

https://youtu.be/J9PJnK0r5Pg
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: LilysDad on May 29, 2021, 12:02:39 AM
The swirl pattern on each side of the tang; you might try reversing the pattern from top to bottom. So the pattern runs along the tang and then turns down. Just a thought.
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 04, 2021, 12:25:03 PM
Here is Part 58

https://youtu.be/iY4MnJs1tjI
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 11, 2021, 12:52:22 PM
Here is Part 59

https://youtu.be/24PNiSz-zeg
Title: Re: Building a 4 Bore English Rifle
Post by: Bill Raby on June 11, 2021, 01:14:40 PM
   You Tube removed 10 of my videos this week. They say the videos violate their firearm policy. Seems like the videos they don't like were randomly chosen. I did their appeal thing and am still waiting to see how that turns out. Maybe they will come back and maybe they won't. You Tube says that if I violate their policy again I get suspended for a week. After that I get kicked off for good. I will keep doing the videos the way that I have been. If I kicked off that might be the end of it.

   This rifle is finished now. I have fired it a few times. All the videos are done and posted on You Tube. All the videos are available to the Patreon members and I make the next one public every friday. Most of the videos they took off are ones that have not been made public yet. So there might be a few videos missing coming up. You Tube actually took down a video that is nothing but engraving. A lot of people seem to like the intros that I have been doing so I put together a video that is nothing but the intros. They removed that one for violating their firearm policy even though there is no firearm in the video. Its just the goofy intros.

   You Tube is still doing their appeal thing. They are wildly inconsistent in how they handle this sort of thing so who knows how it will turn out.