AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Accoutrements => Topic started by: Lucky R A on October 11, 2020, 11:50:07 PM
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A short time ago I posted a question on a lock with an unusual "pill" adaptation, and got some really good information. I am now posting some photos of the powder horn that accompanied the rifle into my shop. The rifle was used to harvest PA record book buck in 1830. The owner of the rifle was using a much older powder horn. The present owner is not interested in selling the horn, but would like to do some research into its origins. I thought some of you might recognize some features etc. that could help in that quest.
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Couldn't get photos to attach to original post, so will try this way
**merged them for you Lucky R A, Dennis**
(https://i.ibb.co/c8zpGgC/P1160120.jpg) (https://ibb.co/xgVcpCf)
(https://i.ibb.co/c6phkNV/P1160121.jpg) (https://ibb.co/By72cgF)
(https://i.ibb.co/mzcDBBB/P1160123.jpg) (https://ibb.co/j4r6555)
(https://i.ibb.co/XS6fwGP/P1160125.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZWvRZbr)
(https://i.ibb.co/dfqp9C9/P1160126.jpg) (https://ibb.co/grpW1q1)
(https://i.ibb.co/7bBq1jZ/P1160128.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0Q1xGm6)
(https://i.ibb.co/bdDw30R/P1160130.jpg) (https://ibb.co/KyS4GPz)
(https://i.ibb.co/hWBsdjc/P1160132.jpg) (https://ibb.co/gTSyWpd)
(https://i.ibb.co/XkTGRpj/P1160135.jpg) (https://ibb.co/yBJxj5d)
(https://i.ibb.co/fqkndQd/P1160138.jpg) (https://ibb.co/djPL474)
(https://i.ibb.co/tYxgt9G/P1160139.jpg) (https://ibb.co/3SM2qn3)
(https://i.ibb.co/LSS7JxC/P1160141.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6YYC1H4)
(https://i.ibb.co/k2My3SK/P1160143.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pjnPWL2)
(https://i.ibb.co/Sy44wjW/P1160144.jpg) (https://ibb.co/DWHHfJs)
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I love the flying bird motif. He looks full of !$@! and vinegar. Great horn!
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Wonderful engraving. Thank you for sharing it. God Bless, Marc
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Great horn, would easily fit in Dressler's book.
Tim
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I thought that I commented on this much earlier, but I don't see the post. I may have neglected to punch the 'Post' button. So, once more: this is a great, great horn and anyone would be proud to have it in their collection. Thank you for bringing it in to be admired by all, here. The cartoon-like carving and especially the faces bring to mind the 'Folky Carver' who produced some great horn carving. Without having it in hand it is difficult to make any valid judgment on who did it. There seems to be a 'Made by' headline, but did that individual (1) make and carve the horn? (2) Did he only make the horn with someone else doing the carving? (3) Did he do the carving only? It's a fine horn and if it knocked at my door, it would be shown in without any questions. Thanks again!
Dick
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It looks like the current owner of the horn has all the information he needs to research this horn and hopefully find the original owner, and possibly where this horn was used. He has the 1769-1770 date, the owner's name, Jeremiah Baker, the carver who apparently decorated the horn, J. B. Flower, and probably the city [if it can be read in better light] where either the horn was carved or the original owner lived. That's a lot more than most horns have on them, and should prove to be an enjoyable search to find out the past of this interesting horn. It's possible the original owner could have served in the Rev. War, so it's well worth researching. I wish we could make out the town name, appears to be "W _ _ wick" to me. Shelby Gallien
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Guessing Warwick Rhode Island
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Is it possible that it is Warwick PA? There is also a Warwick Twp. in PA. Fits better if the rifle was used to kill a record PA buck.
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Looks like there is a Warwick township in both Bucks and Lancaster counties. Somehow the horn looked New England to me but PA makes more sense with the story.
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Actually Warwick, R.I. is the most likely candidate. According to the owner, the horn likely belonged to an earlier relative of the guy who shot the big buck. There is some information that the original owner served on a sailing ship, which may account for some of the motifs. I doubt that a farmer in northwestern PA would be having dreams of Mermaids and palm trees.... Just saying...
I will pass the information on to the owner and perhaps he will reach out for further assistance. So far it has been an enjoyable project.
Incidentally the rifle was still loaded when it came into the shop. The pulled powder was brown and deteriorated, but still burned with authority...Ron
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With the calligraphy and some of the motifs, looks New England to me - Ive had several horns over the years with that script and all those were signed/dated and from Connecticut.
That said - it is never wise to be too dogmatic when attempting to attribute carved/engraved & decorated horns to a specific region. Genealogical research is probably the best bet to sort out a possible attribution. Regardless of location, it is a wonderful horn.
Bruce
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There was a John Flower who was born in Pa on Dec 18,1748, and moved to Warwick Twp., Lancaster Co., Pa. sometime between 1797 and 1809. He died in Warwick on February 23, 1809. That last part is strange since “February 23...” is inscribed on the Horn, but with the year “1770”.
And then there is Capt John Flower (1749-1825) who served in the Rev War and is buried in Marcus Hook, Delaware Co., Pa.
I could not find either of these names in Rhode Island.
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There is a Jeremiah Baker, married in Warwick, RI 28 Dec. 1778,
Might be a good starting point.
Also, the horn is noted as made by J.B. next line is:Flower'd possibly a contraction for flowered which may mean decorated...
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There is a Jeremiah Baker, married in Warwick, RI 28 Dec. 1778,
Might be a good starting point.
Also, the horn is noted as made by J.B. next line is:Flower'd possibly a contraction for flowered which may mean decorated...
I'd wondered about that 'd myself. You're definitely on to something as that 'apostrophe d' is not an errant mark. So it reads:
-A Powder HORN Made IN Warwick BY JB Flower'd IN BY ?W 1769 & 1770-
Can't make out the carver's first initial from the angle of the horn in the photos.
Love the carving of the guy with his frock coat, commoner's plain round top hat and legging ties just below the knees.
Just below the 'F' in the scrimed/engraved date month, there are (possibly) more initials? I see the faintly engraved initials 'WA'. A dot has substituted for the horizontal/intersecting line. Closer examination may reveal more.
Neat horn and what a treasure it is.
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Wonderful historic horn and could be a key to the location and identification of the carver. Emporium is a great place for this to visit. Glad you got to handle and share it Ron
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I forwarded the information that you guys have provided to the present caretaker of the horn. He sent me the following information that he received over the years. Hopefully this may add more depth to the story surrounding it
Ron,
About 10 years ago I found some info on a Jeremiah Baker and maybe two from that area of RI. One blurb said:
“Jeremiah Baker was in the Revolutionary War, and in the massacre of July 3, 1778, his buildings were burned and his family taken prisoners. They were soon rescued by him and found safety at Tioga Point, now Athens, Pennsylvania. In the fall of 1790, he settled in Canisteo, New York. Mr. Baker died about 1824, and Mrs. Baker in 1825.”
Judge Bill Todd has uncovered some info that Arthur Young’s father, Stephen, was in that area of NY around that time which maybe is when he obtained the horn.
Another Jeremiah Baker info I found has different dates when he and Mrs. Baker died:
Jeremiah Baker b.27dec1756 d.16may1846 m.28dec1778
Sarah Burton b.27feb1759 d25jan1841
And:
Jeremiah Baker d. 5/16/1838 widow Sarah
And:
Baker, Jeremiah, of Warwick, and Sarah Burton, of John, of Cranston; m. by Nehemiah Knight, Justice, Dec. 28, 1778
And:
Sarah BURTON-9940 was born in 1759. She died on 25 Jan 1846 in Scituate, Providence, Rhode Island. Sarah married Jeremiah BAKER-9939 on 28 Dec 1778 in Cranston, Providence, Rhode Island.
Fun stuff!
this horn and the carver.
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Do the tacks go all the way around? It looks like a couple are missing, if so are the shafts square or round? Also it looks like they the tacks go through/over the carving, could they have been added later? Hopefully the caretaker has written the given info up and has it with the horn. Makes you wonder how many others are floating around out there unseen.
Tim
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Beautiful horn!
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It looks like the horn may have lost its original plug, with enough damage occuring to trim the horn back a little and lose some of the basal carving. The "new" butt plug may have then been attached with those brass headed tacks...which appear to have a great patina [i.e. dirt and staining] around their outer edges. With all the information carved on the horn, it is a significant New England horn. Shelby Gallien