AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Accoutrements => Topic started by: Tanselman on July 17, 2022, 08:19:04 AM
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I think I posted this horn a year or two go, but thought I'd post it again in case new viewers might like to see it. The horn "walked" into the Fisherville, Virginia, outdoor antique show some years ago. It has a turned bone tip, two applied horn rings, old tack decoration, and a two-piece butt plug that separates to expose a large internal funnel for filling the horn. The horn is about 13" on the outside curve and of medium size. The threaded, two-piece butt plug is a rare feature and interesting to see. Its separation line is virtually invisible when the plug is together, and it was only discovered when examining the horn a week or two after getting it... a pleasant surprise that I think the prior owner missed. Several knowledgeable powder horn collectors have seen the horn and attribute it to the Upper Valley of Virginia.
Shelby Gallien
(https://i.ibb.co/TtT9PLW/DSCN3756-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/Hq25Gdh)
(https://i.ibb.co/xMmcks8/DSCN3759-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hKXn6M1)
(https://i.ibb.co/Xsg4Z5v/DSCN3768-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6PxZRtf)
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Great horn, used for a long time as the wear areas show.. Are there other pins holding the butt in? Just wondering if the tacks could have been added later.
Tim
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Tim,
Yes, there are original small pins located between the tack heads that attach the plug.
Shelby Gallien
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Thanks, one more; do holes show in the portion of the bands that show wear?
Tim
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Yeah Boy!! This one is a screamer all right. Wow! Thank you Shelby for posting it here.
Dick
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Tim,
I'm not exactly clear on what you are asking. If by "holes" you mean pins anchoring the bands, then no. There is no evidence of the rings being pinned. If you are asking about the chipped-out area where one band was worn very thin, I guess you could call that damaged area a "hole" in the band. If I misunderstood what you were asking, please ask again. I enlarged the three views to assist in studying them.
Shelby Gallien
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What I should have asked; Does it look like the tacks went all the way around the bands at one time? Wondering if they were added after the wear. No matter what, still a Great horn.
Thanks, Tim
PS: Is the butt Maple or Walnut, hard to tell by Pix? TC
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Tim,
Plug is two pieces of end-grain walnut. There are no "ghost" holes for old tacks on the back side/carry side of the bands. The plug's tacks run completely around the perimeter, but the bands were only tack-decorated on the front sides, leaving back of bands bare and prone to heavy wear. Too bad the bands weren't tacked all the way around; tacks might have preserved the back side of the bands better.
Despite my being a huge Tansel and Mercer County [OH] fan, this is one of my very favorite horns due to the fine lathe work on both the plug and the spout. For being an uncarved horn, it's a fascinating and very well-done piece of work.
By the way, if you look closely on the left end of the dark, front view, there is a small "W" carved on the horn. I think this is George Washington's personal horn; just wish his cherry tree axe came with it!
Shelby Gallien
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Thank You. I did notice the "W" (By the way, if you look closely on the left end of the dark, front view, there is a small "W" carved on the horn. I think this is George Washington's personal horn; just wish his cherry tree axe came with it!) :)
Tim
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Tim,
One more comment might better explain the tack decoration and when added to the horn. The rings' heavy wear appears to run up to the tack heads, tapering toward the heads but NOT running into, touching, or going below, the heads. Tack heads sit on totally unworn sections of the horn rings. This indicates the tacks were added very early in the horn's life, well before all the heavy ring wear on the back side occurred. I'd surmise that the original owner added the tacks almost immediately after purchasing the horn.
Opinions may vary on tacked horns, but I don't believe professional "of the trade" horn-makers tacked their new work. I believe tacking was done by the owner, as a way of giving the horn more visual appeal and adding his own "statement" to the horn... making it feel more like his own personalized horn.
Shelby Gallien
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Thanks and I agree with your thinking on the tacks.
Tim
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Great horn sir, I’ve got one I’ll have to get out with a similar type base. It came with original bag . With provenance to a Va. family.
Bob
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I'd like to see that one too.
Tim
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Wonderful horn!
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Very interesting, thank you for sharing it. I'm surprised that no one copied it.
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Very interesting, thank you for sharing it. I'm surprised that no one copied it.
When it was new before the wear and tacks:
https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=72871.msg727212#msg727212
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Tim,
How come the threaded post in your butt plug's nose piece isn't integral with the nose piece... just so you can tell your horn from mine???
Shelby
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Tim,
How come the threaded post in your butt plug's nose piece isn't integral with the nose piece... just so you can tell your horn from mine???
Shelby
Just wanted it to look like it but not a "Bench Copy" but something that could have been made in the same shop.
Tim
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What a beauty!!!!!! Very thoughtfully made butt cap and very nicely done to boot!
Robby
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Tim,
I knew you'd have a good answer!
Shelby
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I am curious about the wooden threads. Did they treat them with anything, maybe beeswax? seems like even with just humidity they would lock up. Did they have woodcutting dies for that job like we have today, they look very precisely done.
Robby
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I've done quite a few horns with threaded finials and have never had one lock up. I seal them with something, Tung Oil, Linseed oil and Bee's wax, Danish Oil, etc... Both sets of threads are done, allowed to dry and then use a buffing wheel on the male set to smooth them out, on the female set I run the tap back and forth a couple time to try an burnish them.
I would think some threading was hand chased but I would also imagine, just like making screws there were metal screw plates or cutters made and taps to match. Would be interesting to hear other Ideas.
Art DeCamp's book "Pennsylvania "Horns of the Trade" has some information on how threads were done but it is on horns.
Tim
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Are the taps you use to cut the threads typical metal cutting taps?
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Are the taps you use to cut the threads typical metal cutting taps?
No, for tapping and threading wood I use this. This one is 1/2-8, larger sizes are available. It does not have a brand name on it but an online search will show many.
Tim
(https://i.ibb.co/nkN5qWM/IMG-1193-2.jpg) (https://ibb.co/pXB96mj)