AmericanLongRifles Forums
General discussion => Antique Gun Collecting => Topic started by: Feltwad on August 19, 2008, 09:07:08 PM
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My last thread was on punt guns for fowling for this thread I will discuss the big bore fowlers that are shot from the shoulder.These guns are used on the fore shore and the inland marshes .
The largest of these is the Bank gun in 2 gage this gun was used on the foreshore it was rested on a sand dune or the sea wall , the incoming tide brought with it the small waders that feed along the waters edge such as dunlins ,curlew and oyster catchers and when within range this gun was discharged into the feeding flock.It was to the fowler like the punt gun a tool of the trade who sold what he shot at market.
Other gages that were used and are still used today are the 4gage ,6gage,8gage and 10 gage,the 4 and 6 were mostly used on the fore shore on the morning and evening flight these guns with a charge of 10 drms of black powder and 2.1/2 oz will kill geese at 60 to 70 yards.The 8 gage and the 10 gage were mostly used on the inland marshes here the quarry was mainly ducks with geese on the larger ones.
I have enclosed a couple of photos of a stand of big gage fowlers from my collection and some which I still use.
Feltwad
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi79.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj152%2FRamrod_2006%2FP1010043.jpg&hash=8fd60e46cf0aa53b3e9ff651667a3372e0748a4b)
The guns from the bottom to the top are 2 gage F/L bank gun, 4gage ,10gage 6 gage 8gage
(https://americanlongrifles.org/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi79.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fj152%2FRamrod_2006%2FP1010047-1.jpg&hash=851aabb8c14711287e36b52a32bd9b0f9e0e9468)
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Lovely shotguns FW. I never tire of viewing good English guns... And know they are wonderful shooters.
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I really like those English fowlers too and you have a great collection. Thanks for sharing them with us. I only have two English doubles and they are both 12 ga. One is by Hollis and Sheath and one is by R. Hughes. Both of them are good shooters. A couple of years ago I sent the Hollis and Sheath barrels back to England to have the solder joints redone (ribs were getting loose).
James Levy
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Boy, I never thought I would say a 10ga looked light and wispy, but it does next to the rest of them.
Thanks for posting.
You wouldn't happen to have some photos of english sporting rifles would you? I have always loved the look of a fine english gun. From the start of the craft all the way to WWII, they have made some of the finest guns.
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You wouldn't happen to have some photos of english sporting rifles would you? I have always loved the look of a fine english gun. From the start of the craft all the way to WWII, they have made some of the finest guns.
Sorry Photog I do not have any original English sporting rifles,those that were popular in the muzzle loading period were the short barrel park rifle,the double barreled deer rifle mostly used for stalking in Scotland ,and the big game rifle used in Africa and India.
Yes English gun making from the flintlock era through to the present day is the best in the world,but I am a patriot.
Feltwad
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I am getting kind of attached to the English style. I remember reading about a
U. S. market hunter that used a punt gun, then went to his "little 10 ga." to clean up cripples with. The little 10 was only loaded with 1 1/8 to 1 1/4 oz of shot. Daryl and Dpharsis have recently posted pictures of English flint rifles. They are in B&W but help show the stlye. At first glance they resemble half stock Hawkins with flintlocks. The English rifles were made lighter with sensible buttplates as compared to the plains rifles used in the mid 1800's.
DP
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Those are SUPER! I have several questions. How long is the barrel on the flint gun? Any estimation when it was made? The Lock looks like a dog lock and quite early, but I suspect it may be much earlier than the rest of the gun.
Could you tell us who the makers of the guns are? Always interesting to know who in the trade were making the big guns.
Many thanks for sharing these, it's really rare to ever see these in America. They're here, but all tucked away in collections.
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Yes, that big flint gun is catching my eye! Thanks Feltwad for sharing your collection. I love those fowling guns! Any history and details are appreciated.
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Mike the flint lock bank gun is by Henry Blyth a London gun maker it is a 2 gage with a 66inch iron barrel.The lock is 9.1/2 inches long and fitted with a dog catch,although this gun has been restocked at a later date Henry Blyth was in business 1710-1750.
The 4 gage with a 42inch barrel is by Gordon of Bishop Wearmouth, Sunderland ,Co Durham ,Bishop Wearmouth is situated on the mouth of the river Wear he made many big gage percussion guns for the fowlers he also made harpoon guns for the whaling ships.
The 10 gage is by Stevenson with a 40 inch barrel it is a Birmingham made gun of 1832 period.
The 6 gage with a 42 inch barrel is by Alfred Clayton and is a Tubelock, he was one of the gun makers to Hawker and mentioned several times in his dairies.Alfred Clayton traded at High St, Lymington, Hants 1843-55 then at 153 High St ,Southampton, Hants 1855-67 the gun in question was build at the latter part of the percussion era when he was at Southampton,he also patented a tube with a butterfly end for easy extraction.
The 8 gage with a 40 inch barrel is by James Leigh, 49 Leman St ,London 1833-43 then at I. Duncan St , Whitechapel London 1844-55.
The 4,6,8,and 10 I still use when flighting ducks or geese ,the 4 I do not load the required charge which is 10 drms to 2.1/2 oz of shot is a bit too much for me to handle and can be a bit of a brain shaker half of this charge is plenty which can still take ducks and geese at 50 to 60 yards.
Feltwad
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Thanks so much for your pictures and information. Please be encouraged to post more!
Did you copy your boat from a specific time period? I understand the 18th century punt boat was very similar, just no decking, just pretty much the same as yours, but open. Do you agree?
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I know I mentioned this book before but you have to see the The Outlaw Gunner. It has pics of guns with two inch bores, battery guns, multiple barreled guns mounted in skiffs and a pic of a guy making a stock out of a 12 X 12 piece of walnut with and adz.
Tim C.
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I believe I "have" that book.....I think it's been "on loan" and is currently in Kansas.... :P
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Did you copy your boat from a specific time period? I understand the 18th century punt boat was very similar, just no decking, just pretty much the same as yours, but open. Do you agree?
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This type of punt is only for the estuaries and is a copy , this type was used for over two centuries and has changed very little it had to be decked so water in a choppy sea would not enter the punt .The punt used on the inngs and inland marshes were open decked here there was no need for decking,
Feltwad
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In the US the federal government will not legally permit one to use anything larger than the 10 gauge on waterfowl. Likely in order to prevent punt gun use. Interesting laws as a shoulder arm tends to limit itself by recoil as you mentioned.
DP