rifle from auction

[Codger]

D.E.Powell

I'm new to posting on the forum. read posts and enjoy the information alot. I've hunted with flint lock rifles since the mid 1970's, made several a few years back and hope to start another soon.
I found this old used up rifle at a auction. have been told it is a southern rifle. The stock is badly worn, the barrel bore  measures .430" and appears bright with a light.
barrel is 38 3/4" long about .900" at the breech .750" in the middle and .875" at the muzzle. brass hardeware. evidence of a lid on the mortice in the butt. name on the barrel is too worn to be legable.
 

The lock is marked Cincinnati, is square tailed and has a couple ducks on it.


It has been heavily used ? abused.


Any one have an idea where it may have originated from
Thanks for looking.

Don

[mr. no gold]

Hello Don and welcome to the forum. You did the best thing anyone can do when coming on here; you brought a nice old rifle to show around.
And, a nice gun it is! Looks like it could have been a flintlock, as this lock is not the same one installed when the gun was made. The original had a two bolt plate and this is a one bolter. The wood may have been hollowed out some for this lock, too. Hard to tell.
Barrel has likely been shortened since it is under 40 inches. The stock is nice maple and looks like it is in overall good shape. The grease hole looks like it might have had a patch box over it once upon a time, but I can't quite tell. Usually the hole is a southern trait and your rifle has a definite southern look to it. What state, I can't say but someone here will be sure to know. North Carolina might be a good bet. 
The kids may have played with this one some, but it was well used, too. The forearm looks like the piece was carried over a saddle for a long time. Great wear patterns. You are fortunate that the original overall finish is intact and that no one has cleaned it. If you can send in some full length photos, thimbles, and muzzle. Include the cheekrest head on too, ang the signature, if you please. That would help some.
Thank you again for bringing this to the table.
Best-Dick
Again

[Curt J]

A handsome and interesting old rifle, the kind we always wish could talk.  It does look southern, but could also have been made in the Midwest by a gunsmith who learned his trade in the South.  If we could see some photos of that illegible signature, maybe we could figure it out, who knows?

[leatherman]

Don, Try taking a picture of the signature with your camera set on Macro to get the best focus. Then zoom it up on the cameras screen and see if the signature looks legable . This trick worked for me a couple of weeks ago on a JP Beck rifle with a badly pitted barrel.

[Tanselman]

You have an interesting rifle, but we need to see a few more details of the gun before making an assessment. Perhaps "standard" type photos would be of greatest help. Those include: 1) a "half shot" of the front, showing from the butt plate out to about 8" past the lock plate; 2) half shot of rear, showing from butt plate out to about 8" past where lock sits on other side, 3) a full length view of the front side of the gun, 4) picture of what remains of the barrel signature; 5) picture of the tang at the back of the barrel, 6) picture of rear ramrod pipe with several inches of stock wood on either side, 6) picture of muzzle showing last 6" of forestock so we can see how ramrod channel terminates.

All  photos should be taken perpendicular to, or directly over, the gun, so no angle distorts the view or dimensions. It may have southern roots based on the simplicity of stocking with triangular butt with grease hole, but the guard's width and style don't appear southen at first glance, so we need to see additional details to better understand what you really have. Shelby Gallien

[rich pierce]

How wide is the buttplate?

[Codger]

Thank you for responding to my post. I will try to add a few additional photos. First my apologies for the poor quality. I am on dial-up so it very slow and time consuming to get a response to the forum.

This is the best I can get of the signature.

This is the tang area (note wood chip missing between tang and lock
Tried to get a full length photo, not much luck  Thanks  Don

[Codger]

Rich
the butt plate is 1-5/8" wide the ram rod thimbles are iron and there is no evidence of an entry thimble.

Probable not enough solid information to help. I will probably keep it as a useful pattern rifle if I build a slim, plain squirrel rifle.

Thansks again

Don

[rich pierce]

It's a great find, very cool, a lot of history in that gun.

[Dphariss]

Thank you for responding to my post. I will try to add a few additional photos. First my apologies for the poor quality. I am on dial-up so it very slow and time consuming to get a response to the forum.

This is the best I can get of the signature.

This is the tang area (note wood chip missing between tang and lock
Tried to get a full length photo, not much luck  Thanks  Don

The chlorate fouling from the caps attacks the wood as well as the metal and its not unusual to see percussion guns with no protection from cap flash with damaged or missing wood behind the nipple. The eating away of the barrel is classic.

Thanks for the pictures.
I know getting decent photos of guns is a PITA and we all appreciate your taking the time.
Dan

[Codger]

Dan
your assessment of cap damage is correct. I did not show the erosion around the drum where the barrel metal is washed out about .040" deep and 7/8" long.
This rifle must have been used hard.
Don