New to muzzleloaders, need some help

[vegard_dino]

 

Hi all.

I am new here at the forum. I am from Norway.
So far, I have been shooting and hunting with modern guns, but I do like old modern guns, pre WWII is what I use now, got my hands on my first BP rifle some days ago, a cape gun. So, I am starting BP shooting.

But, my head are also turned to muzzleloaders. The dealer for the BP gun had one, ohmm, nice looking.

So, I did go to a museum and had a long look at some great muzzleloaders, flintlock, wheel-lock and so one.
I also dropped by a dealer for these guns, oh my, some great guns he has for sale. They sure made some great guns back then, what a quality to. Folding stocks, set triggers, double barreled rifles and so. I had no idea.
The feel of the old guns are something special, holding one and imagine a running wild boar in the tick forest here..Great.

But, to by a vintage flintlock and use it, I am not sure about that. Maybe for the pro, but me? No, maybe better of with a new replica.

Or?
I do like to start with these, for target shooting and also go alone on a hunting trip to the US.
But, what do I need to start with?

I had a look at some old, original, German made flintlocks, Jaeger style, in 12-18 mm calibers.

I hope some can help me out, guide me in the right direction here.

Thanks for looking

[Scott Semmel]

If you want a reliable well made flintlock I would recommend looking at the numerous sites of builders that are members of this forum.  After viewing the variety available make some decisions about caliber and style and then contact the builder of your choice.

[LynnC]

First - welcome to ALR

For your entertainment take a look at www.trackofthewolf.com and look at the guns for sale section.  Lots to see.

There are at least two members on this site that hail from your part of the world, runastav and Rolfkt, both making guns.  Perhaps they could be of some guidence to you if you happen to be close.....................Lynn

[Daryl]

Vegard - you are most welcome,here.

Check out Runastav and Rolfkt over in gun building or from the member's list. They be more than happy to assist you, as would anyone else here.

Here is a .60 cal.(about 15mm) Jaeger made by one of the members here. There are several others, as in Acer's Jaeger, equisite as well.



Acer's rifle (Tom C.)

[vegard_dino]

Hi and thanks for the reply`s.

I will look up the two gun makers and ask for some help.
But, for hunting, what kind of caliber shall I look at?
I did se a nice French rifle, in 12 mm, or was that for small game?

So, are there some things I need to look out for when getting my first muzzleloader? Detachable barrel for easy cleaning?

Best
Vegard

[vegard_dino]

Dary, now that is a nice gun.
You hunt with it?

[Daryl]

Dary, now that is a nice gun.
You hunt with it?

Not my rifle - my brother's - yes - he hunts with it.

12mm is smaller than .50 cal. which is a nice deer calibre - can work on moose and elk, but most prefer larger calibres ie: .54(13.7mm) or .58(14.7mm)- or larger. I hunt with a .69" calibre (17.5mm) rifle. I also have a  couple 14.7's for hunting.

DPhar (of this site) uses either a .50 cal. 12.7mm or his .67cal. (17mm) rifle.

[vegard_dino]

Thanks for the information.

Also, some old guns have brass trigger guards and brass grip, but some also have wooden guards-grips. What is the original style?
Or, just a matter of the maker, costumers style/taste?

[TPH]

Vegard_dino, welcome to the ALR. You have received some excellent advice here, hopefully it will give you some ideas of what you want to do. You might also take a look at the Norwegian collector's site and see what was being used "at home". Of course, these are military arms but they are very interesting:

http://norskevaapen.no/

Look particularly in "Long Guns" for "DkN long-guns" and "Long-guns 1814 – 1905".

Here's hoping that you will be here for a long time and that you will learn a lot.

[vegard_dino]

Thanks for the link. Some nice guns there

[vegard_dino]

Hello all.

Daryl, can I ask who made the gun?
That is a great looking gun.

[Daryl]

mail sent

[JCKelly]

The best quality reproduction muzzle loading firearms are those made by Davide-Pedersoli.com

There are very beutiful rifles, fowlers and muskets made in the USA. Often they have better locks than do the guns by Pedersoli. Almost all American muzzle loaders use barrels made of a steel which has considerable sulphur, phosphorus and lead added. These elements make the steel easier to machine, by reducing its ductility. The US common name for this material is 12L14, our Unified Numbering System designates it UNS G12144. I am not sure of the Europen Standards, they might be N1AL or 95MnPb28. Literature from one of our steel mills who produce this 12L14 grade had the following to say:

. . .The impact energy, as measured by the Charpy test, is given as a function of the test temperature . At low temperatures, the impact energy was found to be very low, less than 5 ft-lb (6.8 Joules), and the transition temperature . . . higher than 70°F (21.1°C)   
My Translation: this steel, as do  others, becomes brittle from cold.  “Cold” to 12L14   is room temperature.
It should be understood that (12L14)has low impact properties with wide scatter as measured by the Charpy test, and users should be aware of this fact. . . if impact or shock loading is anticipated, particularly at low ambient temperatures (i.e., an American’s idea of room temperature, or below) this aspect of design and material selection should be considered . . .

Pedersoli metallurgist & ask him. I recognize this is an unpopular thing for me to say.

[whitebear]

Welcome to the ALR.  Never hesitate to ask a question, someone here can most likely answer it or know someone who can.  I am sure that there are several hundred years of collective knowledge and experience on this forum.  I've been in this game since 1973 and this is the best sight that I have found.

[vegard_dino]

Thanks.
I will keep asking

[JCKelly]

Vegard, I erred - I meant to say ask a Norwegian metallurgist for his thoughts on 95MnPb28. Pedersoli told me they used a grade "C40", the Italian spec. It is about .4% carbon, no additions to help machining.
On another post I put together the barrel lengths and calibers found in Wolf's book. There is a fellow named Steve Zihn in Wyoming, szihn@wyoming.com who makes a nice looking rifle. Track of the Wolf had one for sale a while back. I have one of his flint pistols in .54 caliber. Were I to get a rifle from him I would request an Ed Rayle barrel. Don't know if Pedersoli barrels are available in the US.

[vegard_dino]

Hello

Thanks for the information and link