Author Topic: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)  (Read 11853 times)

Offline Shreckmeister

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Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« on: March 29, 2011, 09:21:50 PM »
Axe found in Quebec City.   circa 1690-1710 Handle not original.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2011, 10:57:45 PM by suzkat »
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

RoaringBull

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Re: 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2011, 04:41:11 AM »
Wow, thats cool!

KennyC

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Re: 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2011, 05:42:17 AM »
A really nice find thanks for sharing

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2011, 11:32:54 PM »
That edge is more than 4"!!  I guess those rules are newer than that blade.  Ha!!  Great axe.
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Offline Cobweb

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Re: 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #4 on: March 31, 2011, 07:10:27 AM »


Wow! That's quite a find!
Wish it were mine!

Cobweb
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Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #5 on: March 31, 2011, 03:40:48 PM »
That edge is more than 4"!!  I guess those rules are newer than that blade.  Ha!!  Great axe.
3 and 5/8ths blade.  Please fill me in on the 4" rule.  I'm
a total newb on edged weapons.
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Early 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #6 on: March 31, 2011, 06:41:56 PM »
Make a line on a piece of paper, put the for'd tip of the blade on this line, and roll the blade toward the heel.  Here, make another mark, and measure the line's length...NMLRA rules (as far as I am lead to believe) says this line can be no more than four inches in length.  Our BC Black Powder Assoc. has the same rule.  The idea is to keep everyone on the same field for throwing tomahawks, as a blade with more cutting length may have an advantage in some of the games.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Early 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #7 on: March 31, 2011, 07:23:30 PM »
Thanks Taylor,  it's 4 and 3/32nds.  Guess I can't play.  Now
I get it!
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Early 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #8 on: March 31, 2011, 10:31:32 PM »
I'm sure that when the English or French made these, they expected that the first sharpening would bring the bitt's length down to conform to the rules!!  Ha.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline hanshi

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Re: Early 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #9 on: March 31, 2011, 11:28:28 PM »
Very interesting find.
!Jozai Senjo! "always present on the battlefield"
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.

Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Early 18th Century Fur Trade Belt Axe
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2011, 09:30:03 PM »
Here are a few additional photos of the axe.


Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline T.C.Albert

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #11 on: April 12, 2011, 08:58:59 PM »
As was pointed out else where, your unusual ax does bear a remarkable resemblance to those like it on ebay...this one for instance...http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-IRON-UNUSUAL-SHAPED-AXE-HEAD-/260758842096?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cb6702af0
I think the ebay one is definately Indian...but not the Native American kind  :(
Sorry to be a doubting Thomas with this one, and I'd love nothing better than to see where axes like yours have been dug and reported in north America elsewhere.
TC
 
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Offline Shreckmeister

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2011, 03:57:35 AM »
When I look at the one on Ebay I see a remarkable difference.  All the opinions
voiced on this and other forums are welcome.  Appears to be about an even split between those who appreciate it and those who doubt it.  The doubters seem
to want their opinions valued more.  Anyway, I like it and
want to share it with others.   I think I'll take it to an expert for an opinion.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2011, 04:07:12 AM by suzkat »
Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add 'within the limits of the law' because law is often but the tyrant's will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual.

Offline mr. no gold

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #13 on: April 13, 2011, 04:19:51 AM »
I hesitate to point out the obvious here, but the location of the e-bay axe head is listed in the ad as being in Haryana, India. No guess work needed on this.
The one in the photos here, appears to be the genuine, colonial, frontier article. I have a couple that are close in shape, etc., to this one, so it looks right to me.
Dick   

Offline T.C.Albert

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #14 on: April 13, 2011, 04:39:44 PM »
My sincere apologies...In the spirit of really learning I would very much like to know more about the use and history associated with this style of ax...like when was the style use here in north America, where did it originally come from, who brought them, was it a pattern intended for trade or basically a personal item for european use...stuff like that.
Any additional info along those lines would be appreciated.
TC
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Contact at : huntingpouch@gmail.com

Offline mr. no gold

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #15 on: April 15, 2011, 08:31:22 AM »
No apology needed here, T.C.; your eye was right on the mark regarding the e-bay hatchet head. It is East Indian in origin and is kind of interesting; it's probably an agricultural tool of some type, but could be used for cutting wood as well.
The head that Suzkat posted is along the lines of the original trade axe/hatchets furnished to the Amerindians and the Euro-settlers, long before the pipe tomahawks came into prominance sometime in the reasonably, early 1700s. Hard to say how old this head as it appears to have been a 'dug' piece and has rusted somewhat, (it may have had a mark on it, but if so is now gone). It is old, however. The flared bit style is old and may have been carried over from the Indo European war axe. This style, which no doubt found its way into Europe long ago, was popular for a time, but seems to have been discarded in favor of the familiar, conventional design that is still somewhat with us.
These were made by the French and English for the colonial trade and were widespread in the North American colonies. This one may very well be French as it is reported to have been found in Canada; hence it may date to the French period making it quite old.
Best-Dick

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #16 on: April 15, 2011, 08:46:52 AM »
Great little axe. Nice lines etc.

Dan
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dannybb55

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Re: Early 18th Century Belt Axe (More Photos)
« Reply #17 on: April 15, 2011, 11:45:59 PM »
In Carl P Russell Firearms traps and Tools 1966 p. 249 it most resembles the no,4 specimen in profile which would make it English. Only a Chem test would tell you where the ore came from and all of these were jobber made for centuries. It is basically a Biscay axe of a style that places it anywhere in the iron age  and from Europe. A very nice ax by a workman like smith. I want to get in my forge and turn one out this weekend.
                          Danny