Author Topic: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion  (Read 6462 times)

Offline Ezra

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Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« on: May 31, 2011, 06:45:08 PM »
Guys,

I am going to try something that I have always wanted to do.  Probably because I still suffer from being dropped on my head so many times in my youth.  I want to build a reliably functioning flintlock from rough castings.  Note that I did not say it would be pretty.  I have no doubt this is probably well beyond my skill set, but at least I can try.  I have an Early Germanic (circa 1760) flintlock in rough castings from Mr. Jack Brooks.  I shall post pictures of said castings this evening when I get home.  The only reference material I could find is a small paperback booklet by Kit Ravenshear that gives a cursory description of what to do.  It is going to be very time consuming and frustrating, without doubt.  I have to at least try.  It's been bugging me for some time.

Lock castings from Jack Brooks.  Germanic lock, circa 1760.  Lockplate is 5 1/4" long.




Ez

« Last Edit: June 01, 2011, 03:38:26 AM by Ezra »
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mjm46@bellsouth.net

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2011, 06:57:23 PM »
I'll be looking forward to the photos.

Offline Ezra

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2011, 06:59:08 PM »
It should be humorous... ;D


Ez
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Offline Ezra

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2011, 07:11:20 PM »
Haahahahahaha...I'm cheating already!!!  I just spoke to Mr. Chambers and he HIGHLY recommends I build one of his lock kits first.  So, that is what I will do.  Small Siler flintlock first, then the rough casting locks.  Still, I shall photograph the adventure, warts and all.


Ez
« Last Edit: May 31, 2011, 07:19:00 PM by Tim Crosby »
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Offline bgf

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2011, 07:43:45 PM »
You only fail for certain if you don't try!  Looking forward to pictures.

Offline whitebear

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2011, 11:55:54 PM »
Good luck on your project, don't forget to post pictures and ask lots of questions.
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Offline Swampwalker

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2011, 11:58:55 PM »
I've found Jack to be responsive to questions sent via email (I havn't tried calling).  I would definetely ask him if you come to a stumbling block. 

Offline Bill of the 45th

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2011, 12:15:38 AM »
Go for it Ez, it's on my bucket list as well, just hasn't come to the top yet.  Maybe you should buy two kits so you have spare parts. ;D  Jim's idea is a good call. I have faith you will succeed.

Bill
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Offline smart dog

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2011, 12:19:03 AM »
Hi Ezra,
Building a lock from castings is not that hard.  The flintlock on the first gun that I built 30 years ago was a Siler kit.  It came out great although it took me a while to figure out how to heat treat it correctly.  Also the springs were already heat treated.  Anyway, the lock eventually worked fine and I still have it.  It is useful to have a drill press and a gas welder but neither of those tools is required.  The Chamber's kit would certainly be a great place to start because everything should fit together well.  For castings made from original locks, the job can be a bit harder because shrinkage of parts from the casting process can leave you with very little room for error when drilling holes.  That is particularly true for sears and bridles, especially small ones used in pistols.  Good luck and have fun.

dave      
« Last Edit: June 01, 2011, 12:19:58 AM by smart dog »
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Offline Ezra

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2011, 12:39:10 AM »
Maybe you should buy two kits so you have spare parts. ;D 

Bill


Oh yeah... ;D


Ez
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Offline Acer Saccharum

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #10 on: June 01, 2011, 12:39:33 AM »
On building from castings: some folks use the externals, lockplate, cock and frizzen, but use internals from a large Siler, or other lock that is of suitable size.
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Offline Ezra

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #11 on: June 01, 2011, 12:47:41 AM »
On building from castings: some folks use the externals, lockplate, cock and frizzen, but use internals from a large Siler, or other lock that is of suitable size.


I had thought of that as a possibility Acer.  Especially after seeing the rough castings of the internals, rolling them around in my hand and thinking, #$! part is that?  It would also make replacing a broken mainspring, as an example, less painful.  Thanks for the tip.


Ez
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Offline bob in the woods

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #12 on: June 01, 2011, 01:10:26 AM »
If you think that building a lock from castings is " not that hard " I tip my hat to you.
Silers are builder friendly, however I've seen a few sets of castings [ the Clark  lock for his Factor's rifle as an example  :'( ]   that have inspired my language creativity !!!

Offline smart dog

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2011, 04:59:17 AM »
Hi Bob,
I've built 8 or 9 locks from castings.  The only ones that were really challenging were the small pistol locks I used for my set of Wogdon duellers.   The internals had no margin of error and I had to add steel to the bridles.  The larger locks for fowlers, military guns, or big wheellocks were pretty straight forward and fun but sometimes tedious.  Acer's suggestion of using Siler or other commercially made internals is excellent advice.  I have another set of Wogdon pistol lock castings coming and I will make the internals from scratch.  I am convinced it will be easier that way.  The only other problem that I've had with sets of casting is occasionally they are flawed or don't fit quite right because of shrinkage during casting.  For example, the pan on an English type 1 lock I built was slightly too small for its recess in the lockplate.  Again, my welder saved the day.  I am also fortunate to have a good heat treating set up that includes a programmable electric furnace.  That really helps a lot for hardening and tempering but I made several good locks without that equipment. 

take care,

dave
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mattdog

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Re: Daring to fail...in spectacular fashion
« Reply #14 on: June 02, 2011, 04:51:31 PM »
Building a lock from castings can look daunting.  Just remember that there isn't anything that you can't do with a file, hacksaw and drill press.  Other machine tools are nice too :)  There are a few hints that I'd like to pass along if I may.

First I hope you have a bead blast cabinet or access to one to remove the black crusty casting slag from those parts.  It is abrasive and will dull your tools and files.  If you don't have access to one then a cartrige case vibrater half full of kitty litter will work.  Another advantage is that you can see your parts better and decide what needs to be done before it becomes a problem.

I'd also suggest that you build it with the internal parts provided.  That is a small lock and the parts are more likely to fit (that is a tiny tumbler) and the hammer timing is more likely to come out right on the first try.  It looks like the screw holes are spotted for you and that is a big advantage.  You will need to true up the tumbler axles and center them to each other - a lathe works but can be done on a drill press if that s all you have.  Just remember to turn them to an existing drill/reamer diameter or you will be searching for an odd size reamer to make it fit the lock plate and bridle.   Your lock appears to be unbridled.  Ouch, they are a pain to drill the pivot screw hole and have the frizzen fit the pan when done.  You will probably have to build yourself a jig from hardwood to hold the plate square with the drill press, drill through the plate from the back side and spot the frizzen then drill it free from there.  Take your time, use sharp bits.

Making the springs springy and frizzen hard is another subject not to be included here.  (I don't see a sear spring in the pile of parts)  I build locks from castings every day, I'm willing to help or answer questions either on the forum or you are welcome to PM me.

Matt