steel used in makeing wheel locks

[welafong1]

dear sirs
 would  you tell me the type of steel or make or letter or number is used in the making of a wheel lock parts
thank you
Richard Westerfield

[Dphariss]

dear sirs
 would  you tell me the type of steel or make or letter or number is used in the making of a wheel lock parts
thank you
Richard Westerfield

There is no historically correct modern steel.
Iron would have been used for almost everything but the wheel and springs I suspect.
The best thing to use today for "soft" parts would be 1010 - 1018 then case hardened.
Springs use high carbon steel 1075 or 1095 and for durability the wheel should be high carbon as well.

Dan

[FL-Flintlock]

Considering an alloy very similar to common mild steel was being produced in the second millennium B.C ....not to mention Noric and Iberian steels making their debut in the 4th century B.C. and of course there’s Wootz, Damascus and Chengaya (sp?) followed shortly after by Kyivian and several other all falling into the more specific classes of moderately-high to high carbon.

For nondescript applications, one could choose anything in the low or medium carbon alloy range and be historically correct.  For hard parts, I’d go with a an appropriate modern high carbon alloy so you know what you’re working with for heat-treatment purposes – unless someone has access to the analysis equipment, ain’t no one gonna tell what alloy you used just looking at it with their eyeball, it’s more important that the device works properly so go with known O-1; W-1 or whatever is required to fill your needs.

[welafong1]

thank you
Richard Westerfield

[welafong1]

i think i will take Dans advice  "soft" parts would be 1010 - 1018 then case hardened.
Springs use high carbon steel 1075 or 1095 and for durability the wheel should be high carbon as well"and run witl it i would like to thank you very much for the help you have giving to me
Richard Westerfield

[Ben I. Voss]

Richard, I would recommend Admiral Steel near Chicago. They have most everything in the steel department and have always been decent to deal with.   admiralsteel.com

[jpldude]

I've found the following two books very helpful:

"Fighting Iron" by Art Gogan

and

"American Iron 1607 - 1900" by Robert B. Gordon

As always it's "FWIW" & "YMMV"

[camerl2009]

you can be "historically correct" and still use modern materials it only has to look like the real thing

i make lot of differnt things and im not always "historically correct"  nor do i try to be

id rather use modern materials over wrought iron

[FL-Flintlock]

Wrought iron is not steel just cause steel can be "wrought" as well .  If I order Wrought iron and receive a piece of steel, I'll send it back. And so will just about everyone else.  Wrought vs Cast iron vs steel are descriptions recognized by the vast majority . Simple.

Many agree that the majority of what has been termed "wrought iron" was actually "wrought steel" - that's not saying "all" as there are plenty of examples of actual "wrought iron" but they’re pointing out that the testing of artifacts combined with the historical descriptions are in agreement that the majority of items were in fact “wrought steel” as opposed to “wrought iron” yet all were commonly, although incorrectly, described as merely “wrought iron” since the difference was not known at the time – hardly can one expect to find the proper period application of the term “steel” if quick and easy analysis methods did not exist at the time and there must be consideration for use of the common language.  The Bible speaks of “dragons” simply because the term “dinosaur” was not invented until the 19th century long after the Bible was written – such does not change the meaning of the description but rather there have been words invented that have a specific meaning in our more modern language to properly clarify a specific meaning - same with alloy analysis which can be readily done in our modern world.  The lack of the term "dinosaur" does not change the fact of what was being described as a dragon just as the lack of analysis does not change the fact that what may have been called “iron” was actually “steel”.

To the extent of the OP's question, it’s very much pointless to purchase the wrong alloy only to waste time, money and effort so it can be used for the application.  Yes, it is simple, just buy the correct alloy to begin with.

[bob in the woods]

If " the majority of items were actually wrought steel rather than wrought iron " why was steel referred to separately from iron? I'd really like to know your source for this conclusion ? What time frame are you referring to ?  Since certain items were intentionally made of steel { frizzens, swords etc] they [ 1700's] obviously knew the difference.  Even the hot rolled low carbon steel I use behaves differently than the wrought iron I've used. Not only in the forge, but leave a piece of each outside for a week, and you can see that the steel piece is much the worse for wear. The "wrought iron" I've purchased was/is incredible stuff.
It is expensive as well.

[LRB]

  We always called couplings, couplings. Never heard anyone call a coupling, a brass.

[Ky-Flinter]

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[Acer Saccharum]

Gents, can we please keep the discussion to steel?

[Captchee]

Couple things , if I may .
 I wonder if the issue here isn’t just one terminology  and a confusion between  modern and historic reference.
not to also mention an issue of  metals  that are no longer avalable  and thus possably wrongly assumed to be steel  in the modern context ?

As I understand it . Steel  was considered anything with  a 2% carbon level .
 But it wasn’t actually steel   in the since of steel today , at least past Mild steel

 wasn’t this called blister because  the pig iron was then turned to  wrought iron . Then  the wrought had had to be carbonized to get the 2% level  to make blister ?.

 Most of  truly controlled “steel”  in the modern since , again as I understand it ,didn’t take place tell late in the  19thcentury  thus well down the road for a Wheelock . Though most certainly  some items like springs , and strikers  and such had to be a type of  iron with a high carbon level so as to  be able to temper .
 So now my question . If this is wrong then was also Swinney’s wrong in his findings  on the subject : Gun Iron and Mild Steel  by H.J. Swinney .
Which was printed in MB some years ago
 Here is a link to that article  from the MB archives  back in 1999
http://www.muzzleblasts.com/archives/vol4no3/articles/mbo43-3.shtml

[Charlie]

The language is a severe problem ,the terms iron and steel are used to describe the same thing.If you work in the construction industry everyone knows what you are talking about depending on the context of the reference..The PC HC stuff is fine and I respect and admire those who do the research to attempt to reconstruct the past but there is a point where one must realize 100% PC HC is impossible, 100% civility is possible ,a simple application of the Golden Rule works wonders.Now I will put away my soapbox.As to an answer to the original question I have no idea,I started reading this thread, as I do many,hoping to learn something.

[Dphariss]

Blister steel from wrought iron


There is a second video on making it into shear steel.



Then http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/10/051011073801.htm

Depending, I have read,  on how the furnace was loaded and operated iron, steel or cast iron could be made. If the iron melted it often formed cast iron as the liquid iron picked up too much carbon from the charcoal.
Later a furnace could also be used to reduce the carbon content of steel or cast iron and thus for iron so long as the molten steel was not exposed directly to the fuel which would simply add carbon back into the iron.
see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverberatory_furnace
Horse shoe nail stubs were melted in such a furnace to produce "iron" for gun barrels.
See W. Greener "The Gun" published circa 1832

Dan