lock "nail" question

[The other DWS]

I am working on a new project.  this is maybe my 6th or 7th flintlock so I am used to the basics.  I am using a rice swamped barrel and a Davis Queen-anne style lock.  both were well inletted by Randy Heil (of formerly TVM).  however the barrel was inletted without the breech plug installed.  All my previous projects were inletted while the BP was fitted and inplace.  I have the barrel and the lock inletted and fitted where I want them for proper touch hole positioning. The barrel is lugged and pinned in place with undersize working pins.
 MY current question / quandry is whether to go ahead and locate/drill the lock nail holes through the stock by drilling the lock plate (without tapping it)and using it to drill through the wood as a guide.  Then proceed to fit and inlet and drill the breech plug, using the untapped holes as a drill guide.  I'd then ream the hole in the breechplug lug slightly for clearance.  Then once all is fitted properly aligned proceed to tap the lock plate for the 'Nails".

This seems a logical procedure to me,  but creating these arms sometimes calls for a "different" so I thought I'd beg the opinion of the much more experienced builders in this community

[heinz]

DWS, From what you said I am under the impression you are planning the put the rear lock "nail" through the tang bolster.  I usually do it that way.  However, I think you would be better served by fitting the breech plug to the barrel and inletting the tang and bolster before drillling the screw holes.  Then you can drill the touch hole where it needs to be.  The forward lock nail will have little vertical options but significant fore and aft.  The rear lock nail has lots of room to be moved about as long as it ends up in the lock bolster and does not get too low or too high on the lock bolt plate.  I drill the lockplate  holes on the drill press, then use a hand drill to drill through the wood with the tap drill, with the barrel out of the stock and the lock in the inlet.   Then I put the barrel with tang back in stock, mark the tank bolster with the tap drill from the lockbolt plate side, then take the barrel out and finish the hole through the tang bolster on the drill press.  If the barrel is swamped you will need to shim it up a bit on the press to keep the bore horizontal.  Then I put it all back together and open up the hole to clearance size.
You can use a center drilling technique like Buechele describes in his book, especially if you have a friend to help the stock in alignment.  If not, go slow, drill one section less than 1/4 inch at a time. Set up alignment stick or guides to keep you oriented in drilling the stock

[Long John]

I guess what you are planning to do can work but it certainly is NOT the order in which I build my rifles!  

I just finished repairing a riflegun for a friend where the builder didn't final fit the breechplug before building the rifle.  What a mess!

No matter what barrel you are using (I have used Rice barrels and they are second to none in my book)you will have to polish the face of the breech plug and then verify that the face of the breechplug comes up TIGHT against the breech-end of the bore while the tang is properly centered on the top flat.  Most of the time I end up with the breechplug needing to rotate into the barrel a little further.  That then means that the whole affair must be refit for the next flat.  With the stuff already done as you describe I don't see how you are going to make sure that the breechplug is properly fit.

I always final fit the breech plug before I start letting in the barrel.  Once the barrel is let in I then reinstall the breech/tang and let that in.  Then I install the lugs and pin the barrel.  Once the barrel is installed then, and only then, am I ready to start locating the lock.  This sequence allows me to essentially build the whole rifle around the vent.  

Next time I would think through the sequence of the build a little differently if I were you.

Best Regards,

JOhn Cholin

[The other DWS]

Perhaps I should clarify; since that might make a difference. I can see that I was imprecise in phrasing my query.
 The breechplug was properly fitted, (indexed, and indicated on the bottom flat) to the barrel then removed by Randy to simplify his fitting of the the swamped-barrel.  Inletting the breechplug and tang will be a matter of making a rough undersize inlet with chisels then a proper and cautiously precise inlet in a craftsman like manner with the breechplug properly installed.

I guess the question boils down to drilling the front lock nail through hole before of after inletting the breechplug--and it probably makes little difference,  I just don't want to screw it up

[smallpatch]

Inlet your barrel completely, including the breechplug.  Then work on your lock.  Your lock/touch hole placement will be determined by where these are. 

IF, the lock is already inlet, make sure that your touch hole will come out in the proper location first.  This will give you an opportunity to move the barrel rearward if necessary. 

In either case, the barrel should be locked down, (including the breech plug0 before you nail the lock down.

[The other DWS]

Barrel and lock are inletted, barrel is pinned in final position, lock is in final location but undrilled for nails;  even the trigger is in place and fitted tightly to the barrel.  Everything works properly (with the lock c-clamped in place) and sparks good with a nice trigger pull.

 On the mechanical parts, all that remains is re-installing the BP and inletting it. drilling and tapping the lock nails and the barrel tang bolt (or is that a "nail" too? )  oh yeah, fitting and drilling the sideplate

[Dave Faletti]

You are way past do on the breech plug inlet.  That should have been the next thing after the barrel.

[LRB]

  In your case, I don't see where it would matter about the sequence. Neither process is related to the other since both barrel and lock are already set with the vent.  If I had to pick and choose, I'd say get the tang in first, but really, it's your call. There is no wrong answer that I can see.

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Just be very careful inletting the tang (attached to the barrel)  as by using this sequence you have eliminated any wiggle room to correct mistakes if you get something out of alignment............

[Don Getz]

I think you have moved "ahead" in your building procedure.   I would install the breech plug next and get it inlet.  The
way you are approaching is somewhat more difficult, or can get screwed up.    Another idea for that front lock "bolt",
(Nail, I don't know why they call it that, it's a "bolt, or screw").   To find the proper position of that front lock bolt, I use
a depth guage to measure from the top of the barrel channel to the bottom of the barrel inlet, then transfer this measurement to the outside of the stock, even on the lock plate, and run the drill thru the lock plate and the stock at this
point, many times actually cutting a small groove in the barrel chanel inlet.   If you could look at some of the antique guns
you would find that many of them have a groove filed into the bottom of the barrel in oder to get that front lock bolt up
and away from the ramrod hole..............Don

[flehto]

Bbl, breechplug/tang , etc. I also depth mike to the bottom of the bbl channel but also drill a hole through the "web" and depth mike to the bottom of the RR hole. Subtracting .375 from this dim and the dim to the bottom of the bbl channel yields 2 lines which are the web thickness. The dim froim the bottom of the RR hole plus approx. 1/8" lays out the lower forestock dim. Of course everybody knows all this, but...there might be an exception. Using a #6-32 front lock bolt helps w/ a thin web and most of the time, I file a groove into the bbl...Good luck on your build...Fred