Author Topic: Brown Bess lock markings  (Read 5758 times)

Offline gibster

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 554
Brown Bess lock markings
« on: February 07, 2012, 08:04:30 PM »
I haven't had the chance to handle many Brown Bess's, but I haven't seen this particular lock marking before.  Also, anyone seen the RW stamp on the barrel?  Is this the makers mark?  The barrel has the standard proof marks on the left side of the breech.  Any info would be appreciated.



Offline Nate McKenzie

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1019
  • Luzerne Co. PA
    • Nathan McKenzie Gunmaker
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2012, 04:30:02 AM »
You have a Pattern 1793 musket also known as the India Pattern Type 1. I believe the RW is the barrel maker but could also be an inspector.

Offline Hudnut

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 231
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2012, 05:35:09 AM »
RW may be Richard Wilson.  The mark on the lock isn't the British Royal cipher.  The crown isn't British pattern.  Is it P Io under the crown?  Perhaps a foreign contract?

Offline nord

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1548
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2012, 05:40:59 PM »
Similar post on Antiqueguns with reply added.















Reply:

Posted by: bill curtis (78.144.92.2)
Date: January 30, 2012 08:09PM

British made for the government of Portugal. We supplied the Portugese with a lot of weaponry as they were our Allies in the wars against the French.
In Memory of Lt. Catherine Hauptman Miller 6/1/21 - 10/1/00 & Capt. Raymond A. Miller 12/26/13 - 5/15/03...  They served proudly.

Offline gibster

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 554
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2012, 07:21:23 PM »
Thanks for the info.  I have a chance to buy the musket, but wasn't sure what the marking on the lock represented.  Would this be any more collectable than the ones made for the East India company, or are they about the same  Thanks.

Offline nord

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1548
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2012, 07:34:07 PM »
I'd suggest a trip to <antiqueguns.com> to pose your questions. Bill Curtis is our resident Brit and has the credentials to address your gun properly. Bear in mind that he probably won't mention value as it makes a huge difference as to which side of the pond you happen to be on.

Personally I have no opinion on such pieces as they fall far outside my area of interest. I certainly appreciate them, but their potential value is a total mystery. Good luck and let me know if you have a problem with AG membership. I'll make sure it goes off smoothly.
In Memory of Lt. Catherine Hauptman Miller 6/1/21 - 10/1/00 & Capt. Raymond A. Miller 12/26/13 - 5/15/03...  They served proudly.

Offline TPH

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 923
Re: Brown Bess lock markings
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2012, 06:37:11 PM »
As stated in at least one forum where this has been posted, it is a Brazilian Baker Rifle, not a Brown Bess musket. The lock mark denotes Pedro I who ruled the Empire of Brazil from 1822 to 1831.

Brazil separated from the United Kingdom of Portugal, Brazil and the Algarves (1815 to 1822) in 1822 but had been a Portuguese colony from 1500 to 1815 and Portugal is/was Britain's oldest ally. They were supplied with weapons by British makers for their military and obviously Brazil continued the practice of buying arms from British suppliers.

This was never a British rifle, it was made expressly for Brazil to the British pattern. As such, it stands separate from British guns when assessing value, Portuguese and Brazilian guns of this period are scarce to rare or at least not often seen but all things being equal (condition, etc.), a British gun will usually fetch a higher price since their are more collectors of British arms. What that value is will be hard to determine, it is certainly beyond my means.
T.P. Hern