Any tips to share on Track of the Wolf rifle kits?

[Firelock]

I have just started my first build in 20 years. I'm using a Track of the Wolf Bucks county rifle kit. I was wondering if any of you have an tips to share on working with TOW kits?

One thing I've already been surprised by is how undersized the barrel channel is on this stock. I had to inlet the full length of the barrel channel before I could seat the barrel. I built a dozen rifles in the late '70s and early 80s and I never had a stock that the barrel didn't fit into right from the git-go. Usually I just had to inlet the last inch or two of the barrel channel.

I don't know if all TOW barrel channel are this tight or this was a unique case.

Anyway, I'd welcome any insights from other TOW kit builders.

[johntulle]

Yes, I've had the same thing on an Isaac Haines and a Fusil de Chasse.  They get their stocks from the the same outfit that supplies Jim Chambers, according to Barbie. 
Maybe erring on the small side is better?  You won't know the exact dimensions of a barrel until after you smooth the flats with a file anyway.  Even the most simple kits require some work. 
Just take it slow and careful.

And enjoy the experience!

John 

[elk killer]

almost all the stocks that TOW uses, come from Pecatonica River.
NOTICE i said almost all,, most of the time you can get a whole lot better price stock wise,
if you get the stock direct from Pecatonica, never hurts to just call and ask..

[Firelock]

This is the first gun I've built from a kit. In the past I'd get a pre-carved stock and select components individually. But, as I said, it has been 20 years since I built a flintlock, and I was seduced by the labor saving potential of the kits, particularly the pre-inletted lock mortice.

The reason I posted this is to find out anything useful that you who have gone before me already know. Like are the mortices for the lock or triggers in the right places, or did you have to move and fill. I'm also wondering about whether you had enough wood on the butt stock to install the butt plate, or if you had to do and size reduction to the butt plate to make it work...stuff like that...

[Pete G.]

Most of the stocks have plenty of wood left for shaping. It is easy to leave too much on and end up with a fat rifle if you're not careful.

[Dave B]

I too had a very snug barrel fit on a TOW Fusil De Chasse  Kit. I had to slide the barrel back a little extra to get the touch hole placement right for the lock inlet but apart from that it went together with out a hitch. The owner just loves it. I wouldnt mind building one for my self. It had a Colraine 20 ga barrel 42"long

[draken]

I've built two of their Bivins 1760 rifles.   Really good wood, but needed to remove fair amount of wood from barrel channel  My only complaint about the parts would be the Wax cast brass hardware.   I just plain hate filing that stuff!

[davebozell]

Sounds like the tight barrel is pretty common, as I ran into the same problem with one of their Colonial kits.  Filing the barrel flats has pretty much taken care of the problem for me.  I also had to move the barrel inlet back about 5/8" to get the touch hole to line up correctly. 

There has been plenty of wood around the butt plate.  I've also been amazed at how much wood I've had to take away from the lock panel area, both in width and length.  All of my castings are sand cast, so they've needed a fair amount of work to get in presentable shape.  As was mentioned earlier, slow and careful is best.

[Captchee]

I was seduced by the labor saving potential of the kits, particularly the pre-inletted lock mortice.

 if your thinking that  by paying ToW inletting fee , your going to get a drop in  parts assembly , your going to be sadly mistaken .
  The barrel may fit the barrel channel but your going to have to inlet the tang  and  in some cases  finish inletting the barrel  down into proper  depth for the lock .
 Your lock inlet . Well its going to look real nice . Right up until you go to drop the lock in and  find it wont fit . Not only will the inlet not be deep enough . But it wont be large enough . SO in so many words you will still be doing the inletting that  will show  .  All you did was pay for some wood to be routed out .
 Top that off  . IF you paid to have the lock inlet ,you better set the lock before  inletting the rest of the barrel   because chances are that your going to have to move the barrel back  in order to get the  flash hole or  bolster  to align properly . well unless you want to drill into the breech plug

 Butt plate ? Well now they will take off a bunch of the wood that’s under the plate . Picture this .
 Lay the butt plate up to the stock . Trace it . Now take a gouge . Staying ¼ inch inside your lines , just start digging out wood . that’s the inletting  I see all to often from ToW .
 so again you end up inletting the butt plate

 In their defense, its not their fault either .  They are not selling you a gun in the white . if thats what you want then thats what you need to buy . So IMO don’t waste your money with the inletting or drilling fee's . Just get the stock with the barrel channel and RR hole drilled  and do the rest yourself . Because you will be doing it anyway . it wont save you any time . in fact  if you dont watch what your doing , it can make it harder

As to the pre-carves not having enough wood . There is plenty of wood .
 Frankly IMO everything is a minimum of ¼ inch over size .. .
With inletting  its at least ¼ undersized.

[Firelock]

Good stuff. That's why I asked the question.

In the past, just starting with a pre-carved stock,
 I inletted the barrel and tang, pinned the barell, then inletted the lock.

But, based on this info, I'll inlet the lock plate next and see if I need to move the barrel channel back before I fit the tang and inlet it.

[davebozell]

So, are the traits of the TOTW "kits" typical of what is available today?  I've only worked on one so far, so I have no frame of reference.

[smallpatch]

dave,

TOW kits are VERY generic.  I think that's what you're going to find with most of their kits. 
If you HAVE to build a kit, use a Chamber's.  Built architecturally correct from original guns, soft brass hardware, 90% inletted.  Good quality, great folks.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I think my question is this:  What were your expectations?  Think of a 'kit' as simply a parts set.  It's up to you to know what to do, and do it yourself.  That process is going to be a learning curve, but you'll benefit from the experience.  I've built about a dozen rifles and guns from TOW's 'kits', and cannot remember any weird difficulties at all.  Personally, I much prefer an inlet to be too small than the alternative.

[welafong1]

 i brougt a becks  stock from them what i got was a     stock that was so twisted beound use. to top that  off  that where the tang stoped ther where signs of off carving i did not send it bac ki was so *#)*^~ off that i now longer order any thing thing from them
richard westerfield

[Dr. Tim-Boone]

Must be an iPhone response Richard???

[bgf]

I've never used a TOTW kit, but I did use a precarved (not inlet) stock from them.  The barrel channel was too small and it had twisted.  On the good side, it was a nice piece of somewhat curly maple (semi-fancy) that cost about the same as a basic rifle blank, and a lot of arthritis pain was saved by the preliminary wood removal !  I might use another precarved from them (with reservations), but I'd skip the pre-inlets since they restrict what parts you can use and none of that inletting is particularly difficult.

The kits they show (which I looked at long ago) are pretty much basic assemblies of pieces -- what you might choose to make a "generic" rifle from school "X".  Nothing wrong with that and it might save you trying to find the odd piece, but I've seen a lot of rifles built from those "kits" and they tend to be very similar when built by relatively inexperienced builders.  Someone good can make a gorgeous rifle with them, though. 

[mlrifleNY]

  I just finished a rifle from one of there kits. It was a Bivins style with a C weight 50cal. barrel. It came out good, not great. I need to get the carving I like down better, but anyways I had no great difficulties with the parts. The lock was not cut in and I like it that way much better. I would have no problem buying from them again.


Jim

[Firelock]

To Mr. Sapergia,

I'd never worked from a kit before and I wanted the insights of those who have. I'm not complaining about the kit, but getting this feedback helps.

For instance if I'd followed my usual procedure with a pre-carved stock of inletting the barrel and tang, and then pinning the barrel before inletting the lock, I might have been mighty unhappy if I discovered the barrel needed to move a quarter of an inch backwards to line up the touch hole with the pan. With the un-inletted, pre-carved stocks I used in the past, I let my touch hole determine where I'd inlet the lock.

But, now that I've heard from others that the barrel might have to move back, I know to finish inletting the lock plate before installing and inletting the breech plug and pinning the barrel to the stock.

I'm not complaining about the kit. I just want to know areas that I'll have to approach differently than on my previous builds.

It is easier to ask questions first, than it is to plug holes and fix problems later.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Boy, you've said a lot, and it's apparent that you've learned well not to trust any companies idea of lay-out.  And there is always a lot of wood to come off a pre-carved stock, less perhaps with TRS efforts.

[davebozell]

No complaints from me either.  I was just curious if my experience was typical of a pre-carved stock from anyone else.  I agree that skipping the pre-inlet is probably a good idea, as you lose a great deal of flexibility.  While I'm not anywhere close to being finished with this first build, it's hard to not look toward whatever the "next" build might be.  I'm sure that whoever I use next time, I'll be better prepared because of my experience with this gun.  My next gun probably won't be a "kit", since it's not all that difficult to pick out components once you've put one together.