Author Topic: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks  (Read 23624 times)

Offline Tim Crosby

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #25 on: January 18, 2013, 04:19:42 PM »
 A Real Beauty, Well done.

  Tim C.

Offline Roger Fisher

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2013, 06:49:30 PM »
Some guy's products just tick the ol timers off ;)

Offline WadePatton

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2013, 08:01:14 PM »
as my GC pals are wont to say,

GAW JUSS



(GC=georgia cracker)
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Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #28 on: January 18, 2013, 08:01:29 PM »
About the stain...in the past using AF I have been impatient and used the heat gun to dry the solution.  I had a tendency toward a muddy brown colour that did not accentuate the curl, but disguised it.  This time, I let the AF dry overnight.  When I came down to the shop in the morning, the wood had quite a green hue, much like a piece of treated fence board.  I was confident that the AF had been fully absorbed.  I applied another application of the same stuff, hoping for even more iron in the wood.  I was surprised to see the green hue disappear, but I kept at it anyway.  I let it dry again, thoroughly, and then blushed it with a heat gun.  Now this is a very hard and close grained piece of maple, and the curl was not particularly evident throughout the build...I knew it was going to be 'weak'.  But the colour I got was very much like the colour of rifles pictured in many of the reference books I have - Moravian Longrifles ...Revolution, and my brand new Lancaster Rifles book by Hornsberger.  Though the curl isn't as sharp and black as I would like, it is certainly evident, especially in sunlight.  My experience with AF grows, little by little.  Sometime, I'd like someone who knows what they're doing, such as Gary Brumfield, to do a bit of a tutorial, talking about AF from crystals and that from acid and iron solution.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline James

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #29 on: January 18, 2013, 10:25:31 PM »
Thanks for the description Taylor. I am also curious if there is a difference between using water as the solvent or denatured alcohol as the solvent as far as the end result.
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tyro

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #30 on: January 18, 2013, 10:57:19 PM »
I just saw the style I'll use for my m/l rifles Now I'm reellly getting antsy to get back to my tools...maybe if I print  copies of the pics and sleep on them some of your talent will osmose to me....TY

tyro

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #31 on: January 18, 2013, 11:26:04 PM »
Taylor,
  Is there a source for a measured drawing or a pattern for that stock?  I've only done replacement or repairs and had the original stocks to work with...my first stock was carved from oak that I salvaged from a fire (don't laugh it's the only wood that I had at the time and U wouldn't believe what all I made from it) but I have never done a period m/l...until this rifle I was planing to copy an 1873 Springfield stock...my eye has been tainted by modern cartridge arms, I guess...but I truly like the lines of this rifle.  Thanks TY

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2013, 11:59:33 PM »
I don't know what the difference would be ifthe crystals were dissolved in alcohol rather than water.  I'd think that the alcohol may penetrate further into the wood carrying the iron with it, and it would definitely dry more quickly.  As to the finished colour, perhaps others can comment, as I have no experience (yet) with this solution.

Tyro, TOW (and others likely) sells a print of an Isaac haines rifle that very closely approximates this rifle.  This rifle is patterned from the last of the Haines rifles exhibited in RCA 1, I think.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2013, 12:01:40 AM by D. Taylor Sapergia »
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Dr. Tim-Boone

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #33 on: January 19, 2013, 12:32:35 AM »
I did a comparison test a couple of years ago with Ferric Nitrate crystals in distilled water vs. in alcohol.  I could see no difference in final appearance.... less grain raising and I think penetrated deeper??
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Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #34 on: January 19, 2013, 01:05:41 AM »
One of the neat things about Ferric Nitrate or AF, is that when it's blushed, you will have a hard time to remove it.  You can steel wool the heck out of it, or even sand with 400, and you won't remove the colour like you would if you'd used alcohol based stains.
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

tyro

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #35 on: January 19, 2013, 06:51:59 AM »
Taylor,
   Thanks for info. on the pattern...I've got 2 45cal barrels and locks 1 pistol, 1 rifle... all I need now is a bit of wood and an awful lot of talent to catch up with U. Thanks again for the info, TY   

JTPotter

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #36 on: January 19, 2013, 08:10:45 AM »
Really nice! thats chambers standard wood!
really nice stuff.

JTPotter

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #37 on: January 19, 2013, 08:26:53 AM »
Also, the finish on the metal is exactly what I'm looking for! can you elaborate
on your process? PLEASE!

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #38 on: January 19, 2013, 08:45:22 PM »
There are four metal finishes, that I can think of anyway.  The barrel is draw-filed and polished to 180 grit abrasive cloth.  It is browned using Neider's formula from Angier's book on bluing and browning.  The solution I have was made up for me by a gunsmith in Marysville, BC  He gave me a whole vanilla bottle full of it and I've been using it for several years now.  I use a damp box made of plywood that has two incandescent bulbs - one in the bottom to heat the pan of water, and the other in the middle of the box to bring the inside temperature up to ~ 100 F.  It is made using Biven's instructions.  Each application stays in the box for ~ 3 hrs, after which time the barrel is rubbed down hard with a tight hard roll of canvas, to remove the surface scale.  For a more polished look, use clean steel wool to card off the loose rust.   Five or six applications will yield this somewhat matte but very smooth finish.  I apply the solution using cotton balls I bought at the drug store.  I pour the liquid into a shot cup.  Here don't get it mixed up with the one with the single malt Scotch!  The cotton ball is emursed and then squeezed out.  the surface of the barrel is wet with the stuff using slow full length strokes.  It doesn't hurt if you need to overlap, but I try not to rub the barrel.  It does not 'copper' the steel like Laurel Mt. Forge's stuff.  In this case, I started browning the barrel (and the lock) at 7:30 am and I took the parts out at 9:30 pm.  I left then on the bench overnight, since I had company and killed the rust in the morning first by scrubbing with a supersaturated solution of baking soda and water, then poured boiling water over the barrel slowly lengthwise.  This heats the barrel, flushes the surface, and then I oiled it with a towel and motor oil.  The water evaporates from the heat of the steel.  When it cooled off, I pulled the muzzle plug and unscrewed the breech plug  (a brass plug about 4" long threaded on one end 3/4' x 16 and on the other 5/8" x 18).  Then I rubbed the barrel down with a dry towel, and except for re-installing the sights and the breech plug, it's done.  Whooo!

The lock I polished to 1200, but that's not really necessary if you're going to brown it.  To 220 is lots.  I polished the frizzen spring and the lock screws, and the trigger to 1200 grit paper, and fire blued them.  I like the contrast between the shiny blue and the matte brown, though it looks good with a lock 'in the white' just as well.

The other screws- tang, lock bolts, top jaw, and butt plate screws are case hardened and burnished with a medium wire wheel.  These screws are going to see some wear and abuse and case hardening them keeps them nice for a lot longer than not doing it.

The brass is polished to 600 grit and burnished with four ought steel wool.  It's important during the last rub down with 600 that you go in only one direction - lengthwise.

So that's about it...hope I didn't miss anything.

« Last Edit: January 19, 2013, 08:45:50 PM by D. Taylor Sapergia »
D. Taylor Sapergia
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Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

Offline Kevin Houlihan

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #39 on: January 19, 2013, 09:54:50 PM »
Taylor,
So I take it that a frizzen spring can be fire blued without ruining the temper?
Thanks,
Kevin

Offline smart dog

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #40 on: January 19, 2013, 10:40:16 PM »
Hi Snap,
Leaf springs are typically tempered at about 675-750 degrees F depending on the metal, thickness, and desired stiffness.  Fire bluing requires heating to 550-575 degrees.  Consequently, you can fire blue without ruining the temper of the spring if you are careful.

dave 
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Offline Bob Roller

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #41 on: January 19, 2013, 11:15:17 PM »
I have fire blued many main,sear and frizzen springs with the tip of a
Bernz-o-Matic torch.I have an adaptor I made for this torch that pin
points the flame to a very confined area and easy to control.

Bob Roller

Rick G.

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #42 on: January 20, 2013, 12:46:57 AM »
I am finishing up a Chambers I. Haines as well, but my lock is different. It appears to have the same dimensions but the hammer is smaller. It's left hand. Does that make a difference? The stock had to be cut in a curved gouge for the hammer to clear the wood and strike the frizzen.

Offline Lucky R A

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #43 on: January 20, 2013, 02:59:15 PM »
Rick,
      Only the large Siler is made in a left hand version.  It appears that Taylor used a Golden age Siler lock in his build.
Cutting a relief for the hammer usually has to be done to allow the hammer stop to correctly contact the top of the lock plate.  Keeping your lock moldings narrow, and making sure that the wood around you lock is no higher than the bottom of the bevel around your lock plate will eliminate any large relief cuts. 

Ron
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Rick G.

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #44 on: January 20, 2013, 06:48:00 PM »
Thanks, Ron. The relief cut is kinda half moon shaped on my rifle. I'm relieved that it's ok, and correct.... :)

wetzel

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #45 on: January 21, 2013, 07:06:13 PM »
Taylor,
For guys like me who live far from other builders and the ability to receive mentoring, the info freely and unselfishly you share in your posts is greatly appreciated!!! I scour them and the posts of others placed by members on this board to glean as much information as I can. Thank you for taking the time to explain in detail things that to you may seem simple and even might have been covered in the past. I can imagine the tremendous amounts of time it takes to take the pictures, post them up, and then write up the details. I just wanted to say thank you, to you and the other builders on this forum. Your time and effort are greatly appreciated!

Offline D. Taylor Sapergia

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #46 on: January 21, 2013, 09:12:33 PM »
It means a great deal to me to get that kind of feed-back.  When I build a rifle for a friend, I always take a series of pictures to keep him/her up to date in the progress, and when I'm done, I burn them to a disc, so that in years to come, they can look back at the evolution of the piece.  Very few of those who order a rifle from me have the skill/patience/tools/time/etc to do the work themselves, so they really like to see the in-progress pictures.  I know I like to see them posted here too, by other builders.  I learn so much from other builders, and get a lot of motivation and inspiration from the interchange.  I think that's what this site is all about.
D. Taylor Sapergia
www.sapergia.blogspot.com

Art is not an object.  It is the excitement inspired by the object.

mupperm

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Re: Isaac Haines - from Chambers Flintlocks
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2013, 02:18:07 AM »
very nice rifle!!!  now if my first one is half as good ill be happy!