Forming BP from sheet ??

[SuperCracker]

Over the weekend I was messing around with some brass sheet and for practice roughed out a buttplate. Now I have a question for you guys making fowling gun BPs from sheet.


When you're making one with some compound curve at the top are you guys making the buttplate and then inletting it, or are you shaping the butt of the stock, then using it as a buck to form the sheet around as you mount it? I can see both approaches having their merits.


Turned out decent for not having done this kind of metal work in 15 or 20 years.

[JDK]

Nice work Shane.  I especially like the profile of that piece....nice shape to the heel.

I'll defer to others on the inletting advice.  Enjoy, J.D.

[keweenaw]

I think you've answered your own question in making the piece you made.  Since almost all the work has to be done from the inside of the piece you're making having a shaped out butt on the stock isn't all that useful. 

Tom

[rich pierce]

The only way to form it on the butt is like a Carolina Gun where the tang is screwed or nailed down then the rest bent and peened over.  I think it would be hard to get the "knee" or "elbow" shape on the gun.  A simpler corner, yes, but anneal or it will eventually crack.  Of course that never happened on originals. 

[TMerkley]

What did you use under the sheet brass to support it as you worked the curveture with the ball-peen? 

[SuperCracker]

Actually, I got it started from the inside over a tightly packed shot bag, then 90% of it was done from the outside shrinking the corners over a scrap of 2x4  with the corners rough rasped round. After the picture I did tap out the dimples from the inside over a chunk of lead though.

What got me thinking about it was seeing a couple of sheet plates attached with nails. I was thinking it would be possible to shape the butt, inlet and nail down the comb extension, then form the rest down over the butt. It seemed reasonable, but you're right Rich, there would be no way to anneal it like that. I was concentrating on the forming process and didn't think about that.

[Chris Treichel]

From armoring, yea some stuff rumbling arround in my brain... there are two ways to make a curve like that... you can pound it into a bowl where you stretch out the inside and make it thinner or pound it over a stake which makes the sides thinner.  Both devices are easy enough to make...  For brass you will need to aneal often or risk cracking and tearing.

A simple bowl can be made from a log with a hole carved into it a bit wider and deeper than the raising you wish to do. Lead is also pretty easy to work on or clay in a pinch even dirt will work.

The Stake can be as simple as a trailer hitch or a ball bearing welded to piece of steel or a ball peen hammer minus the handle driven into a hole in a log. 

Important things to note... any imperfections in the hammer or anvil (stake or bowl) will be transferred onto your work. You want both to be as smooth and polished as possible.

[David R. Pennington]

I've never tried brass but iron fowler style is easily done with nothing more than a good hardwood stump. The hot iron burns its own form into the wood as you shape it. Don't use pine, you can do it but the smoke will choke you. I suppose with brass you could use the same method only you would have to carve your mould since it would be worked annealed and cold.
What you have done looks very good so I'd say your method works!

[mjm46@bellsouth.net]

Nice Job Chris. What thickness of brass did you use?

[Joe S]

David R.

What kind of steel do you use to make fowler butt plates?

[David R. Pennington]

Joe S.
Truthfully, junk. I had an old iron threshold plate I took out of an old house that measures about .138" thick. Just a little more than 1/8" I think. I've cut a couple pieces out of it and still have enough left to do a couple more.
I know using junk is HC. A lot of original forged work I've seen has evidence of being made from recycled material. I have an old forge shovel that the handle is forged from an old barn door hasp.

[SuperCracker]

Nice Job Chris. What thickness of brass did you use?

For the one I tapped out in the pics above I was using .050 sheet that I can't remember where I got it, probably Grainger, I get a lot of stuff from them.

[rich pierce]

I've used thick stuff just because I had it.  A door plate of 1/8" brass is tough to pound out and stretches so much in the process that's it's tough to know how big a piece is required at the start.  Plus lots of annealing.  Since then I've bought brass sheet 1/16" thick for such projects.