SIGHTS

[hortonstn]

i know we all like to put traditional sights on our longrifles but when shooting in competive matches what type do you shoot sometimes the original style sights
don't allow the true accuracy of the barrel (does that make since??)
paul
piks are appreciated

[pushboater]

I guess it all depends on where the matches are being shot and what their rules are.  Most competitions shoots lay out their rules in advance in regards to the type of sights that will be permitted.  Call ahead, find out what they'll permit you to use and change your sights accordingly.  Primitive matches usually require primitive sights.  The NRA website in regards to Blackpowder competition shooting says, "Any metallic sights with or without clicks, including open, aperture or tube are allowed.  No optics other than sight correcting shooting glasses, rear sight diopters and colored non magnifying rear sight filters are permitted.  Black Powder Military rifles must have sights basically of original design."  Every competition has their own rules.  Use what you find works best for you while staying within the rules of the specific competition you're shooting in.  Everyone is different in regards to the type of sights they prefer.  Have fun.

Capt. David

[Acer Saccharum]

Accurate shooting and low barleycorn sights don't agree with each other.

Square top sharp front sight, .06 to .08 wide, and a square sharp rear sight are best for me. I make the notch wide enough so the front sight appears crisp thru the opening. Sight opening varies with age.

Last shoot I went to, I had to choose one of my front sights to use, the left or the right one. I picked the darkest one. By the end of the day, I forgot about the second sight, my mind must have erased it, or my vision got better with some coffee in me. Oh, well, I had fun.

Tom

[Blind Dog]

How do you cut a nice square notch into the real sight? My files don't seem to give me what I want. I usually end up with a "V" rather than a nice square bottom.

[Paul Griffith]

How do you cut a nice square notch into the real sight? My files don't seem to give me what I want. I usually end up with a "V" rather than a nice square bottom.

Unless you have some sort of devine ability with a file it takes a milling machine.

Paul

[Long Ears]

I do mine with small square file with both wide faces safe. Only the edge still has teeth. It would take a pretty fine end mill cutter to use a mill? I also move my rear sight out to 14" from the breach so it is somewhat clear for my aging eyes.... Bob

[gunmaker]

Those small files come in sets, commonly called needle files, jewelry files or rifflers.  Most are less then 1/16" thick and have many contours, round, 1/2 round, triangle & flats with teeth on all sides or only 1 or 2 sides.  Choose one that gives you what you want---or grind one to your needs. 

[Hungry Horse]

 The best advice I ever received on iron sights, was a reference in a book about Teddy Roosevelt. His eye sight was notoriously bad from day one. He used a iron rear sight, with a gradual V, that terminated in a small round bottomed notch. The front sight was a small barley corn, or bead. I have had every type of iron sight money can buy, and none compare with this one for old eyes. The gradual V naturally draws your eye to the notch, and like eye exercises the optometrist prescribes strengthens the eye. the round bottomed notch leaves no room for 'Judgement calls", it either is or it isn't right.
 I own an original full stocked squirrel rifle, that has this exact sight arrangement on it. I have shot better with this sight system, than I ever did with the modified Patridge sights that everybody raves about.

                            Hungry Horse

[Don Getz]

As Paul, the chunker said, a milling machine works great.    I did many that way, holding the barrel in the milling machine so
that the sight is on the side.  I then used a slitting saw, about 1" in diameter, about .040 wide.  You can make several cuts
until the slot is as wide as you need.......Don

[T*O*F]

How do you cut a nice square notch into the real sight?

A. Hacksaw and then touch up with a flat needle file.
B. Pillar files.
C. Slotting files

There are zillions of different types of specialty files.  If you want to spend the bucks, you just buy the one that suits your purpose.  You don't find them at the hardware store.

[P.W.Berkuta]

As Paul, the chunker said, a milling machine works great.    I did many that way, holding the barrel in the milling machine so
that the sight is on the side.  I then used a slitting saw, about 1" in diameter, about .040 wide.  You can make several cuts
until the slot is as wide as you need.......Don

+1, I also find this to be the best and there are different thickness of slitting saws --  . If you don't have a mill then files or a hacksaw will have to do but I could never get the slot just right.

[Curtis]

How do you cut a nice square notch into the real sight?

A. Hacksaw and then touch up with a flat needle file.
B. Pillar files.
C. Slotting files

There are zillions of different types of specialty files.  If you want to spend the bucks, you just buy the one that suits your purpose.  You don't find them at the hardware store.

What Dave said +2.  Quick, efficient, and if you are careful, quite neat and tidy.

Curtis

[Acer Saccharum]

I use a small flat needle file with teeth on the edge. Saw cut first, then widen and deepen until I can see the front sight with no mirage thru the notch.


To do a test, make fake sight from black electric tape so it stands up above the barrel. Fold a 1/2" section of the tape together, and stick both ends on the top barrel flat. Cut a notch in it with knife,scissors, etc, until you have a notch width that gives you a good sight picture. Try it in different light conditions.

Then that gives you a starting point for cutting the real sight notch.

[hortonstn]

thanks guys good ideas...
paul

[T*O*F]

I use a small flat needle file with teeth on the edge.

Acer,
Sometimes some suggestions given in various postings set my teeth on edge too. 

Just remembered another way.  Dremel has fiber cut-off wheels that cut nice slots too.
In the final analysis, I never seem to do anything the same way twice.  I use whatever happens to be laying on my bench that will work.  Otherwise, I'd waste too much time looking for the ideal tool that I misplaced the last time I used it.

Follow Clint Eastwood's advice in Heartbreak Ridge...........Adapt and Overcome!! 
They tell me there are many ways to skin a cat.  I've never skinned one....I just shoot em and thrown em in the garbage.

[P.W.Berkuta]

I use a small flat needle file with teeth on the edge.

Acer,
Sometimes some suggestions given in various postings set my teeth on edge too. 

Just remembered another way.  Dremel has fiber cut-off wheels that cut nice slots too.
In the final analysis, I never seem to do anything the same way twice.  I use whatever happens to be laying on my bench that will work.  Otherwise, I'd waste too much time looking for the ideal tool that I misplaced the last time I used it.

Follow Clint Eastwood's advice in Heartbreak Ridge...........Adapt and Overcome!! 
They tell me there are many ways to skin a cat.  I've never skinned one....I just shoot em and thrown em in the garbage.

FUNNY - I love it - my dad thought the same, we be out hunting and he see a cat and said "look a tiger is about to attack us" and then BLAM - no more cat! He justified his actions by telling me that that cat would be killing the quail, rabbits, and other game so if the cat was a pet then the owners should keep the cat at home!

[Pvt. Lon Grifle]

Be aware of your own eyesight's  astigmatism. It will make good front and rear sights look slanted on top of the blade, or slanted on the bottom of a square notch.  

[spiderman852]

Pvt. , I have noticed that! How do you overcome it? Do you file the front sight at an angle?

Mike

[Sawatis]

Hey Since we're on this topic...Got a question: Ive sen a few original longrifles and some Jaegers with folding leaf rear sights (anywhere from 1 leaf to 4!)...Have any of y'all made rifles with these?  I'm thinking of making one for the next build I have coming and hope to glean some of y'alls inherent wisdom in the construction and plan for sighting these little puppies in.
John

[KLMoors]

I'm working on a gun that will be similar to a "Twigg" English sporting rifle from the 1760's/70's. The original has folding leaf sights on it.

I got the folding kit from Track of the Wolf for their Jaeger guns and I filed it to a different shape to approximate the English version.  I used this sight:

http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/880/3/RS-JAEG-2

It had plenty of meat where I needed it to allow me to re-shape it.

For sighting it in, I plan on finding a good shooting load for the rifle first.  Then filing the sights as needed for medium and long range shots depending on how that gun shoots that particular load.

[duca]

The best advice I ever received on iron sights, was a reference in a book about Teddy Roosevelt. His eye sight was notoriously bad from day one. He used a iron rear sight, with a gradual V, that terminated in a small round bottomed notch. The front sight was a small barley corn, or bead. I have had every type of iron sight money can buy, and none compare with this one for old eyes. The gradual V naturally draws your eye to the notch, and like eye exercises the optometrist prescribes strengthens the eye. the round bottomed notch leaves no room for 'Judgement calls", it either is or it isn't right.
 I own an original full stocked squirrel rifle, that has this exact sight arrangement on it. I have shot better with this sight system, than I ever did with the modified Patridge sights that everybody raves about.

                            Hungry Horse

Hi all, Hungry Horse, Do you have a picture of this Sight set-up. I would love to try it. Thanks;
                                                                                                                                       Anthony, aka Duca

[sweed]

The best advice I ever received on iron sights, was a reference in a book about Teddy Roosevelt. His eye sight was notoriously bad from day one. He used a iron rear sight, with a gradual V, that terminated in a small round bottomed notch. The front sight was a small barley corn, or bead. I have had every type of iron sight money can buy, and none compare with this one for old eyes. The gradual V naturally draws your eye to the notch, and like eye exercises the optometrist prescribes strengthens the eye. the round bottomed notch leaves no room for 'Judgement calls", it either is or it isn't right.
 I own an original full stocked squirrel rifle, that has this exact sight arrangement on it. I have shot better with this sight system, than I ever did with the modified Patridge sights that everybody raves about.

                            Hungry Horse

I learned to shoot with this arrangement. It has the advantage of various ranges once you learn your rifle. Draw down really fine if you're stretchering, and if you're close you show a little more bead. Good to find a mid-range profile that you can compare to the size of the bead. I E compare the size of the bead to the head of your game, and know that range, and POI. Simmiler to using mil-dots on optical sights. Sounds complicated, but simple once you get it.

[Mark Elliott]

Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see anyone mention sight files.   They are very thin files designed to file rear sight notches.    I have two different thicknesses, but you can get many different thicknesses.    I bought mine from Brownells.   I use a hacksaw with a 32 tooth blade to cut a slot, then I finish it with a slightly wider sight file.     With the files I use,  the 16ga silver front sight blade is just narrower than than the rear sight notch when viewed through it.   When properly sighted,  I have a thin band of light on both sides of the front sight.   Then all I have to do in concentrate on lining up the tops of the sights.   Given that my vision is not so good,  I need the bit of light around the front sight to get it aligned correctly.   It works for me.    I can at least shoot well enough that way to get a gun sighted in for a customer.

[Pvt. Lon Grifle]

With respect to my astigmatism, I always make sure the top of the FS is in fact true to the barrel flat, likewise the top flat edge of the RS. The RS slot is carefully filed at a right angle to the top flat edge to form the correct width giving me enough opening width to see the FS clearly.  If a little astigmatism distortion shows in the bottom of the slot, I ignore it as I shoot off the top of the blade, with the top of the blade even with the top of the RS.  Lon

[omark]

I use a small flat needle file with teeth on the edge.

Acer,
Sometimes some suggestions given in various postings set my teeth on edge too. 

Just remembered another way.  Dremel has fiber cut-off wheels that cut nice slots too.
In the final analysis, I never seem to do anything the same way twice.  I use whatever happens to be laying on my bench that will work.  Otherwise, I'd waste too much time looking for the ideal tool that I misplaced the last time I used it.

Follow Clint Eastwood's advice in Heartbreak Ridge...........Adapt and Overcome!! 
They tell me there are many ways to skin a cat.  I've never skinned one....I just shoot em and thrown em in the garbage.

just jam their heads in a boot jack and jerk on their tail.      mark