Author Topic: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840  (Read 4813 times)

Offline Dphariss

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Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« on: February 03, 2014, 05:07:21 AM »
This is apparently a western trade rifle. It was unused still having a burr from the drill around the vent when these photos were taken something like 30 years ago.

This rifle could be a poster child for the dismal state of the American Longrifle that some had fallen to by 1840. The sad part is that as time progressed they got much worse.
Barrel was just under 1" straight and was 54 caliber. The relationship of the cock to the frizzen was such that I wondered if it would even spark reliably. Maybe that was why it was unused.

Dan









 There are more photos of this Connestoga Rifleworks (Leman) rifle with a 1840 dated lock at
https://s72.photobucket.com/user/DPhariss/library/ML%20Guns?sort=6&page=1
« Last Edit: February 16, 2021, 08:23:43 PM by Ky-Flinter »
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Offline Tanselman

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2014, 07:22:29 AM »
This rifle might deserve a little closer look before we chastise it too severely. It appears, at least to my eyes from the photos provided, to be well used and "worked on" at some time. The rear sight is sits farther back than normally placed, the lock bolt screw looks modern, and I would guess the gun was originally percussion with its single lock bolt on a PA gun, but now has a bushed flash hole from a suspect later conversion to a flint lock. It would be good to see a close-up of the current lock and flash hole to see if they are original to the rifle, or later modifications which I suspect. 

I would think when new, the gun was in fact an effective shooter, functioned well, but made for the common man who had a limited budget. A lot of fine, attractive rifles were still being made in the 1840s, as were a lot of lower cost rifles for those who could not afford the nicer ones. The same was true during the Golden Age, both great rifles and common (low cost) rifles were made... since we've always had both wealthy and poor citizens who needed a rifle.  Shelby Gallien 

Offline B Shipman

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2014, 08:07:18 AM »
History repeats itself. Conestoga was the CHEAP end of Leman. So that he could separate himself from it.

Online Bob Roller

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2014, 03:58:59 PM »
I don't see how it could spark vey well either.IF it sparked at all,
it would be a small burst on impact between flint and steel and I
certainly wouldn't depend on it..
Bob Roller

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2014, 09:51:32 PM »
This rifle might deserve a little closer look before we chastise it too severely. It appears, at least to my eyes from the photos provided, to be well used and "worked on" at some time. The rear sight is sits farther back than normally placed, the lock bolt screw looks modern, and I would guess the gun was originally percussion with its single lock bolt on a PA gun, but now has a bushed flash hole from a suspect later conversion to a flint lock. It would be good to see a close-up of the current lock and flash hole to see if they are original to the rifle, or later modifications which I suspect. 

I would think when new, the gun was in fact an effective shooter, functioned well, but made for the common man who had a limited budget. A lot of fine, attractive rifles were still being made in the 1840s, as were a lot of lower cost rifles for those who could not afford the nicer ones. The same was true during the Golden Age, both great rifles and common (low cost) rifles were made... since we've always had both wealthy and poor citizens who needed a rifle.  Shelby Gallien 

Apparently you only looked at the photos.
The rifle WAS unfired and unmodified.
Note the lack of chlorate damage to the barrel and note the wood behind the fence.
The rifle came from an estate in Montana and I seriously doubt anyone bothered to convert it, if it was it was extremely well done on a gun that had little collector value 30+ years ago.

The bore was new and shiney as I recall.


I DID look at it closer since I took the photos and had access for several hours. There was NO wear to the varnish, no wear to the metal parts. Nothing other than what one would call storage wear and tear.  While it is in some ways shaped fairly well the installation of parts was sloppy.
Since I took these photos at a gunshow over 30 years ago its not likely I will come up with more photos of any import the best ones are the ones posted. I do know, as previously stated, that it still had a burr around the vent from the drill. For that matter I had no Macro lens anyway.

I also know what Connestoga was. There are rev-war guns that are really poorly laid out. Then increasingly after perhaps 1830 the "shoot inlays at the stock with a shotgun" approach to decoration became popular apparently if enough metal was put in the stock the ugliness of the design did not matter. Never mind the lines or even how the inlays fit the design, just slap them suckers in there. So the art deteriorated.
I would also point out that low cost does not have to equate with ugly. There are some low cost "barn guns" or whatever one wants to call them, with very good lines and if viewed in silhouette would pass for a high end rifle. A great many excessively inlaid guns that were obviously expensive are far worse in silhouette than this Leman product.  This is one of the things I cite as deterioration of the art form. Has nothing to do with having a buttplate or carving or inlays its the basic ugliness of the rifle/gun that irks me and its carried on right to this day. Worse there are people today who make some ugly, malformed representation then put in CD collection or on a website and get congratulated for the work mostly becasue nobody will say "thats improperly shaped".

Dan
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Online JTR

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #5 on: February 03, 2014, 10:17:27 PM »
Quote
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Worse there are people today who make some ugly, malformed representation then put in CD collection or on a website and get congratulated for the work mostly becasue nobody will say "thats improperly shaped".

Dan

Feeling a bit cranky today, are ya.  ::)

John
« Last Edit: February 03, 2014, 10:18:54 PM by JTR »
John Robbins

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2014, 04:44:37 AM »
Quote
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, Worse there are people today who make some ugly, malformed representation then put in CD collection or on a website and get congratulated for the work mostly becasue nobody will say "thats improperly shaped".

Dan

Feeling a bit cranky today, are ya.  ::)



John

Not particularly, this a long term, ongoing, pet peeve.

Dan
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Offline Habu

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2014, 05:33:29 AM »
Thanks for digging these pictures out, they are far more clear here than when they appeared in the Buckskin Report.  I think I've seen about a dozen of these rifles over the years; one of the first things I always look for is the angle of the bottom of the lock plate.  Some rifles have the plate tipped a bit down at front (this particular rifle is extreme that way), some are almost perfectly parallel to the bottom of the moulding, and some are tipped slightly down in back.  I've always wondered if this was due to variations between workers doing the inletting, or if it was a sign they were just in a hurry.  

I used to have the impression that there was some variation in trigger guards, but I'm pretty sure now that they all used the same casting, and the "variation" I thought I saw was just differences in how the castings cleaned up.  From a utilitarian standpoint, I do like that triggerguard (or at least the size of the arch around the trigger): there is adequate room for the trigger finger, even when wearing a light glove.   A friend of mine used to say this was how to tell if the rifle was built for "work" or "show"; I guess that would sort of make the NW gun an extreme work gun.  
« Last Edit: February 08, 2014, 05:36:54 AM by Habu »

Offline Dphariss

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Re: Connestoga Rifle Works 1840
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2014, 05:54:23 AM »
The Buckskin Report's photo reproduction was not great.
I see Dave at least once a year and a few years ago we were talking about how much easier it would be with modern desktop publishing.
The magazine was all cut and paste (literally) then photo the pages etc. Then they would go pick them up from the printer and collate and "stitch" them together.
I need to dig out issues Shumway's articles on the Indian trade rifles and read them. I have the office set in the original folders I got from Vivian 3-4 years ago and another set I picked up from what I had left and some I picked up around town at yard sales.

Dan
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