Rond balls in fowler barrels?

[Lucky R A]

     I recently completed a 12 ga fowler using a light weight 38" Paris fowler barrel.  The bore as near as I can tell is .744.   At the muzzle the barrel is quite thin, unlike most of the fowler barrels that you get that are intended for shot or ball.  The whole gun with a full length cherry stock came in at 5-1/4 lbs.  I picked up some .735 balls and would like to try them in the gun.  I am having second thoughts.  I have fired slugs out of 12 pump guns with barrels that were about as thin.  Is this something I should be concerned about.  I really like the light little gun and hope to use it to entertain a turkey this spring.  Any thoughts on round balls in this gun would be appreciated...Ron

[bob in the woods]

I wouldn't worry about it. The breach area is plenty strong, and I doubt you'll be wanting to shoot more than 100 gr FFg in that gun anyway. 100 gr FFg and a .735 ball was my standard load for years. It accounted for deer and black bears, and would have performed well even on moose within 100 yards or so.

[Longknife]

Lucky, That barrel is closer to an 11 ga. I have fired MANY round balls out of my 12 ga (.729)  and 11 ga. (.750)  smooth bore barrels. and they are pretty thin. What I would worry about though is the ball size you chose. That is going to be a pretty tight fit with a patch, only .009 clearance. You may have to use wads and a card over the ball, or "wadding". I use a .715 in my .750 bore (.035 clearance) and .690 in my .729 bore (.039 clearance) with a thick well lubed patch of.025. I can shoot all day with this combo. Another fact to put you mind at ease is that a light shot charge for a 12 ga. smoothbore would be 73 (bore size) grains of powder and the same charger full of shot. That charger of shot weights more than a .690 ball. Same goes for the 11 bore....Have fun , blast away!!!!

I just checked barrel wall thickness at muzzle and my 12 ga. is .052 ( and this one is jug choked) and my 11 ga. is .068.....

[Daryl]

With a .744 bore, for the sake of an easily acquired mould, I'd also go with a .715, however I had Jeff Tanner cut me a .724" which would be perfect for that SB. Also- if you can wait about a week or 1 1/2 weeks for the mould, they are much cheaper than anything else you can find in obscure sizes.\- I think, about $30.00 to $40.00 would handle it. For the .744", a .720" might be even better, allowing a slightly thicker patch yet.

I like to use a thick enough patch so it holds enough lube to do the trick of keeping the fouling soft.
The .735" has less than .005" per side clearance and is too tight, imho.

[WadePatton]

With a .744 bore, for the sake of an easily acquired mould, I'd also go with a .715, however I had Jeff Tanner cut me a .724" which would be perfect for that SB. Also- if you can wait about a week or 1 1/2 weeks for the mould, they are much cheaper than anything else you can find in obscure sizes.\- I think, about $30.00 to $40.00 would handle it. For the .744", a .720" might be even better, allowing a slightly thicker patch yet.

I like to use a thick enough patch so it holds enough lube to do the trick of keeping the fouling soft [and wipes down all the fouling from the previous shot].
The .735" has less than .005" per side clearance and is too tight, imho.

[fixed it for you]


I'm sold on the bargain of Jeff Tanner's moulds, no doubt.  I see no reason to avoid the itty bitty delay in gratification and find the price uber reasonable and the leaden spheres (.530's) from mine to be plenty true and accurate.

Now then, whilst we're on the topic: Daryl, or anyone else "non-standard" what bore/ball difference would you choose when ordering a JT mould for your slickbore? -assuming an accurate actual bore measurement.

I know we traditionally use the patch material (thickness) as the last variable to compensate for bore/ball variations in size  (manufacturing tolerances), but since Jeff doesn't limit our choices of ball size from his moulds, why not "optimize" for the patch thickness we prefer?  Especially since these days, possibly more than those days, we can find a good patch material and buy a whole bolt of it for consistency in patch thickness.  I know that rifling depth/style might make this less "predictable" but I don't see how that we couldn't apply a "rule" of sorts to smoothies for sizing out moulds to match the bore and patch thickness we intend to use.  


(No I don't has one yet, but sooner or later it is bound to happen.  I have already (finally) decided that something 14-16ish is what i'd want, because i do often wonder about these things. )

[bob in the woods]

I should have noticed the bore size of .744      The gun I used the .735 ball in was .750
I have another gun which really likes the .715 or even .690 ball [ used in a paper cartridge]
I think the main point though, is that you shouldn't be worried about using round balls in your barrel.
Your anticipated charge of up to 100 gr FFg would be perfectly acceptable. I use up to 140 gr to flatten the trajectory, depending on where and what I'm hunting.  Having said that, out to 100 yards or so, I wouldn't hesitate to take on a moose with the 100 gr charge. It would certainly be up to the task.

[Lucky R A]

    Thanks for the input.  The gun will be used primarily for shot.  I have plenty of rifles from 36-62 cal for serious hunting.  I just wanted the thrill of throwing a ball down range that might better have three holes drilled into it...I will light it up a little later with both shot and a few balls.  I will probably have to use wads rather than patches, we shall see how it goes.    Thanks again. 
Ron

[Daryl]

TKS Wade.
We generally load smoothbores with 'some' compression, but usually go for .020" to .030" smaller than the bore.
My .62, with a .615" bore (choked muzzle measurement) loads very nicely with a .595" Tanner ball.
Taylor's .62, however shoots amazingly well (few can best him, even with rifles out to 100yards) using a .608" ball and heavy (.020")denim patch. He has no trouble loading that gun with the "pelter's" tapered HICKORY rod.
The .608" ball comes from a .600" Lee mould - somewhat oversize, it is, but it is quite round, so no problem- especially on those 109yard targets- or anything closer. It just GRATES to see how well that gun shoots=- in his hands.

[Lucky R A]

   The first test firing went well, with no problems.  The shot pattern of 1-1/4 oz. of shot and equal volume of 2-f Goex  were acceptable at 25 yds.  I am sure some tinkering can tighten up the pattern.  I may try some plastic shot cups etc.  The big surprise was the round balls,  I loaded 70 gr. 2-f an over powder wad, a cushion wad lubed w/ Murphy's Oil soap then a ,735 bare ball topped with an over shot wad.  Three reasonably experienced flintlock shooters shot a total of six shots into a four inch group offhand at 35 yds.  You certainly do not have to strain to see those holes in the target.  Even though the gun only weighs 5-1/4 lbs.  the recoil was no more than an average 20 ga. load.   I think I am going to have to keep this one for "All Mine."      Ron

[Daryl]

If you are going to try plastic- be aware the black powder flame CANNOT contact them- you must use cards tight and thick enough to prevent the plastic from being melted and coated onto your bore.
Rolled paper shot containers made of printing paper or "post-it notes" might be a much better idea.
If using rolled paper, experimenting with wad thickness, might allow the wad and shot to be in the same container, similar to the Ely ctgs. of the 1850's and 60's.

[Longknife]

Lucky, When I roll paper carts. I melt some stiff bees wax lube and dip the ball end in it, Have shot up to 60 rounds this way without cleaning....Ed

[bob in the woods]

Paper cartridges have become my standard as far as shooting round balls in my smoothbores.
I too dip the end containing the ball in lube; mine being made of a mix of beeswax and bear oil.
Adjust the mix as per the weather /temp conditions.