When you say Iron.....

[Brian Jordan]

Does that mean true wrought iron, or in todays standards does that mean low carbon steel?

If your were to forge your own "Iron furniture" what material would you purchase for your project?

[doug]

     I don't think you can buy true wrought iron anymore other than as scrap from some antique structure being torn down.  For the most part it is going to mean mild steel or at least low carbon steel.  I also am not sure how you would recognize true wrought iron unless it was deeply rusted as in an old anchor or by polishing and rusting to show the pattern

cheers Doug

[Ian Pratt]

The term is carried over from a time when wrought iron would have been used for mounts, and frankly "steel mounted rifle" just doesn't have the right ring to it.
 As you suggested, when using steel we typically want a low carbon alloy, I have used scrap hot rolled mild steel, misc. drops from a welding place in town, rebar pounded out flat, etc.  Of course wrought iron works beautifully - you must get some of decent quality, and have the means to bring it to the higher heat needed to work it.

[acorn20]

Fellows,
I've got some old weights from double-hung windows.  Isn't that material wrought iron and can't that be forged or is it too large to work?
Dan

[LRB]

  The ones I've seen were just cast iron.

[Dphariss]

Fellows,
I've got some old weights from double-hung windows.  Isn't that material wrought iron and can't that be forged or is it too large to work?
Dan

Cast iron is not wrought iron. Most weights are cast and cannot be made malleable short of remelting. The generally show where the sprue or flashing was broken off. These are basically scrap.
Wrought iron is very malleable and forge weldable. Much more so than even low carbon steel.

Dan

[JCKelly]

Wrought iron has not been puddled (made) in the USA since 1961. If you can find it, it is wonderful stuff for the blacksmith. One can burn it, but it will take a slightly higher temperature than mild steel before it becomes burnt.

The higher the carbon content, the easier it is to "burn" one's steel in the forge.

If you want to know what "burnt" steel is, ask your friendly blacksmith. I burn my first wrought iron shortly after I made my first and only forge weld in wrought iron. Irretrievable error. Lots of pretty sparks, but a real bad thing to do.

No antigue gun had actual "Steel" hardware, it was either forged wrought iron or malleable cast iron. Colt London revolvers had malleable iron trigger guards and grip frames, regardless of whether anyone's gun book calls them "steel" mountings.

For American flint or percussion hardware, forged mild steel would be just fine, it being a major effort to locate real wrought iron. One must use a flux of some sort, sprinked on the steel, to get it to weld when hammered together. Nature of that flux, and what is a "welding heat" is something best discussed by an experienced blacksmith.

[Sam Everly]

Most old steel bridges are wrougth iron . The big 1 1/2 dia. braces are what people die for to make wrougth iron gun barrels. Though not had forged they bring a big price.   

[Roger Fisher]

  The ones I've seen were just cast iron.

Same here!

I have built steel mounted rifles and smoothbores; but I would never call them anything 'cept iron mounted!

[Chuck Burrows]

frankly "steel mounted rifle" just doesn't have the right ring to it.

No antigue gun had actual "Steel" hardware, it was either forged wrought iron or malleable cast iron.

FWIW - during the 1830's J Henry's Boulton Gun works was selling steel mounted guns - they were not advertised as iron, but rather as steel, which at that time was simply carburized wrought iron....

Also the idea that all wrought iron is super low in carbon is fallacious - I've had some that was at least .4-.5% carbon and yes I do know the difference since I've used a lot of real wrought iron over the years. Nor is all wrought iron the same - there is single wrought, quite coarse in structure, used for wagon wheel rims, etc, double and triple wrought which are much more refined without near the amount of silicates/slag as single wrought - the latter two were used in sturctural work such as bridges and buildings and also in old anchor chain...

One source for wrought iron - they are dismantling the Old Globe Grain elevator and salvaging both the wood and the wrought iron - if interested give them a call or send an email for more info:
Wisconsin Woodchuck LLC
2 Banks Avenue
Superior, Wisconsin 54880

Inside local area: 715-392-5110

Outside area : 800-853-8623

info@wisconsinwoodchuck.net

As an alternative - black iron pipe works and looks more like wrought iron when worked up - a bit more work than mild steel flat stock but IMO worth it.......

[northmn]

An interesting feature of wrought iron is that it is resistant to rust.  They used to make wrought iron nails (they were squarish) that are still unrusted or mostly so today.  Higher carbon content rusts and oxidizes much quicker.  One method of viewing good steel in a knife was the greyish look of carbon steel.  Another feature of wrought iron was its softness.  Somewhere I read that southern gun makers believed soft iron barrels were the most accurate (some evidence they were not wrong).  Some claimed they could swamp a barrel with a good drawknife, which makes it sound like they used wrought iron barrels.  Its resistance to rust would also be a factor in barrels.  Whether it was used I do not know.  

DP

[Brian Jordan]

Thanks for all the reply's

So what I have gathered aside from searching for true wrought iron.

I can use:
 
rebar
black pipe
mild steel (would that be considered structural steel, like angle iron...etc?)
how about 1018 cold roll?

[northmn]

About the closest thing in looks is the mild black steel.  Cold rolled is work hardened to some extent.  Local hardware stores call it welding steel or something like that.  Best to go to a good steel yard.

DP

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

The only rebar I've ever seen is very hard, on the surface at least.  It'll take the teeth off a new hack saw blade.

[Brian Jordan]

About the closest thing in looks is the mild black steel.  Cold rolled is work hardened to some extent.  Local hardware stores call it welding steel or something like that.  Best to go to a good steel yard.

DP

If I walked into the scrap yard, and asked them if I could look thru there mild steel pile, they would know what I was talking about?

[hanshi]

Just curious but what type of iron are these old "iron fences" made of?  We've always referred to them as "wrought iron" fences.  I'm talking about the old ones & those pointy things around houses & such.  During the War of Northern Aggression they were melted down & made into cannon.  Is what we see now cast or wrought iron?

[Bill of the 45th]

A scrap yard probably wouldn't have the foggiest idea what you're talking about.  It's just iron, and so many cents per pound to them.  I'm dickering for a Rail Road bridge built in 1888, that has to be removed to make a "green wooden bridge" for  a bikers/hikers trail.  I'm waiting for test results.  Most other bids are for scrap Iron.  I may be advertising  some for sale.  It does work great, as long as you don't turn it into sparklers.(don't ask me how I know)  It does work better in a gas forge, and is more forgiving.

Bill

[brokenflint]

true wrought iron is usually available as scrap from bridges, anchor chain, old wooden wheel tires (the iron band around the wood wheel).  Check out some of the knife makers forums like don foggs site, many of the makers there use wrought as guards and hilt fittings.  It can be difficult to weld as it wants to seperate into the fibre strands of its natural state.  it will look like damascus steel layering once it is acid etched.  Go to this link for a view of the fiberous end grain structure of wrought iron, http://forums.dfoggknives.com/index.php?showtopic=11397&hl=wrought+iron     I think wrought iron would make some nice thimbles and nose caps for sure.

[KentSmith]

you can buy some from Cabin Creek = good 3rd run.

[Sam Everly]

It just hit me , I know where a old iron bridge is setting .  About 8 miles from my house is a old water powered mill . There use to be a iron bridge that crossed the river there but it was removed about 20 years ago and replaced with a wood bridge. The old bridge (from around 1900) was moved over on the property and is just sitting there . I need to check on that .     

[Chuck Burrows]

Another source for Wrought Iron in big bars
http://www.newenglandschoolofmetalwork.com/forsale.php

Sam I'd be willing to bet that is WI........

As for the anti-rusting properties - it's not just the carbon content (as I noted before WI is not free of carbon or even necessarily all that low) but rather the high silicate content...

[Bruce]

      Wrought is an old English word for "worked" or forged.  The more it was wrought the better was the quality.  It was easy to forge-weld and resisted rust, however it was soft and wore easily. It usually came in flats or bars.  Wrought iron is easy to identify as it has striations which run in a longitudinal axis.  Poorer quality wrought iron will deliminator and that delamination is similar in appearance to the broken end of a fiberglass rod, frayed and fibrous.    
     Mild steel is a good substitute for wrought iron and is used extensively by today's blacksmiths.  I believe that the last country to produce wrought iron commercially was Sweden and they stopped production some time in either the late sixties or early seventies.  An excellent source of wrought iron in these times is from old wagon-wheel rims and other wagon hardware.  Treat it like gold, hoard it and use it for only special projects.      
     When the term "iron" was originally used it usually meant wrought.  Today the term is ubiquitous in useage and covers most everything metal.  Do not confuse wrought iron with steel (mild or high carbon) or cast iron.  Wrought is very malleable and ductile where as cast is brittle, breaking easily.  However it files like a dream.  Window counter-weights were of cast or "pig" iron (cheap and inferior quality).      
     As for the picket fences, the rails and pickets were wrought but of an inferior quality.  The fleur-de-leis were usually made of cast iron.  High quality fences did not employ cast iron.  Without a doubt, some of the most intricate and elaborate fences were forged by Samuel Yellen.  Much of his work exists today and is a pleasure to look at.    
      It may have been my imagination but when I was in the smithing business, I could detect a certain smell to wrought iron when I forged it, quite pleasant I remember.  That being said, go ahead and use mild steel.  It's fun to work with.  After all that's what our gun barrels are made out of.                     
     
                            Don't let anyone spit in your lunch-bucket.  BHB