Author Topic: RCA #110  (Read 4568 times)

Mike R

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RCA #110
« on: May 08, 2009, 02:47:10 PM »
It seems like we have discussed this rifle before but I could not bring it up on a search. Does anyone have any insight on the RCA #110--also pictured on the Smithsonian website and in Brown's book on colonial arms? 

Offline rich pierce

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2009, 01:56:44 PM »
Mike, I recall a discussion as well.  I don't want to put words in someone else's mouth but I think a guy who knows Euro arms well thought it resembled Scandinavian work as late as 1780's.  That being said, my impressions are that it's a well-buit early rifle.  I think the carving behind the cheekpiece is secondary work done during the working life of the gun.  It does not match the quality of the tang carving and wrist carving which are worn but look well-executed.  Because it has an octagonal barrel of .51 caliber, I'm inclined to believe it was a rifle, not a smooth rifle.  Just working the odds here.  The guard, buttplate, lock and architecture all say "early" to me meaning pre-1775 and there is nothing on the gun that precludes it from being made 10 or even 20 years earlier.  If it was stocked in birch here in America then that seemingly would have been out of style or favor by the 1770's.  Of course it could be a restock of older parts but even then why use the rounded cheekpiece which again is well out of the mainstream by 1770's and maybe earlier here.  So the central question seems to be whether it is an American-stocked arm or not.  If so then this is one of the "very early" rifles that could easily date to the F&I War period.  That guard is just early! The buttstock has great depth and breadth.  The cheekpiece is round, etc.   If not stocked here then folks who know European work may by consensus say it could have been made during the 1770's or 1780's.  I'd ask, "who would buy this gun as a new gun in 1775?"  Don't have an answer, but I bet there are plenty who would buy it in 2010.  I think it has many characteristics that would serve anyone well today who wants to build a generic early rifle suitable for F&I War period use, recognizing that anything we build to represent that period (save the musician's rifle perhaps) is largely speculative.  RCA 110 is on my list of F&I War period candidates.
Andover, Vermont

Offline Stophel

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2009, 06:49:50 PM »
I am pretty sure, just for my own satisfaction, that the gun is Scandinavian.  Not a particularly fine example, though, but it sure looks Swedish/Scandinavian.  Round cheekpiece with the swirl at the rear is almost universal on Swedish guns.  Otherwise, it's just generic "germanic".  Swedish guns, from what little I have seen, are generally stocked in elm or walnut.  It would not surprise me, though, to find the provincial Swedish gunsmith stock his gun in birch.  In fact, I would expect it.
When a reenactor says "They didn't write everything down"   what that really means is: "I'm too lazy to look for documentation."

Mike R

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2009, 02:59:52 PM »
Rich, I have seen only photos of the box area of the musicians rifle--do you have a reference that shows pictures of that rifle?  Is it a rifle of another name in some pub?

Mike R

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2009, 03:59:32 PM »
I did find an old discussion of this--is the MuzzleBlasts Mag [which I have ] and Guslers articles the only source of published photos still?

Offline rich pierce

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2009, 04:01:55 PM »
I think EK said that his "1750's rifle?" on his website is primarily based on the musician's rifle with some creativity (the box engraving notably).  In Wallace Gusler's MB articles several years ago he showed the carving at the front of the cheekpiece and the nosecap, other little tidbits.  But EK's interpretation probably gives a better feel for the whole.  There are no published photos of the whole piece and it's not likely from what I hear.

Do you have the RCA series?  I've had a little fun guessing probable dates for the various early, undated, unsigned rifles in that series.

Look at RCA 112, ignoring the guard (because it hurts your eyes to look at it lol).
« Last Edit: May 13, 2009, 04:05:07 PM by richpierce »
Andover, Vermont

Mike R

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2009, 05:44:27 PM »
Yes, thanks, I have the RCA volumes and just about every other book published on early guns.  I, too have poured over the RCAs and speculated on some of the "early looking ones".  Too bad the whole Musicians rifle is not published.  ...and I wish Wallace would finally publish his book!

Offline Stophel

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2009, 07:30:38 PM »
I'm not holding my breath.
When a reenactor says "They didn't write everything down"   what that really means is: "I'm too lazy to look for documentation."

Offline rich pierce

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Re: RCA #110
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2009, 08:20:00 PM »
good, wouldn't want you to turn blue.
Andover, Vermont