Author Topic: Patchbox material thickness??? (Read 8958 times)

cheyenne · « **on:** May 21, 2009, 02:13:16 AM »

When you're making a patchbox, what thickness material do you use? I want to make one from sheet steel, but am not sure how thick it should be.

David Rase · « **Reply #1 on:** May 21, 2009, 02:59:49 AM »

I use .050 for steel boxes.
DMR

D. Taylor Sapergia · « **Reply #2 on:** May 21, 2009, 03:39:16 AM »

I would not use less than .040" thick in any metal. I used some .032" on my Kuntz effort, and found it difficult to say the least. I do not have any trouble at all with .062" or 1/16". There's lots of originals with much thicker sheet and cast brass boxes. Anneal it well before you start, if using brass.

Larry Luck · « **Reply #3 on:** May 21, 2009, 04:10:42 AM »

I'm getting ready to make a steel captured lid box for a rifle, and it will be 1/16". It is what I can get at the local hardware and will be thinner by the time I inlet and file it smooth with the stock.
Larry Luck

D. Taylor Sapergia · « **Reply #4 on:** May 21, 2009, 04:27:32 AM »

I'm with ya Larry. I like to have something to file to remove irregularities and high spots.

Acer Saccharum · « **Reply #5 on:** May 21, 2009, 05:11:03 AM »

Most late flint brass boxes I've seen have bee THIN, way thinner than I prefer. On the order of .03? .04 maybe. Thin, bent, cracked.

Earlier works seem to use heavier material, and more cast boxes. Does this have anything to do with rolled material not being readily available?

18th cent box locks for doors are usually made up from sheet iron for the boxes. Bent and riveted construction. !9th Cent suddenly the boxes are being cast from iron. It must be that the technology of casting small parts and mould technology came together for this to happen.

What's that got to do with patchboxes? Excuse me.

Acer

B Shipman · « **Reply #6 on:** May 21, 2009, 06:41:20 AM »

I always use .062 . Hinges with a sustantial tab silver soldered. You'll see very old 1790 or earlier guns with boxes done this way in very fine condition compared to the rest of the rifle. You have to make an exeption for specific examples. I'm goimg to do a copy of a Hawk rifle and am using thinner stock simply because it was done that way.

D. Taylor Sapergia · « **Reply #7 on:** May 21, 2009, 06:54:17 AM »

I used .032" brass on this Kuntz rifle. For the tiny inletting along the edges, it paid off, but the brass stock is so thin, it is totally unforgiving when it comes to bending and shaping to the stock, and it dents easily. Everything had to be just right before I finished the patch box inlet because there was nothing to file afterwards. And I used .032" because Jacob did. Not next time.

flintriflesmith · « **Reply #8 on:** May 21, 2009, 06:32:51 PM »

For the last couple of weeks I have been looking for 16 guage (.050) sheet brass. Do any of you know of a supplier who has it in stock?

Gary

tim crowe · « **Reply #9 on:** May 21, 2009, 07:02:21 PM »

Gary,

Speedy Metals in New Berlin, Wi carries 050 brass. Google them Or I can pick it up for you.

TC

California Kid · « **Reply #10 on:** May 21, 2009, 07:11:30 PM »

Track of the Wolf has .050 sheet brass. Not cheap though,$9.00 for 4"x 8" sheet.

keweenaw · « **Reply #11 on:** May 21, 2009, 08:03:50 PM »

McMaster - Carr had sheet cartridge brass (70:30) in lots of thicknesses and sizes.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#cartridge-brass/=1z0047

Tom

flintriflesmith · « **Reply #12 on:** May 21, 2009, 10:27:56 PM »

Thanks guys!
I don't know how I missed it in Track. Maybe I quit looking when I saw 1/16 and 1/8 listed.
Gary

Dphariss · « **Reply #13 on:** May 21, 2009, 10:46:23 PM »

MSC has .050 260 alloy 12x12 is 56 bucks or so though.
Hopefully this will go down as copper has dropped over 5000 a ton if I read it right.

Dan

March 11, 2009
http://marketmemorandum.blogspot.com/2009/03/seekingalpha-says-copper-price-drop-is.html
''With global copper prices sinking from a 2008 high of $4 per lb, down to today's miserly, $1.25 per lb, it is hardly surprising that the two major copper producing countries in South America are looking at ways to buoy up their operations. Last week, Peruvian president Alan Garcia dropped some strong hints that Peru and Chile should coordinate on copper production, in order to achieve greater control of prices on international markets.

“I believe that as countries with a strong mining presence in the world we must work in a joint manner, because when brotherly countries produce and compete with the same metal, the only thing we achieve is a fall in the price of copper, and we are both losers,” said Garcia.´´

billd · « **Reply #14 on:** May 22, 2009, 12:12:43 AM »

I'm sure you could buy a 4' x 4' or 8' sheet a lot more reasonable than a 12" x 12" piece. I don't make patch boxes but those of you who are coming to Dixons should look into a large piece and splitting it when your all together.

Bill

paa · « **Reply #15 on:** May 22, 2009, 02:49:02 AM »

Hey Guys, Great discussion topic. Having examined a huge amount of original longrifles, I can tell you that the patch boxes were probably made of .050" thick brass. I say probably, because, by the time you, or the original makers, have finished filing, it probably started as .062" The important question is where did these original gunsmiths acquire sheet brass - and I believe that only happewned circa 1780. I think, by then, England had rollong milss for sheet brass - for the clock workers' trade. Obviously, Gunsmiths purchased the material. Now. what is the optimum thickness of brass to be used for a patchbox.? I have tried .050", and it worked well, except for peening in the catch. I had to remove said catch, silver solder under the lid, another piece of brass, .062", and try afgain. Worked. So, my learning experience, is to use no less than .062" thick - annealed brass. This same thickness of brass, carefully annealed, can also be used to shape a dome lid patch box - mst of which, originally, were cast brass. You all may wish to check out my book. Taylor: Absolutely beautiful Jacob Kuntz rifle: WOW!, and congrats!

Peter A. aLEXANDER: tHE gUNSMITH OF gRENVILLE cOUNTY

ghchristian · « **Reply #16 on:** May 22, 2009, 04:15:24 AM »

I work for a company that makes patch boxes for Dixie Gun Works and Track of the Wolf and we use .040 to .045 for steel and .050 for brass and german silver

California Kid · « **Reply #17 on:** May 22, 2009, 04:24:36 AM »

Too thin as all of the above posters with expierence have indicated.

D. Taylor Sapergia · « **Reply #18 on:** May 22, 2009, 04:31:47 AM »

Welcome to the forum Peter, and thanks for the kind words. I'm bringing it to Dixon's this July...hope I can show it around a little.

erdillonjr · « **Reply #19 on:** May 22, 2009, 09:00:04 PM »

Ted Cash has sheetbrass and steel in all thickness. He is reasonable. give him a call. Ed

B Shipman · « **Reply #20 on:** May 23, 2009, 08:48:25 AM »

Acer, nothing changes. Many boxes in the late period were purchased just as today. Either precut or blanks. I have no documentation as to blanks, but why not.
And the thin stuff was cheaper. Easier to cut and cheaper in bulk.

News:

Author Topic: Patchbox material thickness??? (Read 8958 times)

cheyenne

California Kid

keweenaw

billd

paa

ghchristian

California Kid

erdillonjr