Watering down stock finishes

[Joe S.]

Do you folks thin out your oil finishes to make them easier,more workable?I'm throwing this out there because my finish looks a little streaky.I used chambers oil finish,great finish,no issues but thought it was a little thick.I think I made my first mistake with the first coat.I put it on heavy,with a brush,thinking it would all soak in.I should have quickly wiped off excess. I did give the stock a good going over with 0000 scotch brite before putting on three more coats,hitting it each time with 0000.These pads are not aggressive enough IMHO.So I'm thinking hitting it with 0000steel wool and thinning  out the chambers oil in hopes of using a hand rubbed technique for the next couple coats,way to thick to try it in its present form.Sorry for the long story,thoughts?,if yes best thinner.

[Joe S.]

Forgot to add,perhaps this can of finish was a little on the old side and thickened up some?I'm not sure of the born on date,just a thought.

[Pete G.]

The key to finishing is to use thin coats. I usually hand rub at least three coats of tung oil finish and then finish up with several coats of BLO. I will rub on a thin coat of oil, then wipe the whole thing down with a paper towel. Do this daily for several days until you get where you want.

I also use this procedure while cleaning. It will leave a patina like no other I have tried.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

Joe:  apply the oil to the new stained wood for a good five minutes; more doesn't hurt.  But then, before it becomes gummy, rub it ALL off.  You want your oil in rather than on the wood.  Do the same the second day having left it for at least 24 hours to cure.  On day three, four, etc. apply a wetting coat with a cloth patch making sure it is as even as possible.  These are very thin applications which will build up very slowly, filling pores and further sealing the wood where it soaked in and went matt.  After about the fouth application of the thin coats, remove all of the oil right down to the wood with either ScotchBrite pads or 0000 steel wool.  Be sure to clean all the dust off the wood prior to applying your next and subsequent coats.  I will use up about 1 1/2 weeks to get your rifle's finish the way you like it, applying only one  coat every 24 hours.  I use a Canadian product called Circa 1850 Tung Oil...made in Quebec.
Almost forgot to answer your question:  no, I don't thin it.

[TommyG]

Joe, never tried to thin Chambers oil, but last gun I built my finish schedule was 1) flood coat of Chambers oil then knock that back with 4/0 steel wool. I can't remember if I wiped it back or not, I probably will on the gun I am finishing now.  Usually with the first coat, the wood will tell you when it has had enough as it won't soak up any more finish.  2) Seven more coats of Chambers oil applied with my finger.  No wiping back.  Rubbed back with parrafin and rottenstone using a toothbrush between each coat.  Final - coat of ren wax.  I was really happy with the finish, especially the depth. But to address your issue of streaks, I think the rottenstone rub would take care of that.  Once finished with rottenstone, the gun will look flat/dull, but even.  The ren wax will add the sheen.  TomG

[Joe S.]

Thanks guys,while everybody that's handled this rifle says what a fine job I did,we are all our worst critics. They didn't notice the streaky areas till pointed out.

[Ky-Flinter]

From my limited experience, Chambers oil finish will thicken after some has been used leaving an air space in the can.  I've started adding marbles or lead balls to the container to bring the level of remaining finish up to the top of the can.  Seems to help keep the finish from thickening. 

I've never thinned it.  Maybe Jim will chime in and tell us if it can be thinned and with what.

-Ron

[PPatch]

Joe; What Taylor said! That is the way to apply an oil finish. It takes time, always allow the previous coat to cure before applying another. If you see any signs of a milky like, rather sticky, build up then wait, the coat isn't cured. 24 hours is not always enough, it is according to humidity conditions so only use 24 hours as a rule of thumb, not an absolute, it might take 48 hours.

Unlike Taylor I do not use a small cloth pad for those followup thin coats after the initial heavier coat of unthinned Chambers Oil, I just use a small drop on my index finger and go to rubbing it on a small area until I feel it becoming tacky. If there are light streaks in it at that point - no matter, I leave them. I continue until the whole stock is covered, then let that very thin coat cure. I do the same several more times, you'll find that the streaks level with the subsequent coats, to a degree. don't sweat it if you can see some after completing the stock each time. Once I have anywhere from five to seven thin coats the stock is looking good, now it is time for the next phase - leveling all and bringing out that high satin sheen we want.

This is done with a fine (4F grade) pumice powder and a dobber. You can find Behlen brand pumice on the internet, you can make the dobber. Cut a four inch square piece of cotton cloth, place either more cloth in the middle or a small bit of soft foam material, twist the cloth together and tie it off with string. You will want some mineral oil, it acts as a lubricant. Dust a small area of the stock, dampen the dobber with the mineral oil, VERY lightly begin to rub the stock, in circles. It takes only a wee bit of pressure, keep moving to new areas adding pumice and recharging with mineral oil as you progress. What you are doing is leveling the surface, only the surface. If you rub too hard you'll quickly remove those hard won top coats.



dave

[PPatch]

Forgot to add,perhaps this can of finish was a little on the old side and thickened up some?I'm not sure of the born on date,just a thought.

You could try a couple of drops of mineral spirits an see if it is better, don't over do it. As sold the Chambers Oil does not require any thinning, but once it ages and thickens, that is another story. I place a square of plastic sandwich film over the top and put the lid on, then seal the can in two ziplock plastic bags and keep it inside so the heat doesn't get to it. I have not had any problems doing it this way.

dave

[Joe S.]

Very good info Dave,sounds like what I want to do,level out the finish.I would like to do it now and then proceed with more coats of a thinner oil.Its my thinking if I followed Taylor's advice from the beginning  and was a little more patient things would be different. Nothing that can't be fixed and I will get where I want to be but next build have this part figured out ahead of time.

[Herb]

Joe, I used Chambers oil and it was too thick to rub out.  Seemed to dry too fast.  Thinned it with 91% alcohol, I don't think that made it better.  Mine had been opened and used before with no problem.  Maybe mineral spirits would thin it.

[dogcatcher]

I was taught a method 40 something years ago.  For the first coat of an oil finish, mix about 50/50 the oil finish of your choice and mineral spirits.  It thins down the finish and allows it to soak in better.  Rather than go through and write my entire process, you can read this link by Frank Whiton about his classic gunstock finish.  https://www.firearmsforum.com/firearms/article/3037  No I did not learn my method from him, but it is the same method.   

Oil finishes that we buy are mostly a combination of stuff that is a "wiping varnish", usually nothing more than mineral spirits, an oil, and a varnish mix.  We land up paying exorbitant prices for a little bitty bottle that will "spoil" soon after the bottle is first opened.   I always have mineral spirits and BLO on hand, so I mix them and add spar varnish to make my own.  On 1:1:1 basis for the final concoction, but for the first coat I add a little more MS.  Mixing it as I need it saves me the trouble of seeing the bottle has "spoiled" a month or 2 later.  My mix is cheaper and spoilage is limited to the can of varnish, so I only buy it in pint cans. 

What works for me may or may not work for you, I live in west Texas where it is dry and humidity is low.  Temps, humidity and other factors can slow down the drying times.  I also wait about 2 days between coats, I want the previous coat DRY, not just dry to the touch. 

[Craig Wilcox]

Herb, thanks for posting the link to Pilkinton's finish.
I have used your method for several years out in OK, but living in OH now, the humidity is way up there.  I do still have one or two rifles that I finished.

Now, I am working on my first flintlock.  This is a repro (somewhat) of an H. Rupp 1793 rifle.  I am going to try Pilkinton's on this maple stock, after I get some stain into the wood.  That is a long way off right now, as I am just finishing inletting the barrel and tang.


Sometimes, working with this maple, I wish the old timers had used walnut instead!  That softer walnut would be a joy, but I don't think the walnut would hold the carving detail quite as well.

Craig

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

A close grained hard piece of English walnut is a joy to carve.  It has an altogether different texture than hard maple though.  We hobby /smiths should stick with hard maple.