Author Topic: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock  (Read 3599 times)

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
“Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« on: January 01, 2020, 04:14:01 PM »
I'm interested in learning any information about this flintlock made by “Hodgson & Co.” I hope to use it to help date my longrifle. I have compiled this information on the research I have done thus far: 1) Richard Hodgson is documented as having produced flintlocks for export and is listed on Bond Street in Birmingham England circa 1807 - 1811; 2) A Hodgson & Co. importer and merchant is known to have operated in Baltimore, Maryland, circa 1780-1800; 3) Hodgson gunsmiths are also identified as having been active from 1790-1835 in Ispwich, Suffolk, and around 1805 in London; and 4) A less likely firm is the Hodgson & Co. of Newcastle which was active in the mid-19th century.




picture hoster

Online rich pierce

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 19534
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2020, 04:46:01 PM »
I’d say the lock is a 1780-1800 export lock but of course the lock could have been used later.
Andover, Vermont

WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2020, 06:29:20 PM »
A few additional pictures of the long gun would help some of the more knowledgeable members of this forum help date it for you.

Offline Eric Kettenburg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4178
    • Eric Kettenburg
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2020, 07:23:44 PM »
I'd like to see more of the rifle as well because the guard looks like a Lehigh or eastern Berks area piece.  The lock was probably a purchased import piece and really has nothing to do with the maker of the rifle itself.
Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2020, 07:51:51 PM »
Here are some more pics.
PS: You guys are really good to ID this as a Lehigh or Eastern Berks County gun on only a partial of the triggerguard! It is signed "J. Baer"





blood pictures tumblr












« Last Edit: January 01, 2020, 08:08:49 PM by cwbuff »

Offline Eric Kettenburg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4178
    • Eric Kettenburg
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2020, 08:18:44 PM »
Nice piece.  I think I remember seeing it for sale about 15 years ago but don't remember where - either that, or another one almost just like it.  There are a couple of these "J. Baer" rifles floating around and I don't think anyone has pinned down exactly who he was.  There are a couple of Baers listed in the old gunmakers books indicating Lancaster or York Co., but this rifle is very clearly northeastern Berks or nw Lehigh, probably Albany or Greenwich twp in Berks or the counties on the other side of the line in Lehigh - Lynn or Weisenberg.  Very comparable to work of Jacob George and Stoffel Long and even some Angstadt work a bit further south in Rockland twp. (Berks) and the Kutztown area.  There were a number of Baer family members originally in Weisenberg (Lehigh) and then over into Berks, and I very strongly suspect that these "J. Baer" rifles were made by either a John or Jacob Baer who hasn't yet been identified via tax records as a gunsmith.  Much like a number of the makers up in that area (not all, but certainly a good number), he probably was farming much of the year as well as building rifles, so he may have been taxed as a farmer.
Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

Offline cshirsch

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 340
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2020, 08:23:02 PM »
John Baer, York, PA, 1807-1840

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #7 on: January 01, 2020, 09:11:52 PM »
I have been working on Baer family genealogy. It is interesting that you mentioned Weisenberg. One of the patriarchs of the Baer family,  lived in Weisenberg in the right time period and was a blacksmith. He may be the guy. That said there are a lot of J Baers in this area. Before you mentioned Weisenberg, I was thinking it could be Jacob Baer (b. 1745 in Weisenberg twp, Lehigh Co. PA, d. 1810 in Beaver twp, Berks Co. PA). He was also a patriot soldier of the Revolution. My daughter-in-law has Baer ancestors.

If I remember correctly, it was purchased from Walt Moreau some number of years ago at the Baltimore Show.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2020, 09:33:54 PM by cwbuff »

Offline Eric Kettenburg

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4178
    • Eric Kettenburg
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #8 on: January 01, 2020, 09:40:51 PM »
Moreau - that's where I saw it.  He used to have a website with a fair amount of antique American rifles for sale.  At the time I saw it, I think it was a real steal given what he was asking for it.

I would put this piece somewhere in the 1800-1820 period, given the region.  I certainly don't think it's any earlier than that and also considering the conservative nature of those guys, it may actually be toward the later end of this spectrum.  Whoever he was, he must have been very aware of Long's work and the work of the George family because this piece is extremely similar and if unsigned would probably be attributed to one of the two.  More likely Stoffel Long - it looks more like Long's work than Jacob George to my eye.  I suspect a systematic search of the upper township records in Berks/Lehigh ca. 1800-1820 or 1830 would eventually pin this guy down.
Strange women lying in ponds, distributing swords, is no basis for a system of government!

WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #9 on: January 01, 2020, 11:14:35 PM »
There you go Civil War Buff, I told you that these guys could do it!

Nice rifle!

WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #10 on: January 01, 2020, 11:24:11 PM »
CWBUFF--Is the rifling straight cut or twist?

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2020, 12:11:25 AM »
Rifling is 7-groove with a spiral twist. If I recall the barrel profile is slightly swamped. Also a prayer hole inside the patch box.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2020, 12:18:37 AM by cwbuff »

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2020, 12:15:08 AM »
Here are couple of pics of the rear and front sights.






WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2020, 12:21:29 AM »
I found two references to a John Baer in Lancaster making flintlock rifles. One of the authors gave 1810 -1840 date. Neither stated if this particular John Baer was always located in Lancaster. Reading through Kindig's book gives one a sense that these gunsmiths frequently moved from county to county. Perhaps based on economic considerations and/or customer base.

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #14 on: January 02, 2020, 12:39:52 AM »
Unfortunately J. Baer in early Pennsylvania German is like J. Smith in English. My best bet is to look at records for the area and period for the rifle. I have found that Stoffel Long was also known as Christoffel Lang. I found an 1850 Census listing him as a gunsmith in Albany Township, Berks County. Here is his grave: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/82744719

WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #15 on: January 02, 2020, 01:37:04 AM »
True enough on the names. Some of my ancestors from the Lancaster/York area were Graeff's, which overtime, in some cases, became Groff and Grove. "Only the names have been changed to protect the innocent". :)

realtorone

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #16 on: January 06, 2020, 04:43:38 AM »
CWBuff  I have a swivel breech with a pair of early 50 cal barrels with that front sight.Have not seen that design before except on mine till now. My barrels are signed but nether can be read. My rifle appears to be a restock,and rebuild using a pair of very early matching barrels ,back to the lock and side plate containing the locking  parts.The barrels are cut with the early tall narrow rifling.

Sincerely  George Hebling

Offline Hungry Horse

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5565
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #17 on: January 06, 2020, 07:32:42 PM »
CWbuff, I own a Lehigh style smooth rifle built around 1815 and unsigned. It has the same sights as the gun pictured, and the engraved line on each side as well. I was told it likely was made by one of the Baer family gunsmiths. Other unusual features are, a fancy cut single brass trigger, and patch box and side plate made of sheet brass nailed into the stock with small brass nails.
 Do any of these features point to any specific gunsmith in the Baer family?

  Hungry Horse

WESTbury

  • Guest
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #18 on: January 08, 2020, 12:57:46 AM »
Got any pictures.
I have a Lehigh rifle as well, by Hess. Posted photos a few weeks ago. Personally, I like the looks of the Lehighs with the Roman Nose butt.


Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #19 on: January 08, 2020, 02:03:23 PM »
I have made contact with the librarian and genealogist for the Albany Township Historical Society in Berks County. She plans to do some research on the Baer family in that area. If I learn about any Baer family gunsmiths, I will post the information.

Given how many "J. Baer" men lived in the general area and time period, I think my best bet is to localize the search and anchor it in the area where Stoffil Long worked. Then move out from their looking at Baer migration into and out of the area.

For any other genealogy researchers out there, be aware that there are a few variations of the name. "Bär" in German, is spelled "Baer" in English because we just don't do the umlaut. Plus other phonetic spelling variations: Bear, Behr, etc.

Offline cwbuff

  • Starting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: “Hodgson & Co.” Flintlock
« Reply #20 on: January 12, 2020, 08:57:57 PM »
Grave of Stoffel Long (aka Christophel Lang).  I have been doing some genealogy research on him. His birthplace on this link state Mercer County. That is not correct.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/82744719