Rounding horns - the middle section

[Elnathan]

I'm sure that anyone who has every tried to make powder horn is familiar with the tapered cones used to round the bases. Those work very well on the last couple inches of the horn. The front end of the horn, since there is usually plenty of material, can just be filed round. However, rounding the base and shaping the tips round leaves a section in the middle of the horn that, at least in my limited experience, tends to remain at least slightly ovoid. One can try to file and scrape it round, leaving the side walls thicker in places than in others, but carried too far runs the risk of cutting through the sides, particularly since that area, in a middling-to-large horn, is too deep to get one's fingers inside the horn and feel how much material is left - I always end up trying to estimate based on where I think the cavity ends. One can also leave it slightly ovoid, and just try to blend the lines sufficiently so it isn't obvious. That works fine on a fairly plain horn, but for a banded or carved horn that might not work so well.

I'm kind of curious to know how the more experienced folks handle this section. I remember one person here - Dave Crisalli I think - came up with rounding tool consisting of a series of thumbscrews in a hoop - the hoop was slipped over the horn and the thumbscrews thumbscrews tightened to press the horn into shape. I don't know how one could get it adjusted while the horn was still hot enough to be formable or how it well it would stay on a greasy, tapered horn, though. It occurred to be that a simple board with a hole in it might work just as well, but I haven't had the chance to try it yet. I've also come up with an idea for a sizer that could be run down the inside of the horn a-ways and still be loosened, but I don't know how practical it is.

So, any nifty tricks for rounding the middles of horns, or do you all just work around the shape it wants to be?

[G. Elsenbeck]

Elnathan, I've found the ideas interesting, but after much thought, I decided it wasn't going to work very efficiently or well.  Too much time spent on something nature put there for us to work around a perceived defect, i.e., horn not totally round from end to tip.  Not every horn is meant to be engraved, not every horn will classify well of a F&I period example, etc.  Having said that it would be better to work around the middle, scrap away as much as you can without destroying the integrity of its' strength, and finish off your goal.  Or, like others, cut the danged middle out and make something else to recoup your investment of the horn.  Below are a few items of such visions the makers had in mind.
 


 

Now the below picture is what was envisioned when looking over a horn for a project and having a less than round middle section did not deter the horner.  And this one is very light to boot! 


 

 



The horners?  Top two, Wild Willy Frankfurt for the Wetzel horn,  Tim Tanner (Griz) for the flask and last is John Proud.   Just examples what a horn can become that is certainly within most of our ability and visions.  Happy horning.

[Marcruger]

I wouldn't worry a bit that a horn isn't round in the middle. 

[John SMOthermon]

On my first horn I didn’t even round the butt, no one told me you had too.

So I cut the plug to fit the horns base shape, tapered the plug so it would fit tacked it in place .
I cut small pieces of bees wax a dropped them into the horn, then use a heat gun to heat the base area just enough to melt the wax and seal the horn.

[Elnathan]

Guys, I've made or mostly made (a couple have never quite been finished) at least half a dozen horns now, all rounded at the base, and slight ovoids in the middles haven't been an issue so far. What I'm doing now is trying to improve things - thinner walls throughout, architecture more complex than a simple sweep from the butt to a ring or raised area at the throat, etc. Being able to improve the shape in the middle via heat instead of stock removal would make the task of, say, carving an integral band, a lot easier to get right.

If there is a way to radically reshape the middle sections I have one or two horns that would benefit, but mostly I'm just interested in tweaking the rest so I can use that extra 1/16" wall thickness for architectural features instead of removing it to to get the lines to flow better.

[John SMOthermon]

Sorry, now I understand. I think.

You want to round the center section of the horn..

Maybe something like a pipe plug would work...



You would have to modify it some so the top and bottom pieces would fit into inside the cavity.

Or maybe a longer cone shaped piece of wood (cut off baseball bat) could be used, inserted while the horn is being heated ...just thinking outside the box... Good Luck!

[Tim Crosby]

 I wouldn't worry about the middle, some depends on the style of horn you are making if the end is round or natural. You can shave the sides of the middle part down some on each side, usually the is the thickest place on there horn.  Things to think about when you buy horns, look not only at the color, curve, cavity depth and twist but also the shape and thickness of and at the opening. If at all possible get your horns at a place you can pick them out yourself, Dixon's or the CLA show come to mind. 

   Tim C.

[skillman]

I have used several methods to round the body of the horn. Some more successful than others. I finally decided to quit fighting with the horn. I wait until I see what is in it and then proceed. Several of us will tell you the horn will tell you what it has in it. It's all just supposed to be fun. No right or wrong, it's art. Enjoy it.

Steve

[Top Jaw]

Don’t know if there’s a real practical or consistent way to achieve what you’re going after, since every horn is a little different, and they are a curving cone shape.  And as has been said, the middle of the horn can typically be fairly thick, and rounding it would be something that would require a lot of pressure. -  While not creating flat spots while you were trying to do it.  Good round horns are always hard to come by. So I think working the ridges down as best you can and accepting some oval shape in the middle is the norm in this era we are in.