Author Topic: Newly acquired  (Read 2747 times)

Offline RebelSon

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Newly acquired
« on: January 27, 2022, 08:28:53 AM »
Well, fellas...
     I acquired this flinter from a friend with no history. It's got come architectural issues to be sure. Also a lot of wood left on the forend. Barrel is approximately 40" long by 13/16" in .40 as far as I could tell...bore looks good as far down as is viewable.
     I believe, after getting it home and looking over that it was made in 1961 because it sure looks like that is written in pencil under the thin sheet metal sideplate. I removed the lock and found no markings and have done no further disassembly as yet.     
     I also believe that there is some semblance of a charge in it judging from markings on the ramrod and also holding it next to the barrel for a quick reference.









     I appreciate any input regarding lock identification, etc. I will not be firing the charge and will opt to remove with compressed air, pulling, barrel/breech removal.
     As said..get it running and decide what direction to go with any further work, weighing what could be done in specific areas. The wood looks to be birdseye Maple and I wouldn't doubt locally sourced although ours aren't often considered strong/hard enough for stocking here in Western Washington.

           Best regards to you all,
                                James (JD) Smith

Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2022, 08:49:43 AM »
Forgot to mention a couple things. She wears a globe front sight and foldable rear.

Barrel is browned (very dark).


Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2022, 08:50:22 AM »
Weight is 8.2 pounds

Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2022, 12:45:23 PM »
More on the barrel...six grooves/lands of about the same width. Barrel is marked...

Turner Kirkland
Union City-Tennesee
Made in Belgium


Offline geologyjohn

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2022, 05:21:24 PM »
That lock also looks like the classic Turner Kirkland/Dixie Gun Works lock from the 1960’s.

Offline Top Jaw

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2022, 05:33:08 PM »
Probably a safe bet that all the parts came from Dixie. Lock is probably also from Belgium or Italian.  It’s a pretty nice piece of wood. Might be worth putting it on a diet and slimming everything down and correcting some of the 1961 design.  However I see your biggest hurdle being the lack of a proper buttplate (no top return that I can see).   

Perhaps you could find something with a similar curvature to re-inlet with the top comb, if it has enough trigger reach.  You would loose some in the installation, and the box would need bobbed a bit.  If you can find a TOW catalog, they have actual size drawings of gun parts.  Side plate could also use an update while your at it, and remove the spur from the guard.  But that is starting to get into a lot more work for maybe limited reward, considering the Barrel and lock used and what you would have in the end.  If you don’t want to go with a new Bplate and side plate, and the level of effort to make a few design corrections, I think I  would probably just leave it as is and shoot it.   To me, I couldn’t be happy slimming it down, without doing a complete makeover, so I would leave it alone.  If your up for that, and you got it on the cheap, then go for it.   My 3 cents.

PS - It’s never happened to me, but I hear about 20% of used MLs that are purchased are still loaded. 
« Last Edit: January 28, 2022, 03:58:56 AM by Top Jaw »

Offline Daryl

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2022, 08:50:11 PM »
Interesting gun.
1st up is to work on the barrel.  Remove the barrel from the stock, first. Soak the bore/charge/blockage with the gun sitting muzzle up. Put a good dollup of penetrating oil down the bore - DW40 will likely do, or Kroil, or better yet 50/50 acetone/kerosene or acetone/ATF. When oil comes out the vent, you should be ready to attempt to pull the ball with a ball screw in a steel rod, gun held in padded  bench vice.
The ball screw or a worm can be used to break up the wet powder. Breech scraper - blade screwed into the rod. Once the barrel is clear, you can assess it's condition & go from there.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline frogwalking

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2022, 03:50:15 AM »
I once bought a steel rod at the Ace hardware, drilled a hole down the end, cut the head off a no. 8 sheetrock type screw, soldered it in the hole and pulled such a stuck ball.  (after disabling the powder charge, of course.  Today, I would just use my stainless steel range rod.  (I broke my unbreakable plastic range rod. long ago)
Quality, schedule, price; Pick any two.

Offline Paul from KY

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2022, 06:34:18 AM »
I think you should keep it in the same configuration as you bought it.  It is an excellent "time capsule" of the type of rifle that was commercially available in the early 1960s.  Follow Daryl's advice on clearing the old load out of the bore.  Since it appears to be in good condition, I wouldn't try to prettify the funky DGW rifle by spending time and money trying to improve it.  Hopefully the lock sparks well enough for it to be a decent shooter.

Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2022, 12:50:38 PM »
Well, fellas...here's the update. The charge turned out to be about 40grs of unknown powder with no patch and ball. I cleaned up the rifle, worked the frizzen face with Scotchbrite, gave the wood some love with Howard's Feed-n-wax.

So far I've got two quick sessions..one of ten shots and another five with some tweaking of the old (Wilson?) adjustable rear sight in-between. I've also reduced my load from 60 to 40 grs of 3F Goex, .010 patch, and .395 ball. Conditions have not been ideal so groups are nothing to brag about yet. All shooting done at 25yds. I also changed to 4F Goex in the pan on the second outing, which against much of the debate, did noticably speed up ignition. For fun I must mention that I unfortunately managed to break the original builders wooden rod, which I anticipated although I half expected it even though I am well accustomed to wooden rammers...I did grab 'er a little high..5/16 dia of unknown species with quite some age. For now I've picked up a fiberglass rod until another can be made.

I will post again and keep you all updated. I will likely keep the gun as is in respect to the old-timer who loved it and our pastime. I have a couple of builds taking too long that are coming out fairly well in regard the proportion/slenderness/architecture and prior to them I've never owned anything that looked right anyway, but I sure have enjoyed them all since starting out in my gradeschool years with a Sears/Miroku and 1851 repro. Grandpa picked them both up for me at Garage sales we went to together. I think the most wonderful thing about black powder is the connection/recall it brings...another reason to ultimately leave the gun as received.

                                 Best regards,
                                           James Dean Smith

Offline Daryl

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #10 on: February 03, 2022, 09:37:06 PM »
Tks for the update, Rebelson.
Fiberglass rods, unless having a substantial coating, are like using a round file for loading your gun.
Stainless steel is less abrasive, however, is still more abrasive than tool steel (drill rod).  A 4' Dewey rod is
the best of all, as a cleaning and loading rod, unless you can find a good hickory of 3/8" diameter.
Daryl

"a gun without hammers is like a spaniel without ears" King George V

Offline Paul from KY

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2022, 02:58:12 AM »
To protect the crown of your barrel while loading and cleaning, you can get yourself a brass muzzle guard.  I use them with my steel rods, and the rods never touch the barrel.  My wooden ramrods are just for show.  Here's what I'm talking about; https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1024305747?pid=500684

Offline OLUT

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2022, 05:54:23 PM »
More on the barrel...six grooves/lands of about the same width. Barrel is marked...

Turner Kirkland
Union City-Tennesee
Made in Belgium

Here are the spec's on the barrel from my 1961 " DGW wish book" ( I wished that  I had the money to buy one at the time).  Kirkland recommended a ball of 0.395 inches and sold both the percussion and flint versions both as finished guns and as kits. Way back then,  there were plenty of original muzzleloader parts to be found cheaply. Thus, Kirkland stated, " Perhaps some of you had rather furnish your own parts and buy what you do not have from us. So each pieces priced separately ...". For example the percussion barrel with false breech plug and nipple was $34, while the flint barrel was @$29.




Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #13 on: February 07, 2022, 08:23:30 AM »
Thank for all the feedback, fellas.

 I do have a muzzle guide (s)/brass bore protectors of various sizes amongst quite a collection of small tools for the guns.

I have 32 shots fired through her now. Over several short sessions...I've been fooling with the sights, which I initially thought goofy, but may just keep them because they were a part of the build. The only drawbacks are the front post is very thin and I can't for the life of me lower the rear enough to make the adjustments I'm looking for. Right now I'm approximately 5-6 inches low at 25yds. My ball/patch combo is a little loose, but I'll be trying a couple other thicker patches as I go along. Right now I've been shooting a .395 Hornady ball, .010 patch, over both 40 and 55 grains of 3F Goex. The first time out the only measure I had only reduced to 60grs...after reducing, I really haven't noticed a difference between 40 and 55 other than on the patch.

I plan to do some tuning of the lock, but am in no hurry. When your other experience is a Traditions lock the DGW is actually a huge leap forward!!!!!

I will say this-the bore is in fantastic shape and like most is likely capable of better accuracy than I am. Olut, I very much appreciate the original information about the barrel!!!

 I'm attaching a target shot in good/fair light 25yds, offhand....just need to get more time with her.




Offline RebelSon

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Re: Newly acquired
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2022, 08:53:26 AM »
Sometimes you gotta laugh at yourself... I've been lowering the rear sight when I need to raise it!!! Just occurred to me.