Relief Carving Drawings

[StevenV]

I have spent the better part of today redrawing this gun I am building ( from a blank that is all I start with). The first go round I had a very prominent builder look at it and he gave me some pointers and constructive criticism. I took this to heart , and with great pains erased and kind of started over. It takes a looooooooong time to draw up a gun to carve, but what the heck so here is round two. I will look at it after a day or two to get a fresh look . In the mean time anything stick out to any of the carvers out there? Thanks in advance for the criticism , let the "pointers" fly.  Steve

[Daryl]

If I might offer a suggestion. The left side of the wrist and behind the entry pipe appear to be a little busy for my eye.
Not so say they are wrong, just a feeling I have.

[J. Talbert]

I agree that in general your designs are on the busy side.  I think they would benefit from some simplification.
But my biggest suggestion is that a lot of your secondary elements seem to originate at awkward angles to the main elements.  The designs would flow better if the secondary elements appeared to originate from a shared imaginary starting point with the main elements.  Keep in mind your imitating the curvature of vines and branches.


I hope that makes some sense.  It would be much easier to demonstrate in person.
Your individual scrolls and volutes are well done. 
Good luck,
Jeff

[rich pierce]

It’s good stuff. As mentioned above there are one or 2 places where the arc formed by a secondary element doesn’t flow like your main arcs. Like this one. Think of the arc or scroll made by the primary and secondary elements. The arc above the pencil line here.

[flinchrocket]

Study some original carving.

[David Rase]

Behind the cheek piece:  Your primary scroll is too parallel, it needs to taper.  The origin of the leaf coming out between the upper and lower scroll does not flow.  I don't know what the triangle thing between the upper and lower scroll on top of the leaf.

In front of the cheek piece: Your drawing is too truncated.  When you ground the carving, the element will shorten up dramatically.

Entry pipe carving:  Same as in front of the cheek piece, too truncated plus the transition from your forestock molding does not flow well to the carving.  Way too wide as it approached the carving and the radius too sharp.

Tang carving:  This is your best effort out of what I have seen.
David Rase

     

[Jim Kibler]

I agree with Jeff Talbert about the design flow and origins of elements.  This is by far the biggest opportunity for improvement.  Maybe pick an area such as behind the cheek piece and try to re-work things with this in mind. 

Jim

[foresterdj]

Just a question. When designing carving patterns, do folks ever let the pattern of the wood grain affect the flow of the design? 

Many years ago, I played around with carving little dragon statues (my late wife liked dragons), I liked them because whatever I thought looked like a dragon must be right, since there are no real ones to compare them to. Anyway, I often let the wood grain direct where I was going with the design.

[bobw]

I would agree with all the comments said here.  But, would like to add that your drawn lines are very nice, clean and smooth.  I see many that can not do that, so keep at it and you will do well.
Bob

[bobw]

Of course I don’t know where you drew your inspiration from but many of your elements appear somewhat like what Bonewitz did.  You might want to look up some of his guns and study them.
Bob

[bama]

Everybody has to start somewhere and what you have done is not bad but it is not good either. You really need to spend a little more time in the study of some good original carving designs. If you take a good Lancaster design from on of the many good books that are available and try to draw it exactly as it is cut by the original maker you will find that your design is close but just not quite there. If you don't have any good books then there are many pictures on the internet of good carving designs. I would recommend you not cut this design but continue to refine it until it is right.

A good design cut poorly will always look better than a bad design cut well. Your work so far looks well done, it would be a shame for you to cut this design as it stands today. Continue to study and refine your design before you cut it, you will be glad you did.

[Tom Currie]

I think you are a good drawer. Your tang carving is probably your best element, it resembles organic foliage, vines or tendrils as was mentioned earlier by Jeff. You cheek carving has the 2 most parallel main lines of the scroll ( basically a blank space ) with very detailed stuff above and below. The above and below should grow off or out of the main scroll lines. The designs where the lower scroll meets upper scroll at rear needs the most work . Triangular element seems out of place and the lower part grows out and just turns back down on the main C scroll . For my eye I'd like to see the volutes on the main scroll be more equal , I like the rear one, front seems incomplete. I probably haven't added anything new here but hope this helps.

[TommyG]

Others have covered it pretty well here.  One thing I would change is the "dead ends" around the lock panels.  Most original work I have seen, the front lock molding sweeps under the lower forestock like you have it, but then curves back and continues as a slightly curved thin (maybe 1/8"?) molding along the bottom to the sweep you have at the rear lock panel, connecting the two.  Keep up the good work, make some of the changes suggested and it will look great.

[Mike Brooks]

Id leave the area in the large C scroll empty. The pipe carving needs redesigned.  Simplify the carving at the comb. The tang carving is great.

[StevenV]

So much thanks from those who gave great comments. I will take this into consideration and redraw. I contacted one of the members who commented and we are going back and forth, I think he is getting thru. The issue here is I am a farmer and pruning season is on, I need bad weather to justify sitting home working on the gun on a nice day. So as it looks now rain Saturday and I take most all Sundays off. So I will post pics again after Sunday. When I was younger working on the gun in the evening was a given , well now I just think about it most nights. I am rather tired once I get home , supper and shower.  Really appreciate the great comments. I have most all the good books and all the KRA disc, the issue with this is once someone says look at more originals , well if you don't know what your looking for then you get drawings like mine. I wish there was a book that explained carving how to draw , why , what to draw etc, you get the point. I have carved before and  well it was okay at best . I keep trying to get better, this site helps alot. I spoke with a member from Oregon and he got me onto the Wallace Gussler video on relief carving and that was so simple yet so helpful. Wallace does a great job. I watched Jim Kiblers videos on carving would love on by Jim on how to lay out a drawing , he has a good to delivery from which to learn. Thanks and Bama no not going to cut yet those drawing need more work.      Steve

[flehto]

To me, the large curved scroll  is too wide and the detail dropping down from it looks kinda "extra". I'm really not an artist, but used the pictured carving design on a number of Lancasters w/ slight changes......Fred

[Jim Kibler]

We sell a carving book that covers the layout process.  I think you would find this beneficial.  If you go to our website, you'll find it.

Thanks,
Jim

[Ron Scott]

You might consider obtaining a copy of the Video by Wallace Gussler on relief carving by American Pioneer Video. It is a great resource and doesn't get the promotion it deserves. I recommend it to my students whole heartedly.