MN muzzleloader definition

[foresterdj]

I read this year that the definition of a muzzleloader in MN hunting regulations has changed, but do not understand it. Here it is. Can anyone explain?

[Yazel.xring]

This rule change is coming into effect in several states. From my understanding, it's a change to allow the "Federal Fire Stick" to be used in rifles like the "Traditions Nitro Fire" and upcoming CVA "Cross Fire".

They are not traditional.

[taterbug]

Had not heard of that 'system' before.  had to look it up.

Wow?

never underestimate the... oh, never mind...

[foresterdj]

Huh! That is just stupid. In essence a single shot shotgun configuration, where the breach "charging" shell has powder and primer, then you ram the saboted bullet down from the muzzle. How does that make for any added challenge over something like a Ruger #1?

I apologize for all the unmentionables, but this whole system should be consigned to regular firearm systems and not be allowed in a muzzleloader season. Too late to complain looks like.

[Robin Henderson]

Tennessee did the same thing. Traditions must have a convincing lobby staff.
For kicks and giggles look up on a supplier site to see what those "sticks" cost.
I always like to point out that the flintlock Ferguson rifle is illegal during muzzle loader season. 

[Ted Kramer]

In the 1970’s when lots of us sent letters and made phone calls to the DNR and our legislators just to get a separate muzzleloader season here in MN, who’d have thought all these changes would take place? I don’t like it but not much chance of changing it. I’m blessed with being able to hunt on my own property where I don’t have to compete with the crowd with the funny guns making 250yd shots on deer. I’ll just keep using my flintlock and enjoy every minute of it.

Ted K

[Ray Nelson]

In the early regulations booklets the ML Hunt was called a "Primitive Arms Season." This concept is no longer in the vocabulary after Inline production pushed for scopes, fake powders, long distance shot capabilities etc. It has become shoot another deer season. The past few seasons I've hunted some lottery draw ML hunts in MN State Parks. So far, I've been the only flintlock user that I know of in these parks. I'm seeing only plastic stocked inlines with scopes which will likely be everyone's choice now that lead projectiles will not be allowed beginning this season.

So, I too will enjoy my own property hunts and will experiment with a few of the non-lead bullets in my flintlock rifle and see? At 30 to 40 yards almost any compliant non-lead projectile should shoot smoothbore accurate in a slow twist barrel satisfactorily enough if I so decide to try a State Park hunt again this year. That will be my modern ML experience.  Enjoy your time hunting in a primitive HONORABLE WAY! Ray

[danny]

I been out shooting my my 50 ky rifle over the weekend. Thing packs a wallop. I had it about 20 years or so. Was a gift from my wife. Got a noticeable bruise on my cheek under my eye. Guys at work been teasing me about fighting over the weekend.

Around here the bow hunters like to had kittens when DNR said crossbows were legal in deer season. The traditional guys want only bows not compounds to be legal. I don't really care. I hunt to make myself happy. Lifes to short to worry how the neighbor filled his freezer.

[Yazel.xring]

Tennessee did the same thing. Traditions must have a convincing lobby staff.
For kicks and giggles look up on a supplier site to see what those "sticks" cost.
I always like to point out that the flintlock Ferguson rifle is illegal during muzzle loader season. 

Nearly spit out my coffee, that's buckwild.

[Bob Roller]

This may be coming off the rails but the late Harry Pope advocated the Breech/Muzzle loading system that was used in single shot rifles of 32 or 33 and 38 caliber.Insert a dowel pin or cartridge case with a dowel in it into the chamber and then using the false muzzle,load the bullet and seat it on the dowel or cartridge case.Remove the dowel and insert a primed cartridge case with the appropriate powder charge and then take aim and fire.Be sure to remove the false muzzle BEFORE the shot .He guaranteed this was the most accurate loading method for his barrels.NONE of this really applies to the intent of THIS forum and goes to the ideas much newer that the common long rifles but were developed for what was at one time,precision shooting.There are a lot of people that will NOT ACCEPT the traditional muzzle loader
as we know it and there will always be some ideas pop up to bypass laws and traditional muzzle loaders and the modified laws reflect this.
Pope,Zischang and others were after the ultimate in accuracy and these methods were used along with a breech seated bullet and a cartridge case with powder but that is an entirely different thing.I have done both in years long gone with guns now in collections that may never be seen or used again.
Bob Roller

[Dphariss]

I read this year that the definition of a muzzleloader in MN hunting regulations has changed, but do not understand it. Here it is. Can anyone explain?

Its to allow “modern” MLs based on break open shotgun actions. Someone likely got bought by the modern ML makers.
No other reason for this $#@*. Of the guy making the rule has one. Its BS either way.
Dan

[Dphariss]

Or the ones based on some other breechloader design.

[rexwolfsen]

Hi: It is even worse here in Michigan. DNR rule: Any firearm can be used in muzzleloading deer season. How bad can it get!

[old george]

I can see why, if the "firesticks" etc are used then any modern weapon could qualify.   more hunters equal more DNR funding for non hunting projects.

george

[Dphariss]

I can see why, if the "firesticks" etc are used then any modern weapon could qualify.   more hunters equal more DNR funding for non hunting projects.

george

I suspect its money one way or the other. But I have trust issues.
Dan

[Bill in Md]

Regardless of the opinions and statutes of Government toadies, I have always reserved the responsibility of defining what is a Muzzleloader is,  and what is a bow is for myself......and a whole lot of other stuff to boot!

[Eric Krewson]

I agree with Bill, when I was younger, I went ballistic when crossbows were introduced into the archery season. After a while I realized I was barking at the moon, whether they were allowed or not allowed wouldn't affect the way I hunted one bit. 

I have been a strictly Trad archery guy, then trad archery and any M/L guy, then a trad archery and flintlock guy and now a trad archery, flintlock guy who sometimes hunts with percussion and even drags out the modern stuff if the freezer is near empty as the end of the deer season closes in.

[Daryl]

Necessity, oft times is the mother of invention.