How do you work up a load and record it

[recurve]

In another posting the above got the thread hi jacked>>>----> someone asked about my post of the same targets >>>---> I explained that those are my targets of record while working up a load for that rifle the target is for.

So this is how I do it(might not be the best or how You do it)
1st-I start with my powder , I like swiss3 f when I can get it (swiss 2f is my fall back) swiss 4 f in the pan  I start at 70grns and adjust from there most of my rifles are within a few grains of 70( just seems to work for 50cals)
 2nd-Then I use almost all the time 10oz denim for patching  most my rifles are round bottom rifling (mr Hoyts work) except my 2 green mtn rifles if to tight I use 40 drill cloth
3rd Mutton Tallow for lube>>>---> it works for me keeps fouling soft (only problem very stiff when cold)
4th all load testing is done from a solid bench rest( no longer use lead sled ) HEAVY SAND FILLED BAG front ,my fist for rear
5th  all best targets recorded w photo( I don't care if it's at aimpoint just want a tight group then later adjust sights to aimpoint at a given range







1st rifle custom built by Fred Sampson Pa .50cal green mtn barrel 36 inch small siler (no longer use the peep)
copied for grandsons rifle

[recurve]

2nd rifle (no longer own)







open sights only

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new barrel in 54 for 1st rifle top brown hoyt gain twist (blue is sons hoyt rebore)

[recurve]

Brad Emig Yorktown 39 inch (45 grn mtn barrel bored out to 50 by Mr Hoyt for Brad) large siler  this rifle like 60grns sw 3f

[recurve]

Allen Martin 117 rebored getz from 45 to 50 42ninch swamped delux siler

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a covid build sent by my son trad 50 kit l&r lock redone by Cabin creek Brad  #40 POCKET DRILL 65GRNS SW3F





100 yrd sight in open sights Now my grandsons rifle a starter

[Daryl]

I record loads when working them up, in 3-ring binders on lined paper. I have kept some targets, hole punched and put into the binder,
just as I have done with modern rifles and shotguns. I have 18 of these 3-ring binders in several sizes. Some on single rifles, while others
have several different guns featured.

[recurve]

 My 1st plank build>>>---> Hoyt 50 gain twist barrel 38 delux siler shimmel (Thank you Mr C Dixon)
 












this rifle likes 80 grns 3f sw  I will move sight after 3rd range confirming grouping

[Prairie dog shooter]

Much like you;
Powder first.
Patch thickness / ball size.
Patch lube.
I keep all information Written on the paper targets.
If I'm not satisfied with the results I will try a different powder granulation / size.

When I have it all dialed in I make sight adjustments then record the details in a note book.  Don't trust my memory.

[recurve]

now building a beck 42 inch getz 1-72 barrel .50 dale johnson lock might be finished by Xmas targets to come

[recurve]

I forgot to add any new or rebored rifle  will get a smoothing out as Mr Dixon told me if the barrel cuts the patch  take a bore brush wrap in 0000 steel wool and oil 100 strokes clean and repeat till the  patching is good

[Daryl]

Interesting about the rifling cutting patches. I have never had that happen, since about 1973 when I learned to smooth the crown.
Whether TC barrels, a number of Bauska barrels, Green Mountain barrels, GRRW .69 barrel or now a couple Rice barrela. None have cut the patch.
The GRRW barrel, with 10 ounce denim, wore the patch on the lands, so I went to a 12 ounce denim. That solved the "wearing' so those patches
were re-usable.
Now, that the barrel is smoothed on the lands (bad reamer marks) after 5,000 or so shots, I can use 10 ounce denim in it to good effect.

[alacran]

I had a pistol barrel of unknown manufacture that gave me fits cutting patches. It was very difficult to load, but after the ball went in, it rammed down smoothly. SO I figured the crown was the problem. The barrel is.45 caliber. I started with a 5/8th  round carborundum burr, on a hand held drill. With it I reshaped the crown. I then did a version of Daryl thumb smoothing method, only difference I used a stainless fillet ball with progressively smaller grit wet or dry sandpaper.
When I figured I had it right I loaded the barrel with a patched .440 ball patched with Jo'Ann's 40 drill lubed with bear oil. I placed the barrel in my vice and shot the ball out with the discharger. I recovered the ball and it still had some cutting on the patching. I kept smoothing the crown by hand, and shooting it off with the discharger until all the cutting of the patch was gone.
I went to the range and shot it using 3 f Swiss and the same patch material. The patches recovered were perfect and reusable. Saved me a bunch of lead and powder.
I have done this with rifle barrels since with the same results.

[recurve]

I was told that any cut rifling will have burs, micro or otherwise most smooth out 200-500 rounds or you can fallow Mr Dixons advise and save some powder and lead



went from the above to the below

[alacran]

I finished a caplock rifle about three weeks ago. It is built using things I had on hand in my parts drawer. It has a 36 inch no-name barrel. I made the side plate and the nose cap. The wood was given to me by Troy Sweeny. It is soft maple. The barrel has 8 lands and groove the lands are narrower than the grooves. The twist is as far as I can determine about one in 60 inches.
I calculated what I have in the gun and it comes out to $100.
I went out about a week ago and shot it at 25 yards of the bench. It was grouping quite good, but I had to file about .110 of the front sight as well as moving the front sight .030 to the right. I did this a home on my vise.
I shot it the following day to verify my adjustments. It started to snow. and the winds really kicked up, so I went home and did some adjustments on the trigger. But from the few shots I took it appeared my adjustments were good.
I got to go out again last Saturday and posted this target at fifty yards. The aiming black is 2.5 inches in diameter.
I started out with 50 grains of 3f O E. I was using .440 balls, with JO Anns 40 drill. Bear oil for lube. The wind was fairly strong and variable. It was overcast, snowing from time to time. Temperature was 42 t0 44 F.
The group on the left was with the OE. The small group on the right was with 3f Dupont. I quit after that because the wind did a 180 after my first group.
Plus, the wind was increasing, and the temp seemed to be dropping.
I believe this barrel has a lot of potential. I will not mess with any more load development or sight adjustments till I get some decent weather.
This is pretty much how I go about determining a load.

[Hungry Horse]

 Screen shot of your target, write or type all the pertinent information in the border, and file it where you can find it.

Hungry Horse

[hanshi]

I've always done my load search very similarly to what the others have posted.  I have a ring binder, two actually, and record info there for future reference.  I keep some of the targets with the pertinent load info written on the target.  But the targets I keep aren't just the good ones; some are but many are not.  All of them, good and bad, tell me a lot of what I need to know.

[D. Taylor Sapergia]

I shoot a new rifle (and an old one) from the bench resting the rifle on my hand rather than on a bag, and test various loads until I'm satisfied I have the optimum load.  Then I adjust my sights to shoot centre with a centre hold.  Most preliminary work is done at 25 yards, but I confirm my results at 50 yards with five shot groups.  When I'm back in the the shop after cleaning the rifle, I stake both front and rear sights with a witness mark.  This has saved my butt several times when I get to an event, check out my rifle, and find that one of the sights is not on the witness mark.  A quick tap and stake returns the sight to it's proper windage position.  I transfer the date to a page in my binder that lists everything vital to the load, ie:  date, weather, range, rifle, ball and weight, patch, lube, powder and charge, etc.  This data is transferred as neatly and precisely as I can so that I don't have to guess at what I wrote.  Many of the targets posted in this thread would be no use to me as they are too much a clutter, and too variable a target.  Although I sometimes save a target itself and file it with the data, usually I just make a facsimile on the data sheet by placing the target over the page, and put a dot in the centre of each hole in the target.  I draw a line through the two holes of the five shot group that are the furthest apart, and two lines , vertical and horizontal through the holes that are furthest up and down, and left and right.  Using a Vernier's caliper, I measure these distances and record that data with the copied target.  As has been said, I record all targets I shoot, good and bad, so that I don't have to repeat something that didn't work, but I don't remember the details.
Having done this for years, one begins to see trends that assist you when you are starting out with a new rifle.  These trends help you with a starting point and eliminate stuff that didn't work.  It is unnecessary to re-invent the wheel every time you go to the range.  Too, when someone asks a valid question about a load, you can answer the question based on your accumulated wealth of data.  This should at the least, give the person a starting point.
Keeping complete neat records is key to getting the most accuracy and enjoyment out of one's equipment.

[smylee grouch]

When working up loads the first thing to consider is consistent shooting technique. Then keeping track of every variable in your loads and only changing one variable at a time. Shooting at the same range site and sun conditions plays a big part in it too. Just some food for thought. 

[Daryl]

Changing only one component at a time if vitally important.
If you start cutting patches, smooth the crown. If you get brown scorch marks radiating out to the edge of the patch from where the groove marks are on the spent patch,
increase patch thickness and/or lube.

[Pukka Bundook]

I write my load info in a notebook.
I have all sorts of notebooks somewhere that I can't find.
Sometimes one shows up when I don't need it...

Marking a target and nailing it to the wall seems best.  I never lose my wall altogether.
This one trying a homemade barrel..

[Marcruger]

I'd say first you have to be able to see the sights and target.   A "cheater" target like the poster paper one I make help me see the point of aim, as do reading glasses set for longrifle barrel length.  A peep sight is an even better "cheat".   :-) 

Second, you need to be able to shoot consistently from a bench.  Highpower rifle benchrest technique does not translate to muzzleloaders in my experience.  If you cannot shoot well and see enough, you will not have good, consistent groups and load development is wasted.  If you are flinching then you are wasting time in load development.

My goal for any barrel, gun and load is a cloverleaf at 50 yards.  That is my goal.  I may not always reach it, but that is what I am trying for. 

Do not move your sights until you are sure you have your tightest grouping load. 

Change ONE thing at the time, never two.  If you change more than one thing you won't know what caused the change. 

I start with a powder charge equal to the ball diameter.  In other words a .50 caliber starts with 50 grains of 2f.  I increase in increments of 5 grains.  Listen for the "boom" to change to "CRACK" and you are getting closer to the accuracy load.  Write down each load and group size.  When the group size starts enlarging again, you passed the accuracy load.  Go back.  Then go up or down in 2 grain increments and see what it tells you. 

I hope this helps a little.   

My cheater target example is below.  In the target with the one hole out of the rest, that was the first shot out of a cold, clean barrel.  I was testing to see where it hits versus fouled.  Pretty close!  I was happy with this group at 50 yards.  Top target is obviously three shots while developing loads, and I got rid of that adjustable rear sight later for a fixed blade.  The lower target is five shots, four in the group and the first shot out.  I love Green Mountain barrels.   :-)  I can see to shoot these targets, but these days there is no way I could see the front sight and a squirrel at the same time. 

God Bless, and Happy Happy Easter,    Marc

[J.M.Browning]

All my loads are dispensed by measured volume or weight - and dispensed in sealed loading tubes I do not even own a horn of any sort . I have one thing in mind always consistency is the only way to load work up everything has to be consistent changes are made at the bench not at my range . ACCURACY is a byproduct of consistency . This information is deemed reliable from someone hand loading for half a century !